Almost certain eBay is committing suicide

[mousefanatic2013]

Why do they automatically take the buyers word, without so much as investigating, and why does Hanover NJ appear to be a hotbed of scams, I sold a new ipad, seller wanted to return it because of hardships, I said no, eBay said yes, item was delivered to a fictional adress because seller changed the to/from, then charged me for $120 more than they paid me 

[stainlessenginecovers]

That last sentence makes NO sense. If you are the seller (since you start by stating 'the buyer'...then WHY are you 'changing' the 'to/from' which is complete nonsense since neither they Buyer nor the Seller can do that.

So, you REALLY need to 're-clarify' what you are saying...but,

You ACCEPTED returns on that item (within 14 days) so you do NOT get the say 'no' in the first place. 

[a_c_green]

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@stainlessenginecovers wrote:

That last sentence makes NO sense. If you are the seller (since you start by stating 'the buyer'...then WHY are you 'changing' the 'to/from' which is complete nonsense since neither they Buyer nor the Seller can do that. 

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Someone can probably write a PhD analysis on this, but basically people posting here seem to frequently write "seller" when they mean "buyer" and vice-versa, such as here.

Scam buyers can indeed change the return address on the package label, so that they can return a trinket to some other street address within the seller's City and ZIP. Tracking isn't specific enough to show the street address or where it was delivered, but as soon as it shows Delivered someplace within the correct City and ZIP, eBay will enforce a refund.

Scam buyers can simply buy their own return label with a different street address (such as a local fast-food place or other business within the seller's area) and mail a trinket (screen protector, ball point pen, whatever), anything to fill out the package.

OR also, last time I looked, eBay was still failing to add Write Protection in the form of an Owner password to the PDF labels they generate, which means that anyone with a PDF editor can simply modify the seller's address within the return label provided and seamlessly print it out with a bogus alternate street destination instead.

[fashunu4eeuh]

@mousefanatic2013 wrote:

”Why do they automatically take the buyers word, without so much as investigating…”

For a couple of reasons, if you can bear with me—

1) eBay doesn’t adhere to a Buyer Beware philosophy.  Instead, it is a deliberate choice to protect buyers’ interests first, to provide a stable environment for risk-free buying. Sellers are expected to bear all the risk.

I’d say this is primarily about stemming buyer attrition. eBay provides security to buyers to retain shopper traffic and sales.

2) eBay is now a global behemoth, automating its services to a great extent. With millions of active users and a billion plus listings, it would not be feasible for it to investigate and enforce every policy and procedure without bots. That said, live reviews have not been completely replaced by AI by any means.  eBay sellers have tools available to them to mitigate their risk in online selling, requiring a good deal of diligence.

Folks have been predicting eBay’s demise for years. But it is not likely to fold, given its vast reach. As long as there are buyers snd sellers, eBay will remain.

[chapeau-noir]

I suspect eBay needs buyers more than they need yet more sellers, so the playing field tilts in the buyers' favour.

[dogofwar777]

When I sold here I got lucky if a buyer went to ebay. Ebay knew they were full of it and ruled in my favor. In all the years I sold I never had ebay take any action against me. 

[mousefanatic2013]

I received a payout of $704, but they charged me $828 for the item 

[brightlightbookseller]

That's because with shipping and taxes, that's what the buyer paid.  They get made whole.  If you refuse to help your customer and eBay steps in, they don't refund your fees, so you're in the hole for the fees.  That was your biggest mistake here.  Never let it go to eBay's decision.

[fbusoni]

"Almost certain eBay is committing suicide"

Love these headlines which project what the author wishes. 

NB: Selling electronics on eBay is very risky.  And you can say that you do not accept returns but the reality is 180 degrees opposite.  The buyer is always right.  Just like on Amazon.

[mousefanatic2013]

eBay did reverse their decision and refunded my payment. 

[reallynicestamps]

I sold a new ipad, seller wanted to return it because of hardships, I said no,

If the buyer wants to return the item, say yes.

Heck, pay for the Return Shipping Label.

It's cheaper than not getting your iPad back at all.

If the buyer wants to cancel the sale, say yes.

Never try to force a buyer to complete the transaction.

It will be more expensive than allowing the return and refund.

Simple message. "I regret you are unhappy with your purchase. Please return it for refund."

Then you cancel on delivery as"buyer request" and get all your fees back.

It's business, not personal.

