Why are sellers in India allowed to get away with this-when will eBay support US sellers AND buyers?

[mczombies]

I admit--I am a jewelry junkie. Every so often when I have a few spare minutes I look for jewelry--on auction, ending soonest. I've made some great purchases in the past, but I am super careful--making sure I have my settings turned on, and I also read the listings carefully before each purchase. Even still, I have been burned before--but recently, and especially with all the policy changes for US sellers, the discrepancy between what is allowed to happen to me as am International buyer vs. what I am punished for as a US seller has really got me upset. 

I have recently become interested in all the new jewelry that is coming from India--there are a TON of new sellers here from India (or old sellers with new ID's- I don't know). Anyway, between the shill bidding (and it isn't a myth--I have bid on countless things here on eBay and I know how things are supposed to work--and whatever is happening just isn't right--I've never seen anything like it--totally corrupt) the false advertising for "Sterling Silver" which when you read the fine print is actually silver plate (I thought this wasn't allowed) and the worst breach of policy I have ever seen (as described below)--it is a nightmare and a mess. 

I recently won a ring from a seller from India with "Free Shipping" and lo and behold when I went to pay they had sent me an invoice with a shipping charge of 6.99! So I called eBay--sure enough the CS confirmed that the ring was sold with free shipping. Of course, customer service did absolutely nothing to help me--so I have to ask the seller to cancel the order for me--but I get a strike. So now I have to call back and have the strike removed--totally unfair and ridiculous. I have been on eBay for 13 years and I have NEVER not paid for an item--I really resent my account getting that strike. What's more--the CSR was very evasive about what kind of correction this seller was going receive, if any--leading me to believe that they were somehow protected. I can't prove that, but it's a feeling I got--she didn't even seem that surprised about it. Shouldn't there be some kind of punishment for making me waste my time having to call CS twice--and also for leaving me totally unsatisfied with my "purchase?" All of their listings still say "Free Shipping." And what about all the other innocent  buyers who fall for this scam and either just go ahead and pay, or take a strike when they ask the seller to cancel? Is India the new country to be wary of--and how many buyers will this lose eBay as their trust/confidence is violated? For the life of me--I can't reconcile how making some fast money from China or India garbage is worth losing tons of buyers--buyers that could be lifelong sources of income for eBay. How does this make sense? 

I just don't understand why sellers from other countries are given such incredible breaks here. I am not xenophobic, and I purchase frequently from other countries--but how come I can't return an item to China on their dime, but a buyer from ANYWHERE in the world can basically return/steal my item and/or my money (however it works out--I basically lose--right)? And why is eBay enforcing this Global shipping thing by dropping us from Global Top Rated if we don't sell a certain amount to other countries? What am I missing here? Why are US sellers responsible for not only honestly, integrity, and towing the line (OK-fine), but also are forced to take risks that they don't feel comfortable with--like offering Global shipping, dong FREE RETURNS, and paying for every single little mistake out of our own pockets?

Now they won't even support us in regards to false SNADS--it is everywhere here on the boards--and I have experienced it myself recently. Returns have gone through the roof, and buyers are basically being told its OK to lie. And they do--and pretty soon they won't have to lie--they can just be as irresponsible as they want--on OUR dime. They have given buyers a license to steal--from us--the country and sellers that BUILT eBay. Not only that, but we also have to worry about being ripped off by everyone ELSE in the world. No protection for sellers, but also as US buyers we are sorely neglected.

Heck, some sellers are restricted/punished/banned just for having a double listing. When you think about it, it is crazy--when you see thousands of multiple listings from China.  Are we just stupid for going along with this? Again, what am I missing here? Shouldn't eBay be concerned with its US sellers and give us some breaks? I am not saying that they should allow US sellers to lie, cheat, steal, shill bid, and break all the rules--not at all--but why do they allow other countries to do so? If I tried half the things that have happened to me as a buyer who shops Internationally--I would have been gone a long time ago.

Instead I am still here, following all the rules, stressing out about getting defects, making sure to ship on time, plugging away and working as hard as I can to describe everything perfectly, yet still dealing with false SNAD returns, living in fear of negative feedback--all the while still trying to maintain some of my dignity, and end the day proud of what I have accomplished. But it is getting harder, to be honest--and I have loved eBay forever--the things I have purchased here, just amazing and eclectic and different and unique and wonderful--but it is getting harder to reconcile the old fuzzy nostalgic feelings with the new, and "improved" eBay. The eBay that seems to care nothing about me as a seller, and could also care less about me as a buyer.

