Display and conservation

[cpe1991]

I have only a small, but fast growing, collection and am wondering how to display it. There is a dilemma of leaving the sets on view and preserving colour against bleaching by light and exposure to air. In general, I am happy, and indeed want, to have my prize objects looking their age. If they are faded, it is testimony to their being over a 100 years old. So, if a set has been well used and is faded, it doesn’t do any harm to leave it out in the light, and the fading or browning adds to its charm. But, a couple of my ivory sets have spent the last 150 years secure in their boxes so the ivory is a fine white or a deep uniform red. I think I would prefer to leave them covered up and protected against light and oxidation. What do other collectors do? Alan

[dancing_with_volves]

Alan D., you got my imagination going... I see a carboard box, previously used to house a TV set, filled with different chess pieces, Merrifield, Jaques, Lyons, Vizgapatam and so forth, all together. But there are sets which seem to require a whole room for themselves - Jon's Zimmermann set is one of them in my opinion.

[lichess]

When sets get to crowded on a shelf you can try displaying 6 pieces of each side up front, and put the rest in the back of the shelf. Of course this only works when knight, bishop and rook are the same and all pawns are the same. Floyd Lichess@aol.com

[chessspy]

Hi, Floyd,and Kriku I can't risk putting this on line if I can find it i'll try to send it to you, privately. Regards Alan D.

[gevork6]

To pick up on Kriku's comments: Jon's Zimmermann is an absolute killer....I am so glad he finally got it.....I envision a secret room in his basement crisscrossed by numerous beams of red laser light at the center of which stands the glorious Zimmermann housed in hermetically sealed bullet proof glass case.......... That set is going to be a star at some future auction....it may prove to be a record breaker......

[noybear]

My take on display and acquisition is slightly different than most, I suspect. At some foreseeable time I will need to move to a smaller residence. After all, there are only me, myself and I living here now. Just speaking for myself, sets or pieces that I cannot regularly see and enjoy don't have much of a place in my life. In other words, I am not really interested in having sets that remain in boxes hidden in closets. To resolve this, I will share one of my greatest display tricks. I use clear acrylic (plastic, if you will?) cases designed and sized for diecast model cars. I have divided off the bases into 32 squares and can place all 32 pieces from 2 opposing armies. To add to this, when placing the pieces, I add a strip of clear double-stick tape and place the figures. This offers some additional stability when handling these cases. An added feature is that these cases can be stacked one upon the other and the ones that I use are very solid and stable up to 10 units tall of the same size. A wall space 8 feet wide by 6 feet tall by 9 inches deep accomodates 74 sets currently. Very compact as far as I am concerned. The only drawback is that the tallest piece can only be 6 and 1/4 inches tall. There are a few sets that will not fit into these cases due to larger bases , height or otherwise, but it is surprising how well this approach works. To change appearances, I merely reverse the front and back and I have new perspectives of lights and darks. I have chosen to place "royalty" pieces to the center and place pawns to the outsides. This results in a "mirror" layout letting me choose which side faces front and also to switch fronts and backs as my moods change. For a time I can enjoy Napoleon with his troops and change to enjoy Wellington and his army by simply reversing the front and rear. These cases can be found by various sellers on eBay as well as many larger toy or hobby stores.

[dancing_with_volves]

Hello Clayton Could you make some pictures of The Wall?

[knight_knight_zzz]

Well, it seems like a bit of time has elapsed since this particular topic has been visited or discussed....

Interesting past history here...

Well, let me get to the point.... or maybe after a few sentences here...

First of all, can all of you tell by my slightly increased input here that winter is fast approaching the northern lands of the USA? (God help you all...!) 😉 I feel cabin fever even before Thanksgiving and Christmas!

Secondly, is anyone else on these threads having at teast some slight difficulty in finding a particular and specific topic which they want to revisit? I just spent quite a few minutes doing a search on various main thread catagories, using merely the words "humidity" and "relative humidity", and came up with zilch!. Then finally, using the words "ivory" and "humidity", I somehow arrived at this thread. Thank goodness! I thought I was going to be searching until Spring when the Siberian thaw occurs in this region of the USA...!

