Why oh why did ebay bring back variable time limit offers? I thought we banished this 4 years ago?

[netherworldgames]

Seriously. eBay. You tried this 4 years ago.

It made it impossible for sellers to keep up with offers, and created (sigh, even MORE,) unrealistic buyer expectations.

All of this was covered here:
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Archive-Selling/Yes-eBay-modified-Best-Offer-system-Yes-it-is-terrible...

But most notably, ebay, why did you AGAIN make this change without notifying sellers, or even your own reps? When I called in to ask about it, none of the MSO reps knew about it.

[netherworldgames]

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@couldabeenworse wrote:

Those with many bid retractions don't care if the reason they are chsoing to cancel is a lie~they just want to retract.

This topic has nothing to do with serial retractors.

We routinely see buyers come to the boards complaining that 48 hours is too long for this day and age.  Even more often, we see sellers come to the board complaining that buyers don't pay for accepted Offers - often stating that they aready purchased the same item from somebody else.

Shortening the Offer duration goes a long way towards helping both problems.

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if your time is so valuable that you can't wait 48 hours to get a discount, then use buy it now. 
if buyers are being **bleep**ty and not paying for items, ebay should do something about it. but they won't, and we all know that.

Shortening the offer duration goes almost no way in helping that. 
It merely increases buyer expectations, and moves the goalposts for sellers.

if they implement ONE HOUR OFFERS, in six months, buyers will be complaining that that's too  long. 

[castlemagicmemories]

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@couldabeenworse wrote:

Those with many bid retractions don't care if the reason they are chsoing to cancel is a lie~they just want to retract.

This topic has nothing to do with serial retractors.

We routinely see buyers come to the boards complaining that 48 hours is too long for this day and age.  Even more often, we see sellers come to the board complaining that buyers don't pay for accepted Offers - often stating that they aready purchased the same item from somebody else.

Shortening the Offer duration goes a long way towards helping both problems.

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Since a previous poster stated that they can do this now (without having their offer expire due to their time limit) by retracting, it most certainly does have something to do with serial retractors.  That much is evident.

I understand but you are assuming the buyer MUST be able to submit a Best Offer, and that they don't want to wait.  That's fine~because they have the option of BUYING IT NOW~no wait.   Problem solved.  That was the point of the BIN~you want it now, you pay for it now.  You want a discount, you agree to wait.

As for buyers not paying for accepted offers, you are assuming because they get a faster response they will pay, but that is not necessarily the case as the  impatient buyer may have already moved on and bailed on the offer that was accepted within their specified time period.  We see threads on this Board all the time about requests for cancellations 1 minute after purchase, there is no reason to suppose that having a shorter duration will generate an equally fast payment, or even any payment at all.  

[annasunicorns]

In fairness, as a buyer, I like the 1 hour option. Especially for 12 hour coupon days. Im gonna hate it as a seller I can tell. But I will use it while it,lasts, its convenient (and convenience is why I shop online in the first place).

[castlemagicmemories]

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@annasunicorns wrote:
In fairness, as a buyer, I like the 1 hour option. Especially for 12 hour coupon days. Im gonna hate it as a seller I can tell. But I will use it while it,lasts, its convenient (and convenience is why I shop online in the first place).

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I understand, but you do know that the one hour option may not generate a response from the seller in one hour.  

[annasunicorns]

Good point castle, I would not be surprised to find no response to the offer in an hour. Or offended etc. But then, I sell too, so I know how it works. People have lives.

[netherworldgames]

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@annasunicorns wrote:
In fairness, as a buyer, I like the 1 hour option. Especially for 12 hour coupon days. Im gonna hate it as a seller I can tell. But I will use it while it,lasts, its convenient (and convenience is why I shop online in the first place).

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how is this fair? Of course you like the 1 hour option. As a buyer, I like the one hour option too!

But I'm a realist. I mostly sell on ebay. As a seller you NEED to reply to offers or buyers get upset. 

If offers are 48 hours. you need to check some fraction of that time to please buyers. we check every 8 to 12 hours because we're a busines. As a random guy selling, I could see checking once ever 24 hours being reasonable.