[mczombies]

I do not think that everyone has to agree with me, and truthfully I could care less. I did not come here looking for agreement--I wrote what I wrote because I am seeking to understand why I feel, as a US seller and buyer here, so disrespected and disposable. While others are allowed to take advantage, game the system, and cheat.  If you have something to say that is a worthwhile argument, by all means--put it forth. However, I feel that one of the main reasons that some of these forums are not successful is because people have to stoop to name calling and criticizing the poster, instead of the ideas. 

I actually want a reason to feel better right now--and that is the basic truth. Because for the first time in years I feel really down about being here--and I don't want to feel that way. I WANT someone to tell me that I'm wrong--but I honestly don't think anyone can convince me that US sellers aren't getting the shaft. 

[tunicaslot]

I love Ebay and tend to be in the middle on many items as I try to look at both sides - so I'm not popular with the nay sayers but I'm also not popular with the Ebay supporters who see everything as rosy.

I understand the influx of foreign sellers as a way to offer - the cheap disposable products Americans want. Dollar stores are very popular in American culture and having those products offered here does draw buyers. I don't agree with the standards set for some and not others tho. We've been told through the years that Ebay standards apply to everyone selling here - but have seen different standards applied to Big Box and overseas sellers. Duplicate listings, listings in wrong categories, listing descriptions that are false, keyword spamming ect.... reports go no where and I think this is where the frustration from many comes from. Not the diversity offered but the fact it doesn't seem lke everyone plays by the same rules - despite being told repeatedly that they do.

I also am questioning my presence here - I'm not doing bad - but it's a struggle sometimes. I just wish Ebay would focus more on the fact that the venue has all these small mom and pop shops. The success of other sites is due to the fact that people do want to buy American and from American sellers - and those sites promote the fact that the items are handmade by Americans or items are only allowed to be sold within the US - there is no international shipping. The silent majority made changes - whether you agree with them or not - because they want this country to be respected and Americans to come first - by making small sellers struggle on this venue and not advertising that there are so many American small sellers here - they are losing both buyers and sellers. Added to the fact that the younger folks tend to shop at the latest and greatest.

I don't believe all the conspiracies theories - but I do understand why many come to that conclusion. So many policies here work against a small seller.

[d-k_treasures]

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@tunicaslot wrote:

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@jonathankirkland wrote:

A lot of what you wrote sounds a bit "tin foil hat" to me, like the shill bidding claims (do you have any proof by the way?), 

As far as a listing showing FREE SHIPPING and then trying to charge you for shipping at check out that definitely isn't right, and whichever CSR you spoke to who shrugged that off should be fired. Also, you shouldn't have gotten any kind of "strike" unless the seller refused to cancel the order "at buyers request" for this shipping charge issue and instead opened an "unpaid item request" which you let time out, but that would be even more silly if that is in fact what happened...  I feel like there are some details missing here.

Shill Bidding has been a problem on Ebay since the beginning and continues to be. Some get caught - some don't.

Also Ebay is indeed watching buyers as far as cancellations and returns - especially with the new guarenteed delivery and Ebay forking over money out of their pocket for false SNADs - I as a buyer don't want that mark on my acct.

As far as your auction win - go directly to the listing and "pay now" from that not the invoice the buyer edited at a higher cost. Then report the seller for adjusting the shipping on the invoice after the fact.

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Once the invoice is sent, there isn't any way to go back to pay what it was prior to that invoice.

But if they don't have their settings tight, you may be able to take off the shipping charge or add yourself a discount equal to the shipping cost.

[mczombies]

"Once the invoice is sent, there isn't any way to go back to pay what it was prior to that invoice.

 But if they don't have their settings tight, you may be able to take off the shipping charge or add yourself a discount equal to the shipping cost."

Say what now? How can I take off the shipping charge? But more importantly--how can I add a discount for myself--I wouldn't mind knowing how to do that!

[lewisburggold]

We would just stay away from them.  They dont have to follow the the same rules we do.  Bestregards

[tunicaslot]

Thanks for that info - this was info I found on the boards that must have been incorrect or defunct now. I've never had the problem but can't understand why an invoive would override a pay now button.

OP - I'd call again and see if you get a different rep - this is so wrong.

[ed8108]

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@tunicaslot wrote: 

So many policies here work against a small seller.

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And intended to benefit those large volume sellers.

[jason_incognito]

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@mczombies wrote:

"I didn't read a word of the OP other than the title, but this was my first thought.  The Golden Children have a new place of origin."

Good to know that you read postings like the buyers read listings.

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And still had enough info to be a part of the conversation? If you don't read the posting, how can you offer an opinion?

