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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

Recently I have been reading through the forum quite a bit and found there are many people that experienced similar circumstances to what I did a while ago...

 

A buyer purchased an item from me (t shirt). I shipped it. They claimed that when they received it that it was torn open. They suggested it had been tampered with or stolen. They also said that the package was filled with large bubbles. I have never shipped a t-shirt with large bubbles. I ship all my t shirts in plastic ziplock bags to water-seal them against the elements. The buyer claiming there were bubbles inside made my spidey senses tingle. The buyer filed a claim. I called the actual USPS location that delivered the package. Spoke to a gentleman who assured me that if the package was delivered without the contents, they would mark it as such. He even went so far as to say "between you and me that package was delivered as you sent it." I also called ebay customer service while the case was open. They said there was nothing I could do until the buyer submitted more documentation/claim with USPS I would imagine.) I was told to be patient and that I could call back in a weeks time or so to check in on the case.

 

Throughout the process I was very diplomatic with the buyer and ebay. I was even reassured at one point by customer service that a decision would not be made without notifying me. That put me at ease. Then one morning out of the blue I received a notification on my phone stating that money had been moved from my paypal and that I had refunded a buyer. I called ebay, my call was elevated to "the highest authority on the matter," and I asked why they sided with the buyer without even consulting me first. I had the USPS employee's statement in my back pocket and I was hoping to debunk the claim with ebay once they notified me about next steps. However, after telling the woman on the phone about my conversation with USPS, she said that there was nothing more to be done and it is what it is. I asked what information was given that resulted in the case closing so abruptly. The representative said that she could not reveal why they sided with the buyer for the buyer's own protection. I was absolutely baffled. It made me wonder how serious a claim they made with me. And what level of authority they had involved.

 

The package was valuable, worth about $200. So this buyer definitely had motive to commit fraud in my opinion. Also, I went to the buyer's page, and they resell the very same item that they bought from me that they claimed they hadn't received. Coincidence? Doubt it. Regardless, I waited a while and called appeals to see if there was anything more I could do. I stated again to the appeals rep that I personally spoke on the phone with the local USPS facility and that an employee assured me that the package was delivered as sent. (Funny side note: I asked the USPS employee to put their statement in writing, they refused.) I was told again there was nothing they could do. And that if I wanted to, I could use the buyer's personal information in their ebay profile to file a report with the police. Has anyone done this and seen a positive result?

 

It's been a while since this situation happened, but as I said I started reading similar cases on the forum here and it got me thinking. My question is...how is it possible for the buyer to win this case when they provided no proof whatsoever? Yet I had confirmed delivery (with contents) and verbal USPS statement? Ebay has to know that there are people committing fraud, and I would bet a lot of these cases look and sound very similar.

 

Beyond the case itself, does anyone know if there is any way to prevent this type of fraudulent claim, period? I myself asked USPS about insurance and they said even if I had insurance in this scenario, that they delivered the package WITH the contents and that there was no evidence to dispute otherwise. And that insurance would not cover the time inbetween the package being delivered and the buyer opening it. So they wouldn't be liable regardless. So then what the heck is insurance for?

 

Hoping to figure out how to prevent this in the future if possible. Also hoping an ebay representative will see this and have some compassion. And perhaps shed some light on how to protect yourself / argue a better defense  as a seller (aside from blocking them).

Message 1 of 47
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46 REPLIES 46

Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

File a report with the USPS and a report with their local police department. Keep records of all the items included in that package. Screenshot their ads of their selling your items and report them to EBay.

Message 16 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

I now use an overhead camera system because of this. I just had a guy this week try and give me the old "I ordered two and theres only one nonsense"  I sent him still photos of the video showing two in his package.

 

No response back. 

Message 17 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?


@selecttech wrote:

I now use an overhead camera system because of this. I just had a guy this week try and give me the old "I ordered two and theres only one nonsense"  I sent him still photos of the video showing two in his package.

 

No response back. 


You can stop doing that.

Message 18 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

I have had the same thing happen to me twice so I started insuring anything over 15.00 that I send so if it happens again I can file a claim with the post office and so far they have stood behind everything.

Message 19 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

Really doesn't seem fair to force the PO to subsidize people who steal.
Message 20 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

I pay for signature confirmation on EVERYTHING I sell unless it's under $50. Takes care of *someone stole it off my porch*. You can put a note on your invoice saying "Please do not sign for this item if you feel your package has been tampered with". Any buyer that doesn't want to sign for an item is a buyer that won't be doing business with me. And yet I have 100% positive feedback with not a single INR claim. Aside from that there is NOTHING you can do. Take a video as you pack it? Ebay will say you can't prove that was the package the buyer received. In a he said/she said they WILL back the buyer 100%.

Message 21 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

"I have had the same thing happen to me twice so I started insuring anything over 15.00 that I send so if it happens again I can file a claim with the post office and so far they have stood behind everything"

 

 

How much does that insurance cost?

Message 22 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

I called the actual USPS location that delivered the package. Spoke to a gentleman who assured me that if the package was delivered without the contents, they would mark it as such. He even went so far as to say "between you and me that package was delivered as you sent it."

 

The gentleman is just making that up.  That is indeed how such parcels are supposed to be handled, but he has no idea whether or not that particular parcel was handled correctly.  I have received damaged parcels without any such markings from USPS, FedEx and UPS.

 

I myself asked USPS about insurance and they said even if I had insurance in this scenario, that they delivered the package WITH the contents and that there was no evidence to dispute otherwise.

 

More fiction.  USPS can fight any claim they wish, but their word of a proper delivery is no more valuable than the buyer's word that it arrived damaged and missing contents.  If the sender pressed the matter and the recipient signed a statement claiming it arrived with missing contents, the claim would be paid.

 

If the parcel was worth insuring, insurance may well have made this loss USPS's problem rather than yours - regardless of whether the contents were lost by USPS or stolen by the buyer.

Message 23 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

I agree but had to protect myself somehow and if it is happening within the post office then they are to blame.Now I have to pay even more to ship my items so it probably evens out in the long run.

Message 24 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?


@sam9876 wrote:

"I have had the same thing happen to me twice so I started insuring anything over 15.00 that I send so if it happens again I can file a claim with the post office and so far they have stood behind everything"

 

 

How much does that insurance cost?


If you are smart about it, it costs the same as you claim your shipping does.

Message 25 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

Because most of the time I ship first class and the most you can charge is for 12 ounces I do lose about 1.00 plus the cost of the envelope but I have the peace of mind of it not getting lost or stolen.

Message 26 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?


@laurabeardsley wrote:

Because most of the time I ship first class and the most you can charge is for 12 ounces I do lose about 1.00 plus the cost of the envelope but I have the peace of mind of it not getting lost or stolen.


Wait...you intentionally LOOSE more than a dollar on every sale?

 

Time to re-think your ROI

Message 27 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?


@laurabeardsley wrote:

Because most of the time I ship first class and the most you can charge is for 12 ounces I do lose about 1.00 plus the cost of the envelope but I have the peace of mind of it not getting lost or stolen.


USPS would have to lose at least 1 out of every 10 of your $15 packages to make insurance pay off.  That seems kinda pricey for just "peace of mind" money.

Message 28 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

A First Class package can weigh up to 15.99 ounces.

Message 29 of 47
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Buyer claimed they received empty package...Is there any way to protect against this situation?

The max. weight for a first class package is under 13 oz.

Message 30 of 47
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