If you can make 6 hour offers, we need to check every 3 hours otherwise buyers will get upset.
If you can make 1 hour offers, we need to check every half hour. 

We usually have 30,000 - 40,000 listings in our store, and get hundreds of offers a day.
We've been using and have loved ebay's best offer system since they implemented it, and we were one of the first sellers to apply it to EVERY listing no matter what when ebay rolled it out 15 (ish?) years ago. 

Of course you like the 1 hour option as a buyer. As a buyer, I like the one hour option too!
But I'm a realist.

And implementing 1 hour option fundamentally has a detrimental effect on the ebay environment. 
It creates buyer entitlement which will continue to contribute to sellers leaving the site.

1 hour offers on the site is GREAT for buyers... in the short term. And bad for buyers, sellers and the site in the long term. 

Right now when you make an offer under the listings with the 48 hour system, a box pops up and says (something to the effect of) "Want it fast? Consider using buy it now." And this is great, and one of those surprisingly good things that ebay has done for sellers. 

In the new system, when you are given the option of changing the duration to reply, the mouse over says
"You can now select how long your offer remains valid for. If you’re in a rush, select a shorter time to get an answer faster!"

The implication there is very clear. eBay is training buyers to be impatient and unrealistic. They're explicitly telling buyers that the shorter their offer is, the faster the seller will reply. That's just not reality, and will lead to a bad buyer experience. 

Again, I agree, (we all probably agree,) that the one hour offer is good for buyers. But only in the short term.

[couldabeenworse]

I understand but you are assuming the buyer MUST be able to submit a Best Offer, and that they don't want to wait.  That's fine~because they have the option of BUYING IT NOW~no wait.   Problem solved. 

As Marie Antoinette discovered, "Let them eat cake" didn't really solve the problem.

[netherworldgames]

Dear eBay,

How often are you going to resurrect this terrible idea, cost us a bunch of sales, lose yourself a bunch of buyers who get frustrated by the lack of response, only to "wisely" abandon it again? You just brought this back AGAIN this week, for the third time that I know of, and we're already starting to feel the negative effects.

Please stop doing this. It doesn't work. 

[castlemagicmemories]

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@couldabeenworse wrote:

I understand but you are assuming the buyer MUST be able to submit a Best Offer, and that they don't want to wait.  That's fine~because they have the option of BUYING IT NOW~no wait.   Problem solved. 

As Marie Antoinette discovered, "Let them eat cake" didn't really solve the problem.

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Analogy doesn't really work as they didn't have cake to eat.  Buyers, on the other hand, DO have a choice and can choose to wait or not.  If they are in a rush, then they know that the time involved may not accommodate that, and buy elsewhere if they must haggle, or buy it now realizing they are in a rush.

Wanting to haggle and not wanting to wait is more like wanting to have your cake and eat it, too.  We all know that that may not be possible.

[castlemagicmemories]

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@netherworldgames wrote:

Dear eBay,

How often are you going to resurrect this terrible idea, cost us a bunch of sales, lose yourself a bunch of buyers who get frustrated by the lack of response, only to "wisely" abandon it again? You just brought this back AGAIN this week, for the third time that I know of, and we're already starting to feel the negative effects.

Please stop doing this. It doesn't work. 

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Possibly requiring use of auto accept or decline for instant answers may be on the horizon.  Instant response, no frustration for buyers or sellers and renders this all a moot point.  JMO YMMV

[castlemagicmemories]

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@annasunicorns wrote:
Good point castle, I would not be surprised to find no response to the offer in an hour. Or offended etc. But then, I sell too, so I know how it works. People have lives.

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Thank you!  Yes, what you might like as a buyer is not necessarily something you would like as a seller.  Would not be surprised to see auto accept/decline become a requirement.  Ebay has been focused on sales velocity and that would increase that by eliminating the wait delay, and all this would become a moot point then.  People do have lives, and the auto accept/decline would accommodate that.

[castlemagicmemories]

"You can now select how long your offer remains valid for. If you’re in a rush, select a shorter time to get an answer faster!"

