Are "eBays" separate entities across countries?

[1971camaroguy]

I always thought "eBay" was "eBay"

Sold a $200 worth of items on eBay through GSP and had issues with the buyer. International Buyer claimed it wasn't as described and wanted to return it. I took plenty of pics and described it exactly as I had it. I apologized and told them it was working when I shipped it. Tested it and everything.

Buyer wanted a refund, I offered a partial refund and buyer wasn't having it. They wanted approximately $100 more than what I recieved to make them happy. When I said no they counter offered with $165 cash and they keep my merchandise.

I ask them to file a claim, and I got a email from eBay italy telling me to work out the situation with the buyer or they will reverse the funds and buyer keeps the items anyways. The email had to be translated through google translate as it was in italian.

I contacted my eBay CSR and although they were nice, I picked up on it right away they weren't really going to help me. I was concerned about the buyer scamming me, and keeping the items and the money.

I was told by the CSR to contact the buyer and ask for their paypal to send the funds to get the stuff back to me and I did.

I messaged the buyer and asked for paypal and if they can check on shipping rates so I could send them the money to get this back to me.

Buyer replied and said they were expecting a pre-paid label from me (which is pretty much impossible) and they would wait. The in the body of the reply it said exactly what I asked them for.

It said that the seller should contact the buyer and arrange for shipping and get their paypal. 

I contacted my eBay CSR and again asked what was I supposed to do now? The buyer wasn't going to work with me on getting a label and shipping back to me.

This was last friday, they told me to wait until monday and call back to work this out. I was told if the buyer doesn't send me their paypal and work with me on getting this back to me they would rule in my favor.

So I get up monday morning prepared to call eBay because I hadn't heard back from the buyer and I get a nice little email from eBay italy telling me the case was closed and I had 10 days to refund the buyer or it was coming out anyways. 

I called my eBay CSR rep again (monday) and asked what was I supposed to do now? I followed the rules, did what I was supposed to. Rather than saying since I followed the rules and they were going to "fix" it for me. They said they were sending eBay italy a request to re-open the case or reverse the decision.

Telling them I requested the buyer to send me a way to send compensation to get the merchandise back to me.

I get a nice email this morning from eBay italy telling me they decided not to re-open the case because they reviewed it again and said I never messaged the buyer asking for their paypal. They are treating it like I never had any contact with them??

I called my eBay CSR again and explained what eBay italy said and they looked at my messages and seen where I asked for the info and the buyer refused. So they are putting in a second request to review it again.

So this had me thinking, what's going on here? Why can the USA rep see there is obviously an issue and help fix it?

It's having to be deferred each time to italy.  

I have talked to four different reps in the last few weeks and gotten 5 different answers on this situation.

I am not sure what's going to happen, but I feel like I will get another email from eBay italy in the morning telling me that the case is still closed. And I will call the USA CSR again and ask what my options are again....it's beginning to feel like groundhog day.

I am all for refunding the buyer, I would just like to get my merchandise back if it's not as described. 

One thing I have learned through this whole ordeal, Global Shipping program is one way, if the buyer decides they don't want the merchandise and files a SNAD claim the seller has to pay to get the merchandise back.  

The only other option is to refund the buyer and they get to keep the merchandise, not cool on bigger ticket items. 

So for a casual seller that doesn't have these types of things built into their business model (like me), I wouldn't take a chance selling overseas.

I went back and changed the few auctions I have listed to domestic only..and still on the fence if I want to pull the merchandise and start using craiglist, facebook, and forums again to sell. 

It's become too risky now. 

[gramophone-georg]

This is just another way for eBay to lose their PAYING customer in a bureaucratic quagmire... everything's a "separate company". It's nonsense. If you listed your item on eBay.com, and it sold on eBay.com, then eBay.com is who you should be dealing with.

Unbelievable and inexcusable.

[1971camaroguy]

Yeah I agree, that's what I thought it was...but from dealing with eBay the last few weeks over the phone I am finding out that they have to communicate with the other CSR's across countries. They don't have the power to change anything...or at least that what I have been led to believe.

During the conversations it seems like our rules don't apply to their rules and they have to act as a middle person to facilitate me with the other countries.

