Buyer had item a month, now says it's fake and "highly illegal"...

[lymo_64]

I sold an older LV item that came from an estate sale recently. Before I listed it, I did a lot of research to at least make my own self comfortable that it wasn't an obvious counterfeit.  Had it been, I would have never listed it, that is NOT how I roll. I've found multiple sales of a the same and similar (different colors) here that go back months and all referenced that it was an "older" piece. I also saw a couple sold on outside sites that said the same. It had plenty of bids, too. 

Buyer has had item nearly 4 weeks now and has today decided that they *believe* it's not authentic and want to know how I can prove to them it is real. They flat out called it "highly illegal" to sell. While I agree with that notion, she doesn't even know that it is fake, she just wants me to prove that it is real. Shouldn't these concerns have been raised before now? Short of paying someone to authenticate it, that is simply not possible. I would only consider doing this if I had it back in my hands and in the condition I sent it (which was near perfect). 

For the record, I've offered a refund upon return, but I have a feeling she isn't really wanting that. I went back through her FB... she's left 4 negatives for "fakes" and used that "highly illegal" term there, too. I can't imagine why anyone one keep buying higher end items here if they got "ripped off" so much. I know I would not. 

I have an otherwise perfect record and there was zero intent to do anything wrong on my part. I will refund if I get it back, but I already have a bad feeling... and why did it take so long to decide that it wasn't authentic?! 

Any advice from the more seasoned vets here is greatly appreciated. Thanks!

[everything-from-trinkets-to-treasures]

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@albertabrightalberta wrote:

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@castlemagicmemories wrote:

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@a*river*runs*through*it wrote:

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Actually the OP sold a Counterfeit scarf. The buyer is correct in wanting a return. She is not a scammer in this particular instance.

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That word is so over used here, and that buyer may be thinking the same thing about this seller.  

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True and in this case, the fact that a fake WAS sold and the seller didn't verify authenticity prior to listing, the buyer would be correct in her assumption. 

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All those words are over used and too many times used incorrectly. All this is doing is teaching others how to pit buyers against sellers and that everyone is trying to do something to someone else. When people run into a problem and come here and read how everyone is a scammer or a fraud or a criminal or whatever, which in reality couldn't be further from the truth, then consider the mindset they take away from here or when have when they run into a problem with someone. Automatically they assume the other person is some sort of a criminal.
And then people wonder why buyers go straight to filing disputes and avoid contacting each other first and then leave horrible feedbacks when they could have been amicabley resolved in most cases.
The boards should be a place where people are taught how to resolve issues and work together to resolve issues...not how to attack each other or give the impression that everyone's trading partner is a criminal.
And all this goes out on the net too so it has far reaching impacts...that do come back and will effect someone in a very negative way.

[stmoore0]

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@everything-from-trinkets-to-treasures wrote:

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@a*river*runs*through*it wrote:

"So are we to assume you're an attorney?"

I think that's a stretch.

An attorney would know how to interpret the law. An attorney would not compare apples to oranges.  An attorney would look at the FACTS shown to them.

I'm thinking the poster is just a right fighter. Sadly the poster is also wrong and refuses to see  what is right in front of them.

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Well according to the postmaster, whom I double checked with today,  when I went to the PO...it is most definately illegal to mail not only counterfeits but it is illegal to mail anything that is illegal and or designated as illegal in this country ....if mailing internationally, if designated illegal here or any other country.
He also said there is nothing in the USPS regs online that state mailing anything illegal is allowed in any circumstances.

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your postmaster isn't a lawyer.

[emerald40]

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@lymo_64 wrote:

I sold an older LV item that came from an estate sale recently. Before I listed it, I did a lot of research to at least make my own self comfortable that it wasn't an obvious counterfeit.  Had it been, I would have never listed it, that is NOT how I roll. I've found multiple sales of a the same and similar (different colors) here that go back months and all referenced that it was an "older" piece. I also saw a couple sold on outside sites that said the same. It had plenty of bids, too. 

Buyer has had item nearly 4 weeks now and has today decided that they *believe* it's not authentic and want to know how I can prove to them it is real. They flat out called it "highly illegal" to sell. While I agree with that notion, she doesn't even know that it is fake, she just wants me to prove that it is real. Shouldn't these concerns have been raised before now? Short of paying someone to authenticate it, that is simply not possible. I would only consider doing this if I had it back in my hands and in the condition I sent it (which was near perfect). 

For the record, I've offered a refund upon return, but I have a feeling she isn't really wanting that. I went back through her FB... she's left 4 negatives for "fakes" and used that "highly illegal" term there, too. I can't imagine why anyone one keep buying higher end items here if they got "ripped off" so much. I know I would not. 

I have an otherwise perfect record and there was zero intent to do anything wrong on my part. I will refund if I get it back, but I already have a bad feeling... and why did it take so long to decide that it wasn't authentic?! 

Any advice from the more seasoned vets here is greatly appreciated. Thanks!

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[emerald40]

In the future be 100% positive before listing a brand named product.  Unless you are very familiar with that brand,  and have the skill set to know the real from the fake, a little research online is not enough.

