USPS ESUS Tracking - Postage Due

[leinen]

I do not know what is going on, but over the last week I have received 15+ ESUS envelopes with postage due from USPS. Most of the postage due is for an additional $4.25, like they had full tracking.  There is no tracking available at all for these packages. At first, I was paying the postage due, but I am now rejecting these. Can eBay and the USPS please get this straight?

[1786davycrockett]

@leinen 

From what you have described, it sounds like your eBay Standard Envelopes (ESEs) are too thick, or too heavy, or too rigid, and are being reclassified by USPS as Ground Delivery packages.

What have you been attempting to ship in the ESEs, and how are you packing them?

[leinen]

I am the buyer. I get 20-40 ESUS envelopes a week of all shapes and sizes. There is no pattern to what is being classified as postage due....unless it is certain station in the usps system?

[1786davycrockett]

@leinen 

You haven't answered my questions.

What have you been attempting to ship in the ESEs, and how are you packing them?

[leinen]

You are not listening to my answer. I am not packing anything. I am buying from eBay, not selling.

[1786davycrockett]

@leinen 

My apologies -- I misunderstood.

What are the items that you have been receiving that have been marked as "postage due"?

[leinen]

I am receiving trading cards. They are packaged all different ways. Most commonly, they are packaged with a single card in a top loader in a plain white envelope. Sometimes, sellers go overboard with the taping, and they are too thick. I would understand on the thick items because they are not machinable. There is no pattern to the rejections based on the thickness of the envelopes.  

[1786davycrockett]

@leinen 

It is probably the top loaders that are throwing off the automatic, high-speed sorting machines -- if the ESEs are TOO rigid, the ESEs aren't able to zip through the roller systems at high speed -- and the ESEs will be reclassified either as "nonmachinable" or "postage due."

The ESEs need to be VERY flexible -- they can NOT be rigid -- and the top loaders are probably unable to bend around the rollers.  The ESEs need to bend nearly in half.

This is a SELLER issue -- not USPS, and not eBay.  Contact those sellers who are at fault, and let them know that their ESEs are too rigid, and are being reclassified.

Same thing with the sellers who are over-taping their envelopes.

Are you having any problems receiving refunds from any of these sellers?

[1786davycrockett]

@leinen 

You had mentioned that you had originally been paying the "postage due" amounts; but then simply rejected the deliveries.

Have you saved the "postage due" statements from USPS?  If so, you may be able to force a refund from the sellers.

[leinen]

The sellers I have asked for postage due were not happy, but most refunded the money. In the past few years, this was an occasional package. Over the last two weeks, the frequency has greatly increased. In most cases, the additional postage due is more than the card and the original postage. The most common reply from sellers is that they have, "always package it that way". 

If the top loaders were not used, the machining would damage the card.

In most cases, the postal worker comes to my door with a package stamped, "Postage due" and amount written on the envelope. I have to pay exact change cash at that moment to get the package. If I refuse, a slip is placed in my mail box saying I have an item at the post office with postage due. I am assuming that if I do not come in and pay the postage that the item is returned to the seller. For most of these items, there is little or no tracking.

[1786davycrockett]

@leinen 

The problem which you are experiencing is definitely the top loader.

And many eBay sellers are shipping trading cards using the ESE system without having the same issues -- so obviously those sellers are packaging their ESEs in a different manner, which still protects the cards from being damaged.  (For my own ESEs, I simply use a penny sleeve, sandwiched between 2 pieces of cereal box packaging -- no problems.)

There have been scattered reports from around the country within the past few months regarding several local post offices which have begun clamping down on the ESEs, and it's possible that your post office may now be amongst them.

You may find it necessary now to contact the seller BEFORE you purchase, to find out what method of packaging they are using, and to advise them that you as a buyer will REFUSE to accept any ESEs marked with "postage due."

[leinen]

This makes it too hard to buy on eBay. USPS and eBay need to figure out rules and communicate and enforce them in a standard manner.

This is too much hassle for a hobby, so I am going to stop buying items with ESE.

[1786davycrockett]

@leinen 

"USPS and eBay need to figure out rules and communicate and enforce them in a standard manner."

USPS established the rules for metered mail envelopes decades ago -- I was using it as early as 1965.

The problem seems to be that eBay did not fully comprehend the manner in which the post office physically sorts mail -- and that the USPS sorting machines by necessity nearly bend envelopes in half.

Don't blame USPS -- blame eBay for not understanding how mail is actually delivered, and for not clearly communicating fully the envelope limitations to its buyers.

[tobaccocardyahoo · Accepted solution]

Some of the envelopes backed by Ebay sellers are jamming the sorting machines. Tolerances differ by the machine.

The general PO term for many packages which do not work in letter sorting machines is non-machineable. ESE packages must be machineable, uniform in thickness, not too rigid, not too heavy.

These rules apply to all First Class Letter shipments, not just metered mail, and ESE is subject to the restrictions for First Class Letter.

Ebay has written some ambiguous requirements for ESE.

The recent postage due envelopes are the reaction of Postal Employees to the disruption some ESE packages are causing. Before the postage due started occurring, the envelopes failed to be scanned, and were delayed in delivery, or damaged or lost.

How sellers package matters. How the envelope is routed matters.

This is probably not going to get better because the postal equipment is unlikely to be replaced. First Class Letter is a declining service. ESE is based on a service intended to boost volume through the equipment without any extra investment. Card were probably the worst place to start, because of the issues with toploaders.

Ebay has created a special envelope to ship cards by ESE, but it cost $.45 per envelope, and has not caught on. If sellers need to pay an extra $4.25 in postage due, that 45 cents might seem a bargain.

Some of us, have stopped using ESE and do not offer anything not worth paying for Ground Advantage shipping/

[1786davycrockett]

@tobaccocardyahoo 

"Ebay has created a special envelope to ship cards by ESE, but it cost $.45 per envelope, and has not caught on."

One of the reasons that that special eBay envelope (which was designed specifically for shipping trading cards) didn't catch on, is that the envelope is too rigid, and is not compatible with the USPS sorting machines.  

Some other previous threads complaining about the ESE have been from eBay sellers who tried that new eBay envelope, only to discover -- too late! -- that the envelope was repeatedly kicked out of the sorting machines, and re-categorized by USPS as "nonmachinable," requiring additional postage.

Didn't it occur to anyone at eBay to actually ask someone at USPS if that envelope would run successfully through the sorting machines?

Back to the drawing boards, eBay!