Bogus Return Request

[hodachoke]

I have been a long time eBayer for years, but had not sold anything for over a year. I recently sold a pair of shoes to a buyer. Transaction happened very smoothly. Almost too smoothly. I had posted photos of the shoes, including the box and we agreed on a price. Never was asked any questions because I clearly had a photo of the box tag with the listing. I then shipped the shoes immediately. I received a message from the buyer after they were delivered, saying he thought the shoes might be fake because the box tag had Asian shoe sizes on it, along with English and some other countries shoe size, but they said it should only have English sizes on the tag. The manufacturer makes their shoes in Asia and I have purchased shoes from them before that some had Asian sizes mixed in and some did not. The buyer then sent me a photo of a box from the same company with Asian sizes on it, but said the lettering on my box was a little different. I could not tell the difference between the 2 photos. He then makes a return request. My experience in selling on eBay is that they almost always side with the buyer in a dispute regardless if they have any proof or not. I get that, but something was really weird with his messages and something is just not right. Besides changing his story a few times, how do I know if the buyer might be trying to scam me by shipping fakes back to me and also get their refund. I think I already know the responses I will get to this posting, but is there any way to protect myself from being scammed or do I just take a loss? I never deceived anyone in my listing and I believe the shoes are legit. The buyer never once mentioned the shoes being fake, only the box, until the very last message he sent. He said the soles were different, but I could not tell that in the photos. I would appreciate any feedback that might help my situation…sorry for the long message 🤷🏻‍♂️ 

[alcoforever]

Tell the buyer to return them for a full refund.   Send the buyer a prepaid return label.

You try to fight it, it won't end well for you.    Occasional returns are an integral part of mail order selling.

[chapeau-noir]

I suspect they don't fit but you don't take returns, so he has made up various excuses to ensure he can return them.  One big reason I went to 30-day returns years ago - this kind of thing. I'm certain you represented the shoes properly.  The fact that they're made in Vietnam means they're going to have a variety of sizes on the box as they roll outsourced product for many companies off the same assembly lines/factories and it ships world-wide - I've seen this kind of variability before, depending on what market they're shipping to.

But it doesn't matter - just take the shoes back - fighting this (i.e., having eBay 'step in') will result in your losing the shoes, the payment, everything.  It's pretty much a cinch that even if eBay sides with you, the buyer can run to the CC company and file a charge back.  It's what we sellers have to live with every day.

If you take the return you'll get your fees back, as well.

ETA:  Formatting problems. 

[gosimus]

@hodachoke 

< the buyer might be trying to scam me by shipping fakes back to me and also get their refund >  

There is always that possibility, of course.  Here's the first thing I thought of:  You sold the shoes for a best offer.  I wonder why the buyer would bother negotiating a lower price if s/he was planning a scam and knew he would get all the money back anyway. 

[sprinkles91]

if you have proof of authenticity of the shoes, such as a recept & barcode  then all you have to do is post that to the case & be there 'the second' the ask ebay to step in and help button appears after 4 days, then explain that the shoes are authentic, all shoes have multiple countries sizes stated on the tag that that is standard for shoes and shoe boxes(thats why this complaint sounded absolutely Ludacris to me!) then explain that you feel with how much the buyers story keeps changing & the nature of their complaint being about print on a box which consistently changes slightly varying printers, & the time at which they where made!(their box might be older, & manufacturers change their boxes regularly for no reason.

that they might be trying to return a counterfeit pair in place of the authentic ones you sent based on the photos. sounds like they dont like the fake ones they have, & are trying the classic "item doesnt seem authentic" scam. whatever you do, dont send them off to an authenticator! you' ll never get them back & thats a well known issue.  you dont have to take this lying down by any means, & claim buyers remorse. if they win their case, appeal. then take it to paypal if their still on about a sizing reference sticker on a box.

again, its normal for a size label on a box to state multiple different size in the us its usually US, AU, & EU euro size meaning "asian size" their on all shoe boxes! & their complaint is horrendous. show a few different shoe box size labels from dif. brands like nike, LV, puma, its literally a generic sticker.🤦🏻‍♀️

[farmalljr]

It may or may not be someone trying to steal the shoes. 