Well, I digress once again.... so, what's new?

Well, I'd like to call all climatologists, scientists, biologists, meteorologists, chemists, etc. - out there, in the cold cruel world - to enter this discussion once again.

Heck, even the folks in that other smaller and selective group might want to join in this tiny discussion right here.... You know... you guys who (I think) are among the "upper crust" of chess collectors.... the ones with the dough and bread.... (Gotta love the puns it, right?) Hey.... I am just feelin' a little more cheeky than usually on this brisk Saturday Morning...

So, what I would like to know what the difference is between "humidity" and "relative humidity". (yeah, I know... I know.... "...it's all relative..."... and it has something to do with the temperature, relatively speaking...)

But I'd really like to get the info from the horse's mouth, sortaspeak... It tends to be all "Greek to me". I think I could understand if someone were able to say it in simple American English... sortaspeak...

I have two hygrometers (digitial humidity gauges, which also show temperature.) Placing them side by side, they are within about 1 % humdity of each others. That holds true for the temperature too.

I now have - not only some ivory chess sets to worry about - but also - as some of you know - a baby grand piano to fret over....

I hear that the humidity (relative humidity.... "R.H." should be between 40-60 %, inclduing winter.... but that in winter, to expect a more reasonably hoped-for % of about 30 - 50 %. I may need to use a humidifier, but I will be careful about that because i do not want to create an adverse situation with too muich huimidity and mildew, mold growth, etc...

Ok.... your turn...! 

Thanks!

John of Vermont  

[d-baron]

noybear, I am very interested in your idea of using the diecast car display cases.  Which scale size cases do you use?

sorry John, I know nothing about humidity except that we have relatively low humidity out here.  It's also going to about 7 degrees cooler today than the average temperature for this time of the year.  The high today is 'only' going to be about 50 degrees.  neider neider neider

I am willing, however, out of the goodness of my heart, to have you send me your chess sets to keep preserved for you with our kind temperatures and humidity.  (I wouldn't do this for just any chess collector, you know.  Well - maybe I would.)

[noybear]

Baron,

I use 3 different sizes that this company has available, for 1/24th and 1/18th scales.

The product numbers are: 094C, 355C and 576C by Pioneer Plastics. http://www.pioneerplastics.com/display-cases/

Unfortunately, I am inept at uploading to Picasa and other sites but I would be happy to send pictures to a direct email to anyone that asks. My one wall currently holds 97 sets with space for 5 additional small, 1 medium and 1 large case to approximately level off all columns. This is on a single 10 foot long wall. The supporting shelf sits 18 inches off the floor, protrudes out a mere 8 inches and the top of the tallest column is 80 inches off the floor. I did not go to the floor because of unevenness of the carpeting and trying to bend down or get on all fours to view what is so low nor did I go any higher because all I could see would be base felts unless I looked from several yards away.

I also am unorthodox in that I use Scotch double stick tape in strips on the base of each unit and place the pieces on to this. It provides just enough holding power to keep pieces in place during moving them into place but also is enough so that I can unstack to retrieve a particular set and place everyone back or rearrange what is in which column with next to no effort.

A friend calculated that for the 242 sets in cases, I spent something less than $1,500 and I defy anyone to display more for less out of dust and so forth. I chose these after looking into several others that are available on the market because of the stacking ability and they are very solid placed into such columns. The additional beauty of my doing sets in this way is the small "footprint" of lost floor space in any room compared to even bookcases and of course curio cabinets are even worse.

To fairly represent this idea, I do have a few that the cases cannot be used with such as the FM Chess Set of the Gods (1/4" too tall) or my Nigri "Louis XIVth" because of the base widths so I do have a cabinet for my few "oversize" sets but there are only 9 of these to date.

The last advantage to this system is that each set of pieces is as dustproof as humanly possible in that the top for each is a friction fit that fingernails (I don't have any) or a letter opener or similar is needed to get them to release from each base.

