11-02-2022 07:30 AM
I have a buyer that bought a record from my store, all of my positive feedback claims how well-packaged my records are and how on-point the pictures and descriptions are but this buyer seems to disagree while adding curse words for some reason.
The original complaint was that the record wasn't packaged properly and (quote from the buyer) "I received it with every corner bent in." The pictures show the corners were already like that pre-shipping.
Some hours later the buyer opens a return request now claiming that the record is completely broken and cracked, they include pictures. The pictures do show a broken record, however, the label is green. The issue here is that the record I sold them has a dark grey label. The buyer is intentionally sending a picture of the wrong (broken) record in order to get the return approved.
This is clearly a scam and I am going to call eBay about this but would like to share this with the seller community if anyone has valuable feedback for me I would greatly appreciate it. I wish I could include pictures as proof/reference here.
11-02-2022 07:39 AM
If you don't want your account to be dinged (and to lose the money anyway), you have to respond to the return request, either by issuing a refund without requiring the return or by paying for a return shipping label and telling the buyer to return for refund.
If you don't do one of the above, the buyer will escalate and ebay will give a refund from your money.
If you receive a broken record back, you can then report the buyer.
11-02-2022 07:39 AM
Just playing devils advocate here......
The picture can show the man in the moon...it is irrelevant to the return process.....
this buyer obviously does not want the item...so, if you want to go with the odds, just accept the return and refund. Make sure you follow the return protocol to the letter.....
11-02-2022 07:42 AM
I would advise the buyer that they need to compare the photos of your item to the photo that they sent you showing a broken record and politely ask if they had multiple records that arrived and are confused about which seller they needed to initiate the return with. Give them a graceful "out"....but be sure to add to your BBL.
11-02-2022 07:47 AM
If they have filed an INAD, you have two options.
Refund and let them keep it.
Accept the return and pay return shipping.
If they do send back a different item, refund the buyer and report them for abusing the MBG.
If you get Ebay involved now, they'll refund the buyer from your account, let them keep the item and give you a defect.
11-02-2022 08:26 AM
You can always appeal after the case is closed.
11-02-2022 08:28 AM
heres the deal
nobody cares about any pictures but you
pictures prove nothing except for the fact thats what they sent you. wrong color or not
you need to say YES to the return and take it from there
if you want to get ebay involved then do it after the return
delay and denial will just get you a bad rap with ebay and lost money
the buyer is stringing you along ,please accept the return and get the item back
11-02-2022 08:44 AM - edited 11-02-2022 08:45 AM
Hi, if they opened a Not As Described case, calling eBay will not accomplish what you hope. Your options are very limited. There is no fighting a fraudulent return at this point. Your only play is to allow the return, refund, then appeal the case. Below is a link on how to appeal. You will have 30 days to do so, so get all your ducks in a row, and then send in a thorough claim.
Keep in mind that that these cases rarely end well for the seller who attempts to fight a return from a dissatisfied buyer unhappy with his item from the get-go. They will find a way around a No Return policy because eBay sets it up this way, always protecting the buyer’s interest in a dispute. This is true even if the buyer is attempting fraud. Sorry this happened to you.
12-28-2022 05:37 AM
I feel like people and ebay are use to dealing with billion dollar corporations and not small time sellers. Returning items being for fraud or whatever reason doesn't hurt a company such as Walmart but does impact a small time seller. I have been hit with 2 different returns just this month by people with single digit feedback. One person got the device, took it apart, removed a piece that he needed and then opened a return saying that it was defective. I sent a return label and luckily ebay allowed me to keep the money but they also refunded the buyer their money. I still got the money but it cost me more since I had to pay for shipping again.
I'm afraid on this second return the person is claiming that they received a defective control board but in reality they are going to send back their old control board and just keep the working board that they bought from me.
12-28-2022 07:04 AM
@bigdawgj14 wrote:Returning items being for fraud or whatever reason doesn't hurt a company such as Walmart but does impact a small time seller.
This isn't true. Walmart is hurt by fraudulent returns. People just don't care if they hurt a big business. Ebay sellers only get mad because they aren't usually big businesses but people treat them with the same callous disregard.
12-28-2022 07:29 AM
Fight it!
Buyer opened a case, so now you can respond within the case communication thread and point out all the false claims the buyer has made. Be very detailed, polite, and include the photos from the original listing and show the photos the buyer sent you. eBay can see and review the communication thread.
You might consider blocking them so they can't do anymore damage (retaliation) and maybe even report the buyer for false claims.
best wishes!
12-28-2022 07:37 AM
@djvp53 wrote:
@bigdawgj14 wrote:Returning items being for fraud or whatever reason doesn't hurt a company such as Walmart but does impact a small time seller.
This isn't true. Walmart is hurt by fraudulent returns. People just don't care if they hurt a big business. Ebay sellers only get mad because they aren't usually big businesses but people treat them with the same callous disregard.
Walmart revenues are certainly impacted and logistics cost money managing the returns back to distributors or selling off at loss to liquidators. Most of what is in Walmart or any other retail stores of any size for that matter are consigned product, even Walmart doesn't have enough money to buy everything they sell nor does Amazon or BestBuy or Dollar General.
