2nd case opened on one item.

[shopkiger2]

A buyer contacted me about receiving an empty package and opened a case for a refund. The buyer sent photos which showed the item was ripped open and was empty. I contacted ebay about it and they closed the case in my favor since tracking confirmed that the item was delivered.

Now the buyer has opened a return request claiming the item is "defective or not working".  Now what happens since ebay did close the case in my favor?

[equid0x]

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@fern*wood wrote:

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@shopkiger2 wrote:
I've been there done that. I've ordered items I never received AND had packages delivered that were never found. Not once did I contact the seller with an attitude or even contact them at all UNLESS there was no tracking.
How can a seller be responsible for making sure your package does not get stolen or damaged during delivery? We can't hand deliver these items personally. Unfortunately it's the risk of buying online.

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Ebay has the Money Back Guarantee on every listing that we must abide by.  That means either the buyer gets the item in as described condition, or they get their money back.  So that puts the burden on the seller to cover the item until it arrives.  We may not transport and deliver, but ebay holds us responsible in order to sell here.   We have the option to purchase insurance if we wish, but we are responsible.

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MBG means seller is always at fault. That's it. 

[equid0x]

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@zktalkj_0 wrote:

Please tell me this whole ordeal isn't over some $10 or $20 or less item.

Please tell me it's worth like at least $50 or $100 or more.

Because I see the posts about sellers abusing buyers, he said she said, fact is we really don't know whether the buyer did in fact get an empty package but I dare say the chances are good that the buyer did in fact receive a torn open package with the contents missing.

And yes the buyer could be lying, but here's the thing...

How much time and effort has gone into this thread (and the one before) so far?

Do you believe the cost of the item is worth just that time at even minimum wage?

Not even talking about the effort, just the hours we've spent on this already, is it worth the cost of the item?

So hear me again when I say, I would've done issued a refund a long, long time ago.

No CS, no police reports, no IC3, no page after page bickering back-and-forth in this forum, none of it.

Right or wrong I just don't care, no FBI, no cameras at the post office, not even going to tell my neighbors.

Refund and done.

Because sometimes it really is just the easiest way to get it done.

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DING DING DING

Although, I would file reports because at least in my jurisdiction, this requires minimal effort. Then, you'll have a paper trail.

But for $30... on eBay you probably only made like $5. So..... yeah.... file refund move on.... I think you're wasting your time. 

[equid0x]

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@calntom wrote:

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@zktalkj_0 wrote:

Please tell me this whole ordeal isn't over some $10 or $20 or less item.

Please tell me it's worth like at least $50 or $100 or more.

Because I see the posts about sellers abusing buyers, he said she said, fact is we really don't know whether the buyer did in fact get an empty package but I dare say the chances are good that the buyer did in fact receive a torn open package with the contents missing.

And yes the buyer could be lying, but here's the thing...

How much time and effort has gone into this thread (and the one before) so far?

Do you believe the cost of the item is worth just that time at even minimum wage?

Not even talking about the effort, just the hours we've spent on this already, is it worth the cost of the item?

So hear me again when I say, I would've done issued a refund a long, long time ago.

No CS, no police reports, no IC3, no page after page bickering back-and-forth in this forum, none of it.

Right or wrong I just don't care, no FBI, no cameras at the post office, not even going to tell my neighbors.

Refund and done.

Because sometimes it really is just the easiest way to get it done.

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With this buyer never responding the seller's original messages points to the buyer as being suspect.

One of the deals with these cases is if this buyer is gaming the system,  they need to be on eBay' s radar.  EBay will not do these courtesy refunds continuously.  If these buyers get continuous refunds from sellers, they just go from one seller to the next.

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I agree with you on failure to respond but there is only so much the seller can do. At some point you're reaching diminishing returns. File the paperwork and move on. There is nothing else to do here. 

You're not going to get the FBI to open an investigation for $30... eBay won't give a **bleep**...

[moo*cow*corner]

Just tagging in on the most recent post--

To me, this reads like there might be some things behind the scenes that ebay sees fit to look at a bit more closely and a bit differently than the usual automated processes and typical CS procedures.

For those insisting things will work out a certain way that we're all used to-- We have long asked for humans to look at things instead of bots. Why complain that for once, it's actually happening?

My opinion only, your mileage may vary...

[this*old*attic]

Buyers don’t get courtesy refunds - sellers do.

Buyers have the MPG.

While I do believe both parties have a chance of coming through this in one piece, there is not one thing said about CS that makes any sense.

The description is completely contrary to all the policies and would violate the buyer’s privacy, not to mention we hear scads of stories where CS is wrong and actions they take are later reversed and put back against the seller.