I will be glad to send pictures directly to anyone that requests them, as I said. If I can be of any further help, you can post within the group or write me directly at: noybear@hotmail.com

Clay Neubert

[d-baron]

Thanks for the info, noybear.  I also collect diecast cars so am somewhat familiar with the plastic cases but have never thought of using them for chess sets.  I would love to see some pictures to see how they worked out.  My email address is duncanpohl@sbcglobal.net.  Thanks.

[knight_knight_zzz]

Ok, all.

Let me try to - at least for now, get back to my question I made on November 19th. (Persistent little bugger, I am, eh?) And let me try to be a tad shorter and more direct. So, here, I narrow down my discussion...

So, what I would like to know what the difference is between "humidity" and "relative humidity". (yeah, I know... I know.... "...it's all relative..."... and it has something to do with the temperature, relatively speaking...)

I have two hygrometers (digital humidity gauges, which also show temperature.) Placing them side by side, they are within about 1 % humidity of each others. That holds true for the temperature too.

I now have - not only some ivory chess sets to worry about - but also - as some of you know - a baby grand piano to fret over....

I hear that the humidity (relative humidity.... "R.H." should be between 40-60 %, including winter.... but that in winter, to expect a more reasonably hoped-for % of about 30 - 50 %. I may need to use a humidifier, but I will be careful about that because I do not want to create an adverse situation with too much humidity and mildew, mold growth, etc...

Basically, what I am wondering about is: A.) is a device, which gives/shows digital "Humidity" reading/number, actually mean "Relative Humidity"? If so, then fine. I would be aiming for about 50% for my ivory sets as well as my piano. If not, then what do I do to determine what it means? (How should I assess the number?)   

Ok.... your turn...!

John, Vt. PS: If I don't hear any response to this one-sided discussion, I just may have to narrow down my posting to a mere one liner! Heaven forbid! 😉 

[d-baron]

John, Vt. PS: If I don't hear any response to this one-sided discussion, I just may have to narrow down my posting to a mere one liner! Heaven forbid!

...biting my tongue...

...biting my tongue...

...biting my tongue........

Actually, John, I wish I knew the answer to your question, it's a good one.  But someone should know, then we'll both/all know the answer.

[corptaxman]

"Relative humidity is a term used to describe the amount of water vapor in a mixture of air and water vapor. It is defined as the partial pressure of water vapor in the air-water mixture, given as a percentage of the saturated vapor pressure under those conditions. The relative humidity of air thus changes not only with respect to the absolute humidity (moisture content) but also temperature and pressure, upon which the saturated vapor pressure depends. Relative humidity is often used instead of absolute humidity in situations where the rate of water evaporation is important, as it takes into account the variation in saturated vapor pressure."    - from Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relative_humidity

It's worth reading the whole article - especially the section: "Misconception"

[knight_knight_zzz]

Keith,

 Before I "hit the sack this evening", I feel I owe you a thank you for the link, etc. Today, (after a few hours of work), I stopped by a Steinway Piano Dealership and spoke with the owner who has been doing piano sales, tuning, and repairs for 40 years or so. He said that most people (and manufactures of hygrometers) use both terms (humidity and relative humidity) interchangeably.

 And he said that (at least for pianos), to try to keep the % between 40-60%... the closer to 50%, the better. I have also bought an ultrasonic humidifier, in case I see the moisture level goes below 40 %. 

 It is interesting that a small hygrometer, which I just brought from him today, does not even have or use the word "humidity" in it's self-identity. It calls itself a "moisture monitor"!

 Thanks again for your input and attempt to help.

 I would think that all of this might be good info for ivory chess sets too..... speaking of which... I like my ivory chess sets as well as my plastic sets. I love 'em all...!

 John.

[ne0romantic]

I've been redoing my setup a bit lately and have found the 1/18 scale di-cast car cases quite handy for my of my sets... some sets are a little too tall.  I'm still shuffling things around, but can probably take a few pictures of my setup with the new cases today, though only for this group esp. as I probably won't be able to take them without also taking pictures of my reflection taking the picture in the mirror back.  I'm still keeping my favorite sets in the big cabinet, but the di-cast cases are certainly a more efficient use of space, fit all chess sets but the very largest, and might be the best way to go for someone with a lot of sets to display in a limited space.