eBay

dcintennessee · ‎08-29-2017

I just printed a label for a First Class Large Envelope - 4 oz, and just over .25" thick. The eBay shipping calculator says $1.61 for First Class Package, but my actual charge is $2.61. (I have screenshots)

According to prior research, $1.61 is correct for a Large envelope, while $2.61 is for a Thick envelope/package at .75" or greater.

This is significant due to a large number of items I'm preparing to list, where I've set prices by using rates from the eBay Shipping Calculator. Does the eBay Shipping Calculator (still) show rates that can't actually be purchased via eBay? And in order to get tracking, I'll need to price the new items (only a few are listed) at the Thick Envelope/Package rate, even if they qualify for the Large Envelope rate?

partial*eclipse · ‎08-29-2017

@dcintennessee wrote:
... Does the eBay Shipping Calculator (still) show rates that can't actually be purchased via eBay? And in order to get tracking, I'll need to price the new items (only a few are listed) at the Thick Envelope/Package rate, even if they qualify for the Large Envelope rate?

Yes, and yes. USPS doesn't provide tracking for letters or flats (AKA large envelopes).

eBay doesn't print labels for letters or flats. If your item is eligible to be mailed as a flat, then you can't print your postage labels through eBay.

Your item is a package rather than a flat if it: (1) exceeds the maximum dimensions for a flat including thickness over 3/4 inch; (2) is rigid; or (3) has a variation in thickness of more than 1/4 inch.

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deep-garnet-red · ‎08-29-2017

That is correct. It has to be First Class package and it has to be over .75 inches thick at some point. If you put a FCP label on something thinner you will end up getting charged for Priority, since that is the next step up for tracking.

Yes, eBay does show those rates. It's stupid. I've been tripped up by it myself from not noticing it said letter instead of package.

dcintennessee · ‎08-29-2017

Calculator says 1st Class Package...Actual also says 1st Class Package

dcintennessee · ‎08-29-2017

Wait just a minute!! Garnet - this:

That is correct. It has to be First Class package and it has to be over .75 inches thick at some point. If you put a FCP label on something thinner you will end up getting charged for Priority, since that is the next step up for tracking.

I have shipped other First Class items at the Package rate, because I didn't realize the existance of "Large vs Thick Envelopes." Are you saying I'm just darn lucky none of them got popped for not being thick enough to actually count as a thick envelope/package??

jennieaa · ‎08-29-2017

Thickness doesn't matter if the 'package' is firm and not bendable.

partial*eclipse · ‎08-29-2017

@dcintennessee wrote:
... Does the eBay Shipping Calculator (still) show rates that can't actually be purchased via eBay? And in order to get tracking, I'll need to price the new items (only a few are listed) at the Thick Envelope/Package rate, even if they qualify for the Large Envelope rate?

Yes, and yes. USPS doesn't provide tracking for letters or flats (AKA large envelopes).

eBay doesn't print labels for letters or flats. If your item is eligible to be mailed as a flat, then you can't print your postage labels through eBay.

Your item is a package rather than a flat if it: (1) exceeds the maximum dimensions for a flat including thickness over 3/4 inch; (2) is rigid; or (3) has a variation in thickness of more than 1/4 inch.

deep-garnet-red · ‎08-29-2017

@dcintennessee wrote:
Wait just a minute!! Garnet - this:
That is correct. It has to be First Class package and it has to be over .75 inches thick at some point. If you put a FCP label on something thinner you will end up getting charged for Priority, since that is the next step up for tracking.

I have shipped other First Class items at the Package rate, because I didn't realize the existance of "Large vs Thick Envelopes." Are you saying I'm just darn lucky none of them got popped for not being thick enough to actually count as a thick envelope/package??

It depends on if it was rigid or uniform.

I've never used that calculator (I just use calcuated shipping), but it looks like it doesn't recognize that as a package due to the .25 thickness. Basically it is ignoring that it is being called a package. It sees it as an envelope so it gives you the price for an envelope.

I read a post today that said eBay is a huge tech company. Yeah right...lol

duchess-at-speakeasy · ‎08-29-2017

"Large envelope" aka "flat" is not meant for merchandise. Think of it as a 9x12 manila envelope containing 20 sheets of copy paper or many a thin magazine or brochure. A 'flat" must be flexible -- that is you can roll, bend, fold or crease it -- and be of uniform thickness, maximum 3/4 inch thick. Size and weight limits apply. On eBay, you cannot print online prepaid labels for flats or letters; neither type of First Class Mail has tracking. In other words, always select Package/Thick Envelope unless you really are mailing documents that can be rolled up and stuffed into a skinny apartment-style mailbox. ~~C~~

My Glass Duchess
Quoting Mom: In polite society, "hey" is for horses.

dcintennessee · ‎08-29-2017

Wow. Large envelope needs to be DELETED from that calculator. I just now entered 2" thickness as a large envelope to see what happened, and the calculator still says $1.61.

partial*eclipse · ‎08-29-2017

You chose "Large envelope," so you get Large Envlope rates.

duchess-at-speakeasy · ‎08-29-2017

No, "large envelope" and "letter" are still viable means of sending anything that meets the USPS size and weight requirements. On eBay, specifying a thickness does not "connect" to the other parameters -- it does not affect anything. It is up to the seller to know what packaging and class of mail are appropriate for specific items.