Given how doubtful or dismayed posts have literally been skipped over and board extremists high-fived, one must question whether CS is being understood correctly.

I just hope the situation works out for the best.

[this*old*attic]

Too funny. Based on?

[greg5000]

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@this*old*attic wrote:

They aren’t the person who bought the service - seller needs to file.

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Both parties can file a case with USPS.  As a buyer I've had to file a few cases with USPS for damaged eBay shipments.  In some cases this is just to help the seller get a refund of shipping costs or the item (if insurance was added).  In one case USPS refunded me directly (a portion of the value of the item - collectable stamps, where some were damaged by rain).

When buyers and sellers work together, things usually work out better.

[kh-leslie]

Hello everyone,

This thread is getting a bit heated.  Please remember that it’s fine to disagree with others, but discussion should always remain courteous and respectful.

Thank you for your cooperation.

[this*old*attic]

Definitely agree.

The seller is the one who designates where insurance refunds go, though, right? I had to do that when snack plates I sold didn’t weather the trip, although that was over 10 years ago. I suppose things could have changed.

In the same timeframe, my post office let me fill out papers and show a busted shipment I’d received, but then forwarded it to the seller for completion.

[greg5000]

@fern*wood  wrote:

If a buyer truly receives an empty package, the correct case to file is not as described.  So the wrong case was filed to begin with, which is why a second one does make sense in this situation.  It is intuitive to file INR, but anyone that knows how the system works knows that tracking is the only requirement to win that.  It would not address the lack of contents, nor prove dishonesty to then open the correct case.

I have no idea if the buyer in this post is honest or not, but I'm trying to explain why this sequence of events isn't proof, since it can happen. 

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If a package was received empty, with no evidence it was tampered with and fully sealed, as a Buyer I would report the Seller to eBay and let them advise how to file.

In this case, the package was clearly tampered with (large hole torn in the package), so this is not a case to file with eBay, but a case to file with USPS.  The Buyer should work with the Seller to resolve this.   If there is further evidence that the Buyer is not telling the truth, then that's a case to report to the police.

[greg5000]

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@vintagecraze50 wrote:

The buyer IS responsibility for having their packages delivered to a secure receptacle. This is not always the case with a lot of people. They do not have secure places to have their mail delivered. For those folks a P.O. Box would work well. For the reasons of porch theft and other problems like this use signature tracking on packages it helps a lot and reduces porch theft and receptacle problems. Sellers are not responsible when a buyer does not have a secure place for mail delivery.

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Yes, I agree with you.

[dare-2046]

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@this*old*attic wrote:

Buyers don’t get courtesy refunds - sellers do.

Buyers have the MPG.

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[this*old*attic]

That matches MY refund notice when a tantrum-y buyer did a sloppy return that damaged the item.

In the end, I guess they’re all courtesy refunds. Warm fuzzies all around.

What was your claim reason?

[greg5000]

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@this*old*attic wrote:

Definitely agree.

The seller is the one who designates where insurance refunds go, though, right? I had to do that when snack plates I sold didn’t weather the trip, although that was over 10 years ago. I suppose things could have changed.

In the same timeframe, my post office let me fill out papers and show a busted shipment I’d received, but then forwarded it to the seller for completion.

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Yes, if you paid for insurance then you (the seller), would receive the insurance payout if you had to file a claim.

[mam98031]

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@equid0x wrote:

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@shopkiger2 wrote:

A buyer contacted me about receiving an empty package and opened a case for a refund. The buyer sent photos which showed the item was ripped open and was empty. I contacted ebay about it and they closed the case in my favor since tracking confirmed that the item was delivered.

Now the buyer has opened a return request claiming the item is "defective or not working".  Now what happens since ebay did close the case in my favor?

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By the rules... buyer should not be able to open a second case.

Personally, I have had items delivered to me where the package was clearly ripped open already. I would not assume the buyer is lying. 

Return should get closed since  there is no item to return. I would call in.

If you sell in volume... maybe easier to just eat it. I don't have a lot of time on my hands... do you?

If buyer can provide pics of the package... absolutely open a case with USPS if thats how it was sent. 

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@equid0x 

In certain situations a buyer can open a second case.

If the first one was an INR and then it is received by the buyer, then the INR closes and all is well.  But after the buyer has the item and takes a look at it or if the package was damaged, they are allowed to file a SNAD, which they should be able to do that.  An INR does not or will not prevent the opening of a return request.

The OP has talked with Ebay and Ebay is working on it as they have outlined in previous posts.