The implication there is very clear. eBay is training buyers to be impatient and unrealistic. They're explicitly telling buyers that the shorter their offer is, the faster the seller will reply. That's just not reality, and will lead to a bad buyer experience. 

I don't think that is training buyers to be impatient anymore than the returns button entices buyers into returning.  If they are satisfied with their item, they aren't going to be enticed into returning it just because a blue button suggests that to them, and in these instances, it is only natural that someone is going to want to hear whether their offer is accepted or declined as soon as possible.   Human nature.

[netherworldgames]

castlemagicmemories
>Possibly requiring use of auto accept or decline for instant answers may be on the horizon. Instant response, no frustration for buyers or sellers and renders this all a moot point.

This doesn't work in collectibles industries where prices are changing frequently.

castlemagicmemories
>I don't think that is training buyers to be impatient anymore than the returns button entices buyers into returning. If they are satisfied with their item, they aren't going to be enticed into returning it just because a blue button suggests that to them, and in these instances, it is only natural that someone is going to want to hear whether their offer is accepted or declined as soon as possible. Human nature.

This absolutely trains buyers to be impatient. I'm not sure how you can't see that. Even if it doesn't train all of them, it certainly trains some non-zero amount of them, and it doesn't train any of them to be MORE patient, thus the goal post is moved, either absolutely or on average.

The biggest issue I have with this whole thing is that right now, buyers can retract their offers AT ANY TIME for ANY REASON. Buyers don't need to make 4 hour or 12 hour or 24 hour offers, because they can take back their offer at any time.

So if the argument is that you want to shorten the buyer experience, be more clear about letting them know they can retract their offers. And if a buyer "forgets" to retract it after changing his mind, and the seller accepts, ebay doesn't punish buyers for not paying, so again, no loss there.

[transamcc]

Your statement about buyers can retract at any time for any reason is somewhat inaccurate (totally), if buyers abide by ebay's rules. There are very specific reasons a buyer can retract a bid or an offer, with the offer retraction being more stringent than bidding with ebay only providing 3 reasons and none of them "seller ignoring me".   As a buyer, I think 48 hours is too long to wait for the majority of sellers who just let offers expire, which they do all of the time.  To enforce a seller action in a shorter time frame is a needed ebay response to this situation, which could be done by either: 1. shortening the duration of offers (1 hour is too short) before expiration. or 2: Making auto accept/auto decline thresholds mandatory of sellers in those listings, or 3. Make expired (ignored) offers a seller metric and monitor it closely for performance.  Ebay should remain a buyer-centric platform, since it is buyer money and outside advertising financing the entire operation.

[castlemagicmemories]

Points well taken.  However:

This doesn't work in collectibles industries where prices are changing frequently.

While it may not work for collectibles, that does preclude auto accept/decline being the law of the land if Ebay decrees it is so.

My point was that Ebay doesn't have to train a buyer to want a lesser response time, it is human nature to want an answer as quickly as possible.  There have been many threads by buyers that want a faster response time so it doesn't appear that eBay has trained anyone to expect anything, they are simply reacting to the buyer complaints.  Years ago, when there were very few places to buy online, people learned the rules of the site and adhered to them.  The consumer these days is less inclined to learn the rules, if they even know there are rules, and less inclined to follow them if they know them.  To facilitate sales, accommodations are made, and they may not choose to be more patient, they may just take their cash elsewhere.  Training them to be more patient most likely isn't going to happen.  You aren't necessarily going to be able to control that behavior.  

The biggest issue I have with this whole thing is that right now, buyers can retract their offers AT ANY TIME for ANY REASON. Buyers don't need to make 4 hour or 12 hour or 24 hour offers, because they can take back their offer at any time.

So if the argument is that you want to shorten the buyer experience, be more clear about letting them know they can retract their offers. And if a buyer "forgets" to retract it after changing his mind, and the seller accepts, ebay doesn't punish buyers for not paying, so again, no loss there.

Actually retracting the offer may not address the whole problem.  While a buyer may retract, they may not know how, or believe the seller must do this, or they may feel one of the reasons does not fit their situation.  What they really want is an answer on their offer, not to retract the offer.  After all, the point of making an offer is to get an answer, not to retract it.