One would think that any rep has the power to look at a case and decide or reverse an outcome based on their current policy. 

Which is weird, because even though I am having to jump through hoops, I still get the same treatment on the dashboard. It just says "eBay" has decided the outcome. not eBay italy, or eBay USA,.....just eBay

[earlyant-77]

Yep - it's the site that the buyer buys from that gets the case, not the site listed on.

Just one of the many reasons I don't - and won't - ship overseas anymore. From here, anyway.

[reallynicestamps · Accepted solution]

Are "eBays" separate entities across countries?

Yes and no.

EBay must work within the legal systems of the country they are in. Not US law.

Italy, I believe works with the Napoleonic Code, while the USA works with a version of British Common Law.

Sold a $200 worth of items on eBay through GSP...

Buyer claimed it wasn't as described...

You can demand that the buyer return the item for a full refund.

None of this partial refund stuff.

If it's good enough to keep, it's good enough to pay for.

Buyer replied and said they were expecting a pre-paid label from me (which is pretty much impossible)

Check out the shipper Shippo.  Here in Canada we can buy USPS return shipping labels through them. I am not sure if this is also possible for other postal services.

The rest, including trying to get his import fees back, is up to the buyer.

Tell the buyer that he must include a copy of the packing slip and the shipping label. (It doesn't have to be the original if he doesn't have it.)

You can also look at the Poste Italiane rates-- This was the best I could find:

http://www.francescoceccarelli.eu/Recensioni/shipping/shipping.htm

You want EMS service which is fast and tracked.

This seems to give the rates:

https://www.poste.it/risorse/postali/pdf/EMS_listino.pdf

Remember those measurements are metric.  If you can't read Italian try working it out with your high school Spanish or French. They are all Romance languages.  Or Google Translate.

It may even be possible to buy an EMS label -either directly or through Shippo.

It's a UPU service.  Which would solve the first part of the problem.

Your buyer is  a donkey's bonnet.

[1971camaroguy]

Thanks for the helpful tips, I was actually going to look into the shipping company's you suggested

But I just wanted to follow up on my situation, eBay finally came through.

The eBay italy CSR reviewed the case again and ruled back in my favor because the buyer was being difficult in facilitating a return, even with me offering to pay the shipping to get it back to me. So I won't be charged now.

This whole thing seemed sketchy from the beginning and I didn't want the buyer to get a freebie at my expense...it's not like we were talking about a $20 item here. It was a lot of tested and working hard drives, server motherboard, CPU, and Fan's.

I pulled most of my auctions, and on the fence if I am going to continue selling here. While it takes longer sometimes, I have better experiences on the forum groups. Especially since it's more personalized and I can talk one on one with the buyer.

This money back guarantee eBay offers makes it's extremely difficult for sellers when a buyer can claim anything they want to on the merchandise and either try and keep or return it.

I don't mind working with the buyer if there is a legitimate concern (and I have done that). But too often a simple change of heart turns into a "not as described" case.

And I also don't have to mark the prices up to compensate for additional fees on other sites. And the buyer get's a better deal with translates into a better experience.

But this jumping through hoops and trying to get eBay  to help with the issue is exhausting. I am glad it work out in the end, but I wished I never checked that GSP box to begin with.

[reallynicestamps]

The GSP is a Seller Protection.

But it is not complete protection.

You don't have to worry about the buyer claiming non-delivery while the item sits at the PO/customs waiting for him to pay import fees. He paid before you shipped.

You only pay for shipping to the KY plant. There your responsibility for delivery ends.

Damage in transit is handled by GPS, usually by refunding the buyer in full and letting him keep the damaged item.  You keep the payment.

It's only the Not As Described  that does not come under Damage in Transit, that would be your responsibility. 

So if you sold a blue sweater and sent a red sweater, you are responsible. If you sold a red sweater and it got wet in transit and shrank, the GSP is responsible. 

How much of your annual profit would  you have lost if you had to refund this buyer?  Remember you do not refund everythingh he paid, only your selling price and the shipping to KY.  He still pays import fees to the GSP since you never touched that.

Again I note that as a Canadian, I am required to despise the GSP (spit spit spit), but it does offer benefits to sellers who are nervous of shipping overseas.