It could also be someone lying to get a "free" return. I offer 30 day returns (buyer pays) and every return is INAD, because the buyer will LIE to get a "free" return. I report every buyer that does, for return abuse. It's not like it makes a difference, but at least I feel better reporting liars and thieves. Hopefully some day eBay will actually DO something about the abuse and fraud. Not holding my breath though.

[sprinkles91]

additionally, it does sound pre meditated to me. ive been here for 16 years now & ive delt with more than enough eccentrics than you can shake a stick at.

sometimes buyers will purchase the real deal if they know they have a good enough knock off, & they might be mixing up the shoes. thats why you take detailed photos of whats going into the box etc. & state always that you have photographic proof & receipts first hand, thats usually enough to scare them off.

[sprinkles91]

---

@chapeau-noir wrote:

I suspect they don't fit but you don't take returns, so he has made up various excuses to ensure he can return them.  One big reason I went to 30-day returns years ago - this kind of thing. I'm certain you represented the shoes properly.  The fact that they're made in Vietnam means they're going to have a variety of sizes on the box as they roll outsourced product for many companies off the same assembly lines/factories and it ships world-wide - I've seen this kind of variability before, depending on what market they're shipping to.

But it doesn't matter - just take the shoes back - fighting this (i.e., having eBay 'step in') will result in your losing the shoes, the payment, everything.  It's pretty much a cinch that even if eBay sides with you, the buyer can run to the CC company and file a charge back.  It's what we sellers have to live with every day.

If you take the return you'll get your fees back, as well.

ETA:  Formatting problems. 

---

i actually agree with this one. i know what i said, but i forgot about the chargeback issue thats gotten wildly popular. maybe just make sure their the same pair once you get them back. i wish i had a better answer for you, my first instinct is to fight back bc i dont like feeling taken advantage of. its worked in the past! you can always do a charge back if the buyer wins their case tbh it works both ways.

[sprinkles91]

my most important question to this thats just 🚩🔥 is why does the buyer want an identical pair to the shoes they already have?...

[hodachoke]

The whole purpose was to get a ‘real’ pair of shoes. They don’t really care about the refund amount. By shipping back a ‘fake’ pair to me, they would be able to keep the ‘real’ pair I sold them and also get a refund, so the shoes are basically free to the buyer. I end up with no sale and cannot sell the shoes they returned because they are ‘fake’. 

[albertabrightalberta]

---

@sprinkles91 wrote:

if you have proof of authenticity of the shoes, such as a recept & barcode  then all you have to do is post that to the case & be there 'the second' the ask ebay to step in and help button appears after 4 days, then explain that the shoes are authentic,

---

NO!! This is really bad advice. @hodachoke You will lose the money and the sneakers and to add insult to injury, you'll also have a big ding on your account for requiring ebay to step in.

[hodachoke]

Thanks for your feedback. I had a receipt, but I just moved and cannot locate it. I have requested a duplicate receipt, but that is not a given. I am just worried that even if I had proof of authenticity, it would not matter to eBay and they would just cave to the buyer any way. Have you ever won a similar case in your favor?

[sprinkles91]

how on earth do you get a ding on your account for asking ebay to step in!? exactly. because ive never heard of being stricken for asking for ebay's help.

[hodachoke]

Why would I get a ‘big ding’ if eBay steps in? Don’t they act as a arbitrator in case when the 2 sides cannot come to an agreement. I feel I sold a valid product and because the buyer ‘says’ they are fake because of the box tag having multiple country sizes on it, specifically Chinese size, can’t I wait to hear back from eBay since I did send an message with my side of the story or that just doesn’t matter. No matter what the reason, the buyer should receive a refund, regardless if I lived up my end of the deal?

[sprinkles91]

honestly i was on the buying side & it was done to me, only i had a legitimate issue & the seller took advantage of me not having a camera at the time. photos speak a thousand words. but in all honestly you are safer just accepting the return, ebay can in fact do exactly what you are fearing & ive seen it happen a lot. youre safer just blocking them after the return is complete & moving on. if the shoes are fake when you get them back, thats a good reason for appeal & photos of your originals compared to what you get back. also a good paypal case! if ebay lets you down appealing. this could be a simple "free try on" issue. hopefully you dont get any trouble..ebay doesnt remove positive feedback btw, as long as youre not swearing or lude lol warn away💙✌🏻