Here eBay has no way to validate whether a buyer or seller is in a he said/she said ordeal and since the secondary risk assessment folks are no longer in the picture (PayPal) there is little option. If a customer performs a Chargeback the seller has no ability to represent direct to the aggregate card processor to defend the customers claim. AND! If sellers did, news for ya's, every communication is $25 as standard fair. So its like this, you sell something for $1, chargeback happens. Merchant account provider, aggregate processor and you're bank will all hit you with $25 each, $75 total. You respond to the chargeback that's another $25 processing fee each and everytime you go back and forth with the merchant account provider. Some providers will waive the fee here and there and often it depends on business size.
Banks, card processors, aggregate processors make money both coming and going no matter the circumstances, even in stolen cards/fraud they make money as its written off loss. People want judge/jury eBay on these processes but really it's not eBays fault. eBay is at a loss, more so than say Walmart as eBay relies on commissioned revenues.
There are solutions and one of the easiest solutions is display of statistics. Consumers able to see how many successful vs problematic transactions a seller has as a quick statistic displayed in all listings. On the other side the coin sellers able to see buyer statistic, how many order vs returns & chargebacks. Sellers can decide whether or not to accept a sale based on those statistics. This leaves the problem of how to manage new sellers or new buyers. eBay currently limits new sellers, hold funds etc. Ok, not optimal perhaps but its a mechanism. With buyers eBay allows sellers to limit purchasing via how many feedback ratings a buyer might have, that should be altered so using what I displayed above IMHO. That's the simple of it but most surely there are other obstacles need be discussed and it's a major change to way things work here... Unfortunately w/ major change it can result in either good or not so good results and thus risky for eBay to change these policies.
12-28-2022 08:53 AM
Accept the return, Refund when the item is delivered.
THEN.....If it's NOT your item, report the problem.
I have had eBay refund the buyer, and pay me for the item. HOWEVER, I don't feel like they will do this every time. Therefore, I don't worry about "report the problem" to small ticked items. Only something significant.
Which means, I don't ask eBay to step in very often.
I'll eat the little stuff in hopes that they will take care of me on the big stuff.
12-28-2022 10:07 AM
There's a lot in your post. I'm not aware that most of what Walmart sells is consigned products. I might believe that most of what Walmart has listed on their website is "consigned," although that isn't quite the right term for the third-party listings on their website. I'm also not sure how that is relevant. I believe that third-party sellers on Walmart.com don't generally use Walmart to house goods or fulfill orders. That is an arrangement, like Fulfillment by Amazon, that would be considered consignment.
eBay has no way to validate whether what the customer received was as described. But eBay can validate that the user agreed to the eBay terms and conditions, that the user selected and purchased the item (which, if it is like the seller's other items is described as not accepting returns), that the user agreed (pursuant to the eBay terms and conditions) to pay for the item, that the terms and conditions of the Money Back Guarantee give the user three days of receipt to lodge a claim with eBay that the item was not as described, and that the user did not lodge a claim that the item was not as described within those three days. Having done all they promised, eBay is entitled to their money and the seller is entitled to his or her portion of it.
As for the fee for communication about chargebacks, that's between eBay and its credit card processor. That's part of eBay's cost of doing business. They should eat it on a $12 chargeback and decide whether its worth it on a $50 chargeback. eBay's cost to defend their sellers against undeserved chargebacks should be on them. That is part of what we pay for when we list items.
Writing off a loss due to credit card fraud isn't a way to make money. This is one of those lunatic things that people who don't understand deductions say. The tax code is weird. Sometimes, in some industries, people can write off losses greater than their actual losses and thereby use tax losses to make real profits. Banks' losses on fraudulent use of the credit cards they issue is not one of those times.
Displaying statistics of buyers might help but only if individual eBay users are better at determining which users to exclude based on those statistics than eBay is. Honestly, eBay does an imperfect job of vetting users but there is no way to perfection. My hunch is that they do a better job excluding fraudulent accounts than I could likely do on my own because I would have only a tiny portion of their data and a tiny bit of their experience with frauds.
Many small sellers, if given the power, would just exclude buyers who had zero feedback. If eBay allowed that, there would be no new buyers to replace those who die off or have a bad experience with a seller and give up on eBay altogether. One seller who posts on this board just wants to redline buyers from certain places, which is probably illegal and is certainly a policy that when applied historically to housing led to lots of bad things, the ramifications of which we as a country are still struggling with. eBay needs a steady stream of new users for us to have people to sell to. eBay can't leave the ability of new buyers to purchase up to the whims of quirky sellers.
12-28-2022 01:30 PM
Have him send it back, refund to be issued after received and inspected.
Last year I sold a Clash double LP in the 30-something $ range. The buyer contacted me telling me that the LP arrived BROKEN in half, and sent a pic of a pair of broken records and the box folded in half. Okay, now at the same time I was selling off an extensive Beatles LP collection and I was listing the Matrix numbers and pressing plant info with them. As it happened, at that same time I was wrting down the matrix numbers of other LPs that I was selling as well. I didn't put the matrix numbers in the clash listing. BUT I replied to him to open a return, I'll send a label and as soon as I receive the record and check the matrix numbers I will issue refund same day. AND I INCLUDED THE MATRIX No's LOL. Never heard from him.