Buyer using forwarder claims item not received b/c forwarder uses their own mail agent forwarder ?

[shootingstars5151]

I mailed something to a buyer based in Asia who used a US freight forwarder based in Oregon. That freight forwarder uses it's own agent forwarding mailing service to get their mail. I.E. The forwarder's mailing address is "123 AVE zipcode: 11111" and you ship it to that address. When it arrives at the local post office it gets delivered to an agent at "456 BLVD zipcode: 22222" and from there according to USPS they pick up their own mail and this is apart of their on file delivery instructions with the post office. I've confirmed this with the post office and have it in an email from them. From there because the zip codes are different they can claim item not received. Has anyone dealt with this before?

[stephenmorgan]

Have not heard of this but it sounds like it could be problematic.  

If the receiver of the item redirects the item to a different shipping location I would considered the item to be delivered.  Not sure how eBay would would view this.  

Did you actually get the redirected address from USPS Tracking?

[shootingstars5151]

Yes on the proof of delivery. The item was over $750 so it was signed for. But the zip code on the tracking shows a different zip code than what's on the label. Apparently they are a large freight forwarder and use a mail agent to accept/process their mail and then gives it to them at the address on the label but the tracking will stop/show delivered once it's with the agent. USPS says it's on file in their delivery instructions to forward all their mail to a different address but tracking doesn't show "forwarded" or "delivered to agent" just delivered to a different zip code.  When I inquired with USPS I was told they use a mailing agent themselves. 

[ittybitnot]

@shootingstars5151 

Well this is certainly a new "twist" in the Freight forwarder issue.   Has your buyer filed an eBay claim, or a Payment Dispute (aka chargeback) for this order? 

[reallynicestamps]

UNDELIVERABLE ITEMS

https://www.ebay.ca/help/policies/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy?...
 
This is the part I'm referring to
 
Exclusions and special coverage when the buyer doesn't receive an item


Items collected by a third party on behalf of the buyer
-Not covered


The buyer arranged their own shipping method, such as a courier pickup-
Not covered


The buyer provided an invalid or incorrect address at checkout
-Not covered

Tell the buyer to open an eBay Dispute.

Post the tracking which shows Delivery.

[shootingstars5151]

Payment dispute. This morning their account actually reads as "no longer a registered user". It looks like they opened the account last month, bought dozens of high value items and I'm guessing they kept filing fake INR  cases using this trick knowing USPS would deliver to the freight forwarder's agent without USPS saying it has been forwarded thus showing the wrong zip code on delivery.

[ittybitnot]

Payment dispute. This morning their account actually reads as "no longer a registered user"

@shootingstars5151 

The fact that the ID is already Naru'd  is good news in a sense.  Start making hard copies of everything.  Since it was an INR, make sure to respond with the tracking.  If there is no place on the form to upload the "signature" as well, you are going to have to contact eBay for that option since it is a requirement that it be included as well in the dispute (even though there never used to be a place to do so).  

Here are the requirements and the page on which they are found: 

When a buyer opens a payment dispute because they didn't receive the item or they don't recognize the transaction, sellers will be asked to provide:

Evidence of successful delivery to the address provided by the buyer at checkout, or
Proof that the buyer collected the item
If eBay determines that the item was successfully delivered or picked up:

We will not seek reimbursement from the seller for the disputed amount, even if the payment institution decides that the buyer is owed a refund; and
We will waive or refund the seller's dispute fee

Evidence of successful delivery

Tracking information from a shipping carrier that shows all of the following:

A delivery status of "delivered" (or equivalent in the country to which the item was delivered);
The date of delivery;
The recipient's address that matches the one found on the Order details page, including the city/county or zip code (or international equivalent); and
Proof of signature confirmation uploaded as an image while challenging the payment dispute, for orders with a total cost of $750 or more. Learn more about our signature confirmation requirements

Please note that since this is a Payment Dispute, eBay is likely going to make you wait (for a month or more) until the c.card company decides even if you are eligible for seller protection.  There have also been some issues of late, where eBay is apparently not providing the protections outlined in their own policies.  

Do not despair, however.  The basic issue is nothing new around here.  Points in your favor:  Freight forwarder, buyer is already Naru'd, and you have that signature.   You have any documentation about the "mail agent" picking up?  

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/payment-dispute-seller-protections?id=5293&st=12...

[coffeebean832]

Reach out to the forwarder the package was addressed to and see what you can get in writing from them re: receipt of the package and forwarding it on to the buyer. Some of the decent forwarders will help you because they don't want the bad reputation scammers are giving them. You can send it to eBay CS through FaceBook. I have no idea if it will help, but it sure isn't going to hurt the case.

[shootingstars5151]

Thank you all for the information and help. I have the email from USPS about the package going to an agent's facility. I'm going to try and get them to manually update tracking that it was forwarded or given to an agent. 

[katzrul15]

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@shootingstars5151 wrote:

Payment dispute. This morning their account actually reads as "no longer a registered user". It looks like they opened the account last month, bought dozens of high value items and I'm guessing they kept filing fake INR  cases using this trick knowing USPS would deliver to the freight forwarder's agent without USPS saying it has been forwarded thus showing the wrong zip code on delivery.

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The fact that they are NARU should help you elicit Seller Protection from e-Bay.

1.  Report your Buyer in the Transaction order view.  Outline that this order was shipped to a freight forwarder in Oregon and shows delivery.

2.  Once reported, then access e-bay on social media - message them (upper right hand message button) with the transaction number, claim/case number, delivery confirmation info and advise this was delivered to a freight forwarder and the buyer is now NARU.  

Do steps 1 & 2 today.  Good luck.  The CS on social media should be able to assist you, as they have myself and others before in these situations.  

https://www.facebook.com/eBayForBusiness

[ittybitnot]

Reach out to the forwarder the package was addressed to and see what you can get in writing from them re: receipt of the package and forwarding it on to the buyer.

@coffeebean832 

@shootingstars5151 

Good plan.  Even if you get confirmation over the phone that the item was actually received, AND sent on and they won't provide any written documentation...a name and contact info is good as well

It is important that you respond to this case through the form provided, and do not let the timeline run out.  The additional information you need to compile is for "plan B" in case you are initially thrown under the bus by eBay.  Also note, that the regular low tier customer service agents are very unlikely to provide any real assistance to you.   They "talk the talk" but don't "walk the walk" so to speak.  

[ittybitnot]

Items collected by a third party on behalf of the buyer Not covered

@reallynicestamps 

Excellent point, as well!   Thank you! 

[ittybitnot]

1.  Report your Buyer in the Transaction order view.  Outline that this order was shipped to a freight forwarder in Oregon and shows delivery.

@katzrul15 

Yes, of course.  I always forget the 'report the buyer' stuff!   

[coffeebean832]

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@ittybitnot wrote:

Items collected by a third party on behalf of the buyer Not covered

@reallynicestamps 

Excellent point, as well!   Thank you! 

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Excellent point for an MBG claim. Unfortunately, has no bearing on a payment dispute that I've seen. 😞

[ittybitnot]

Excellent point for an MBG claim

@coffeebean832 

Forgot this was a chargeback.   Thanks for pointing that out.   Having a "DUH" moment.