Not much that is sold on eBay qualifies as a "large envelope." Maybe a sheaf of paper (manuscript, stickers or other documents), a brochure or pamphlet or even a thin magazine. But even those ought to be sent with cardbard stiffeners to prevent damage -- the rigidity immediately rules out "large envelope" and dictates "package."

I routinely send postcard orders as non-machinable letters -- 6x9 envelope or smaller, and rigid -- and specify "letter" and "Standard." In addition, I offer First Class package as an alternative if the buyer wants tracking. But for larger paper goods such as magazine ads, photographs, artwork, pamphlets, brochures and thin catalogs or magazines, I would never risk a "floppy" envelope that could mean ruining the contents!

USPS publishes all rates and packaging requirements here:

https://pe.usps.com/text/dmm300/Notice123.htm

The Quick Reference links at the bottom lead to a very handy chart with all the specifications for domestic and international mail, respectively.

~~C~~

My Glass Duchess
Quoting Mom: In polite society, "hey" is for horses.

berserkerplanet · ‎08-30-2017

@dcintennessee wrote:
Calculator says 1st Class Package...

Yes, the way the First Class Mail vs First Class Package structure is handled by eBay calculators is confusing, but removing the option from eBay calculators would be a disservice to some sellers who sell items that can ship as flats or letter mail.

Not sure exactly how the confusion could be minimized, but possibly an informational popup on the listing form and/or estimating calculators for sellers the first time those options are chosen that simply explains that there is no tracking, and that postage can not be purchased online through eBay or PayPal would help. Along with a question mark help link for reference. And changes to the calc as outlined below. (and a shrubbery)

The reason I'm replying though is you screen shot above. You are correct, and I never noticed that before as I very rarely deal with flats (and don't need the calc for pricing as I look it up in USPS docs):

THAT IS A LOGIC ERROR IN THE ESTIMATING CALCULATOR @Anonymous

It should not say "First Class Package" when Letter or Large Envelope are chosen, and an entry on the online tab shouldn't even appear for either one as neither is available online through eBay or PayPal labels. (it's fine to show retail pricing on the retail tab for those, and would be a perfect place for an info bubble)

The calc does seem to handle letter over 3 oz correctly by not offering any First Class service at all and instead offering Priority as the only option, but the large envelope logic is flawed.

This needs to be addressed as we don't need any more shipping confusion.

tyler@ebay · ‎08-30-2017

@berserkerplanet wrote:

@dcintennessee wrote:

Calculator says 1st Class Package...

Yes, the way the First Class Mail vs First Class Package structure is handled by eBay calculators is confusing, but removing the option from eBay calculators would be a disservice to some sellers who sell items that can ship as flats or letter mail.

Not sure exactly how the confusion could be minimized, but possibly an informational popup on the listing form and/or estimating calculators for sellers the first time those options are chosen that simply explains that there is no tracking, and that postage can not be purchased online through eBay or PayPal would help. Along with a question mark help link for reference. And changes to the calc as outlined below. (and a shrubbery)

The reason I'm replying though is you screen shot above. You are correct, and I never noticed that before as I very rarely deal with flats (and don't need the calc for pricing as I look it up in USPS docs):

THAT IS A LOGIC ERROR IN THE ESTIMATING CALCULATOR @Anonymous

It should not say "First Class Package" when Letter or Large Envelope are chosen, and an entry on the online tab shouldn't even appear for either one as neither is available online through eBay or PayPal labels. (it's fine to show retail pricing on the retail tab for those, and would be a perfect place for an info bubble)

The calc does seem to handle letter over 3 oz correctly by not offering any First Class service at all and instead offering Priority as the only option, but the large envelope logic is flawed.

This needs to be addressed as we don't need any more shipping confusion.

Thanks for the tag @berserkerplanet, and for the USPS links @duchess-at-speakeasy (making research really simple).

Great suggestions on how to limit confusion on these shipping options without removing or replacing them altogether, I'll get a suggestion made for more info on the listing screen.

As to the shipping calculator itself, I'll get that to the right team and let them know what's occurring. Hopefully we'll get more clarification/correction from them. 🙂

Tyler,

berserkerplanet · ‎08-30-2017

Thanks for the tag @berserkerplanet, and for the USPS links @duchess-at-speakeasy (making research really simple).

Great suggestions on how to limit confusion on these shipping options without removing or replacing them altogether, I'll get a suggestion made for more info on the listing screen.

As to the shipping calculator itself, I'll get that to the right team and let them know what's occurring. Hopefully we'll get more clarification/correction from them. 🙂

Thanks for taking care of this Tyler.

BTW, should we tag you specifically on issues of this type (website interfaces)?

arpharph · ‎09-05-2019

And this is still going on now! Only it is worse. Cost is now over $3 for a 6 ounce large envelope and the costs varies by region. But the calculator still shows $1.75 for a large envelope.

eBay needs to either update their calculator, get rid of large envelope as an option, OR give us back the option of first class LETTER postage.