Only list that which you have bought yourself from an authorized store and have all the paper work to prove it.  As far as having the bag authenticated that should be done before you list it not after you sell it.

A buyer should not have to prove anything.  It is up to you to offer the proof.

If it were me, I would accept the return and then have it authenticated so you will know proof positive if this situation comes up again.

[bonjourami]

Saying you spoke to the 'postmaster' sounds very official..what he really is is the station manager. And I can tell you from personal experience that my 'postmaster' has given me misinformation twice..so I dont put too much stock in what any 'postmaster' says.

[lunalapin1912]

It doesn't matter what the PM says, the fact is that fake goods are handled throught FEDERAL law, and federal law says you cannot KNOWINGLY transport fake goods.  

In the U.S., federal law protecting trademarks makes it illegal to knowingly traffic counterfeit goods, which includes the production, sale and transport of such goods. The U.S. Department of Justice, however, has stated that federal law doesn’t prohibit an individual from buying a counterfeit product for personal use, even if they do so knowingly.

The maximum penalty for first-time offenders trafficking in counterfeit goods is 10 years in prison and a $2 million fine. For second-time offenders, the penalty is 20 years and a $5 million fine. In addition, if a corporation traffics in counterfeit goods, it can be subject to a fine of $15 million.

[emerald40]

What happens when the scarf or purse is not fake, but the buyer either innocently or as a scam says it is.

Claims she cannot return it, but wants her money back.

Does anyone else see a problem when a buyer is not required to send that item back?

[bonjourami]

It is a myth that it is illegal to mail them. It is illegal to use the US mail to SELL AND TRANSPORT  them, it is not illegal to mail them. 

[bonjourami]

Absolutely right, Em!

[bonjourami]

And when a designer item is declared fake,and a snad claim is filed.. both Ebay and PP require that the fake item be returned to the seller before a refund.So obviously not a 'Federal' offense to return a fake item.

[albertabrightalberta]

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@lunalapin1912 wrote:

It doesn't matter what the PM says, the fact is that fake goods are handled throught FEDERAL law, and federal law says you cannot KNOWINGLY transport fake goods.  

In the U.S., federal law protecting trademarks makes it illegal to knowingly traffic counterfeit goods, which includes the production, sale and transport of such goods. The U.S. Department of Justice, however, has stated that federal law doesn’t prohibit an individual from buying a counterfeit product for personal use, even if they do so knowingly.

The maximum penalty for first-time offenders trafficking in counterfeit goods is 10 years in prison and a $2 million fine. For second-time offenders, the penalty is 20 years and a $5 million fine. In addition, if a corporation traffics in counterfeit goods, it can be subject to a fine of $15 million.

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LOL! A different ID isn't going to change the fact that you aren't getting it!

It's not "trafficking" when a buyer returns a fake to the original seller! 

[lunalapin1912]

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@bonjourami wrote:

It is a myth that it is illegal to mail them. It is illegal to use the US mail to SELL AND TRANSPORT  them, it is not illegal to mail them. 

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How can the item be delivered without being TRANSPORTED? 

[lunalapin1912]

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@albertabrightalberta wrote:

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@lunalapin1912 wrote:

It doesn't matter what the PM says, the fact is that fake goods are handled throught FEDERAL law, and federal law says you cannot KNOWINGLY transport fake goods.  

In the U.S., federal law protecting trademarks makes it illegal to knowingly traffic counterfeit goods, which includes the production, sale and transport of such goods. The U.S. Department of Justice, however, has stated that federal law doesn’t prohibit an individual from buying a counterfeit product for personal use, even if they do so knowingly.

The maximum penalty for first-time offenders trafficking in counterfeit goods is 10 years in prison and a $2 million fine. For second-time offenders, the penalty is 20 years and a $5 million fine. In addition, if a corporation traffics in counterfeit goods, it can be subject to a fine of $15 million.

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LOL! A different ID isn't going to change the fact that you aren't getting it!

It's not "trafficking" when a buyer returns a fake to the original seller! 

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Are you all right?  Have you had a bit too much of the holiday cheer?  LOL, this is my ID, I have no other.  

[creekcoyote]

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@emerald40 wrote:

What happens when the scarf or purse is not fake, but the buyer either innocently or as a scam says it is.

Claims she cannot return it, but wants her money back.

Does anyone else see a problem when a buyer is not required to send that item back?

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My question is why is everyone assuming that the scarf is a fake?   Just because the buyer said it was?   Are they an expert on LV?   If this item has not been proven fake, I cannot see how anyone could argue that the buyer should not be  returning it to the seller. 

It has neither been proven fake or real at this point,  so the argument about returning it in the mail is almost a moot point.   Buyers can claim anything they want to about an item.  Doesn't make it so. 

Did I miss a post in which this item has been proven fake?  Or is this just an assumption? Or the opinion of some posters here?

[bonjourami]

Because there are several LV experts on the Fashion board who deemed it fake..truthfully I agreed with them..an obvious fake. If you read the whole thread you will see their posts and how they determined that.