[a_c_green]

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@reallynicestamps wrote:

I sold a new ipad, seller wanted to return it because of hardships, I said no,

If the buyer wants to return the item, say yes.

Heck, pay for the Return Shipping Label.

It's cheaper than not getting your iPad back at all.

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That's all true, though in this case the modified label and redirected package show that the buyer never actually intended to return the iPad in the first place. He just needed the PDF return label so that he could change the address before shipping back a dummy package.

[vintagecraze50]

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@a_c_green wrote:

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@stainlessenginecovers wrote:

That last sentence makes NO sense. If you are the seller (since you start by stating 'the buyer'...then WHY are you 'changing' the 'to/from' which is complete nonsense since neither they Buyer nor the Seller can do that. 

---

Someone can probably write a PhD analysis on this, but basically people posting here seem to frequently write "seller" when they mean "buyer" and vice-versa, such as here.

Scam buyers can indeed change the return address on the package label, so that they can return a trinket to some other street address within the seller's City and ZIP. Tracking isn't specific enough to show the street address or where it was delivered, but as soon as it shows Delivered someplace within the correct City and ZIP, eBay will enforce a refund.

Scam buyers can simply buy their own return label with a different street address (such as a local fast-food place or other business within the seller's area) and mail a trinket (screen protector, ball point pen, whatever), anything to fill out the package.

OR also, last time I looked, eBay was still failing to add Write Protection in the form of an Owner password to the PDF labels they generate, which means that anyone with a PDF editor can simply modify the seller's address within the return label provided and seamlessly print it out with a bogus alternate street destination instead.

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Any scammer using this form of theft is risking USPS Mail Fraud charges. Sellers who are victim of this scam SIMPLY NEED TO GET THE GPS coordinates of where the package was delivered and submit this info to Ebay in an appeal clearly showing the package was shipped to another address. Seller should submit crime reports and USPS mail fraud report on buyers such as this.

[vintagecraze50]

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@a_c_green wrote:

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@reallynicestamps wrote:

I sold a new ipad, seller wanted to return it because of hardships, I said no,

If the buyer wants to return the item, say yes.

Heck, pay for the Return Shipping Label.

It's cheaper than not getting your iPad back at all.

---

That's all true, though in this case the modified label and redirected package show that the buyer never actually intended to return the iPad in the first place. He just needed the PDF return label so that he could change the address before shipping back a dummy package.

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Report the buyer to the USPS for Mail Fraud if they altered the label for return. USPS has GPS coordinates in their database and can without a doubt tell you where this package was dropped off and not YOUR seller return address. Altering labels by the USPS is a criminal offense on it’s own and with the intent of defrauding a seller of goods and money.

[vintagecraze50]

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@vintagecraze50 wrote:

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@a_c_green wrote:

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@stainlessenginecovers wrote:

That last sentence makes NO sense. If you are the seller (since you start by stating 'the buyer'...then WHY are you 'changing' the 'to/from' which is complete nonsense since neither they Buyer nor the Seller can do that. 

---

Someone can probably write a PhD analysis on this, but basically people posting here seem to frequently write "seller" when they mean "buyer" and vice-versa, such as here.

Scam buyers can indeed change the return address on the package label, so that they can return a trinket to some other street address within the seller's City and ZIP. Tracking isn't specific enough to show the street address or where it was delivered, but as soon as it shows Delivered someplace within the correct City and ZIP, eBay will enforce a refund.

Scam buyers can simply buy their own return label with a different street address (such as a local fast-food place or other business within the seller's area) and mail a trinket (screen protector, ball point pen, whatever), anything to fill out the package.

OR also, last time I looked, eBay was still failing to add Write Protection in the form of an Owner password to the PDF labels they generate, which means that anyone with a PDF editor can simply modify the seller's address within the return label provided and seamlessly print it out with a bogus alternate street destination instead.

---

Any scammer using this form of theft is risking USPS Mail Fraud charges. Sellers who are victim of this scam SIMPLY NEED TO GET THE GPS coordinates of where the package was delivered and submit this info to Ebay in an appeal clearly showing the package was shipped to another address. Seller should submit crime reports and USPS mail fraud report on buyers such as this.

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Had a few  INR cases where I called the postmaster at the destination facility and they looked up the GPS coordinates of where the package was dropped off. Sure enough package was delivered to recipients address and buyer backed off on their claim.