Vintage Tapestry

[kathernmarie3392]

Does anybody have knowledge of vintage tapestry?  This has been passed down the line since the 1800s.  It measured 19 by 19 inches of just the image.  Including the frame it is 22 by 22.

[melda58]

Are you saying this picture in the photo is tapestry? On my screen it looks like a print. The photo is dark and unclear so it's really hard to see what you have.

Rita

[bnbsellingtime]

It looks machine made to me but you need to post close up macro pis of the weave from the back so someone who knows more then I can tell you. If it is machine made it is not that old.

[sonomabarn67]

I could see this being an 1890's machine loomed tapestry. There are sections that look to be how shadows are portrayed with a machined loom. The picture is dreadful; can you (OP) use more light and sharpness and closeups? Without looking I would think there are many listed on ebay.

[maxine*j]

Wharever it is, do you think those are the original colors or is it badly faded?  Or do you think it's just the poor photo?  

Oh, well, probaby a post-and-poof, anyhow.     

[sonomabarn67]

Oh no, badly faded.

[sonomabarn67]

Adding to that, the reds, oranges, yellows go first, then the blues, violets & greens, leaving a beautiful range of muddy browns, tans and... 🙂 . On hand woven tapestries I always look at the back first to see how faded they are.

[maxine*j]

I see.  Same pattern of fugitive colors as in things printed on paper, photo offset and the like.  Do the tapestries fade regardless of their exposure to light?  I mean, do these tapestries still fade over time even if protected from light, especially from sunlight and flueorescent light?

[sonomabarn67]

Animal fibers like wool and silk are usually sturdier than plant fibers (linen, cotton) but there is a science involved which I do not know. Fading probably starts not too long after the dyes are set & dried & used if exposed to sunlight. I'm sure the choice of mordant (again science) fits in there . Also, washing takes it's toll.

Sometimes if you pull apart a framed textile and look at the 1/8" of it hidden by the lip of the frame or on the back, you'll see close to original colors (hidden from sunlight). So, keep all your antique fabric possesions in lightproof wrapping and never use them or look at them and you'll be fine.

[maxine*j]

Thanks.  I was curious if the machine-made tapestries of this era were especially prone to fading.  I assume they were sort of "mass market" items, for the growing middle class.

And not only should you pack your old textiles away in tissue paper and shove them to the back of the closet, remember not to use the good china which might chip, or the crystal which could crack, or the silver which will tarnish, and for heaven's sake don't actually put your feet on that antique footstool!  

[sonomabarn67]

The cheap machine loomed creations are usually cotton, right? So, quick faders unless kept from light. I think though to get a better answer you might look at the Smithsonian's conservation pages. After studying their paper conservation videos I've successfully cleaned a number of

"junk" prints and now I'm onto the better stuff. Took me a few years though. They must have similar videos for fabrics.

[sonomabarn67]

Here are a number of related textile videos I was referring to. There may be one in there that relates to the tapestry on this thread. No pun intended.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbTHlOXCcEY

[maxine*j]

Thanks!  I watched a couple of the videos.  Informative and entertaining, both.   But my eyes are gritty and I'm going to hop into the wooden shoe with Wynken, Blynken, and Nod.

[pixzee]

Yes it looks like a jacquard loomed piece. This type of tapestry was often made in very drab colors to imitate the real and quite faded 300 year old tapestries. The nostalgic image does suggest the 1890s, but I would say it was more of a 'nod' to Victorian style and might have appealed to a 1920s housewife who remember seeing a print like that hanging in her grandmother's house.

The heavy handed nostalgia and somewhat colonial motif suggests 1920s to me over 1890s, as I would expect the cat to take center stage and the grandma to be relegated to sitting near the fire in the 1890s rather than the other way around.

maxine*j, as far as fading goes, that is determined by a number of factors. Light we know is a major factor, but some dyes will simply 'evaporate' over time, if you will. Also the environment, things like heating and cooling (attic) moisture (basement) can effect the fibers and destabilize the dyes. A wood, or acidic backing can also affect the dye, and even change (burn) it's color.

As far as the 1920s tapestries go, if you've seen them in the original sears catalog, you will realize that most haven't faded very much from the original.

Museum cleaning would involve building a flat bath (2x4s and plastic) and soaking in distilled water. gently swish, squish without agitation or twisting fibers. Rinse. Period. Dusty dirty pieces you could dissolve baking powder in the water and rinse. With an old jacquard loomed piece like this if it needed cleaning, I would wash/rinse in the bath tub, no wringing, and lay flat out of sunlight (garage, basement) to dry, turning a couple times a day. If there was serious cigarette smoke or grease kitchen stains, I would use amonia rather than baking soda.

[kathernmarie3392]

This will not allow me to upload additonal photos.  It is a JPEG but is saying that a JPEG is not an acceptable file.  It is the same way that I originally uploaded.  What would a piece like this value at?