[mczombies]

I get that--I really do--because I want to still love ebay, and in many ways I do--but it's really hard right now.  It's getting to be way too stressful and depressing. I am looking at two false SNAD returns opened just yesterday--and I have watched my return percentage creep up from 2% to nearly 4% in the last TWO months--which is crazy, and is costing me a lot of money and worry.  I have always taken returns though--some even after 30 days--I just don't think I should have to pay for another person's carelessness.  I can't help it, but morally & ethically I don't think I can get over it. It feels wrong to me, and I imagine this place turning into some kind of wild west freak show--with buyers holding the reins and taking turns riding us hard.

 So I guess I feel like I'm being pushed into a corner. If buyers know that eBay won't step in and stick up for us, no matter what--then we might as well all offer free returns because that is what is going to happen anyway--it's already happening. And if things were fair across the board it wouldn't be so bad, but they aren't, and so I feel even more disrespected by that fact.

I think, that deep down I am offended by the seemingly lack of American pride as well. It's hard to see so many good people and friends (myself included) struggling just to keep a roof over their heads. And then to see the special priviledges given to other sellers. And I just can't figure out why--its like management hates us all the sudden--I would really like to know what they are thinking by alienating so many small sellers--it seems a foolish and crazy plan. Have they never heard the saying, "Make new friends but keep the old?" But you are so right--eBay has essentially ignored one of its most popular draws for consumers--small American sellers. I don't think its realistic to ever imagine the good old days coming back, but there could be more of a compromise than what they are proposing. There could be--but I can't get over the sinking feeling that they just don't really care about us anymore.

And yes--I am going to call back--I'm going to do it right now, as a matter of fact. 

[softersilk]

Go looking for cheap? You get cheap.

Go looking around the world for the very cheapest?  You get it.

With cheap, and the very cheapest, come rotten quality and often scammers who will take the cash from the bad sales until the ID is used up and then make another one.

People who go looking for Tiffany-quality jewelry at the flea market and are angry that their $1.99 find is not a real diamond always blame someone else.  If you want quality, pay for it.  

[mczombies]

How do you know how much I paid? And I never said I was looking for cheap. There is jewelry from India that is thousands of dollars--pretty presumptuous of you to assume that what I was looking for was a cheap steal, somewhere in the low quality range. 

Also, your analogy of the flea market does not apply, as I am not upset over not finding my Jackson Pollack in the trash--I am angry at the fact that this seller was able to charge me for shipping after I agreed to purchase the item. When the listing clearly stated free shipping.

But hey--if you can't add anything to the conversation, you can always berate the poster, or try to make insinuations about their character, and at least feel somewhat superior, right? 

[luckythewinner]

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I didn't read the OP's comments as being directed only at the Indian sellers

The title of his post was "Why are sellers in India allowed to get away with this".

In the first post the OP mentions sellers from India six times - for example: "Is India the new country to be wary of" as well as "India garbage". Perhaps his comments were not exclusively about India, but they were certainly predominantly about India.

But regardless, the essence of my question stands even if you believe the OP was not talking about India while he was constantly mentioning India.

[divwido]

That was a lot of paragraphs to say-it's not sterling-it's fake.

Get a silver test kit.  And buy from reputable sellers-they are not in India, Japan and China.

[mczombies]

Whoa--hold on--I did put India in the title of my post, and that is because my issue right now is with a seller from there, but I did not mean to imply that India is the only country that seems to be receiving special treatment. And I also didn't just say, "India garbage" I said, "China and India garbage." As examples to illustrate my point.

However, you are completely overlooking the second line in the title that states: "When will eBay support US(A) sellers AND buyers?"  I honestly don't care what country it is--and that should be apparent from the fact that I buy Internationally. I am not sure what you are trying to illustrate here--I have no extra special dislike for India in particular. I am more concerned with the fact that, while US sellers seem to be getting a boot to the bum, sellers from other countries (and India is the one I have noticed lately) are getting lots of breaks. 

[luckythewinner]

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@mczombies wrote:

Whoa--hold on--I did put India in the title of my post, and that is because my issue right now is with a seller from there, but I did not mean to imply that India is the only country that seems to be receiving special treatment. And I also didn't just say, "India garbage" I said, "China and India garbage." As examples to illustrate my point.

However, you are completely overlooking the second line in the title that states: "When will eBay support US(A) sellers AND buyers?"  I honestly don't care what country it is--and that should be apparent from the fact that I buy Internationally. I am not sure what you are trying to illustrate here--I have no extra special dislike for India in particular. I am more concerned with the fact that, while US sellers seem to be getting a boot to the bum, sellers from other countries (and India is the one I have noticed lately) are getting lots of breaks. 

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If you go back an re-read my post, I said:

"If you believe that shill bidding, mis-identifying precious metals, and shipping surcharges are only a problem with sellers from India and that USA sellers do not get away with these practices, I would say that your time as a buyer here has been very lucky indeed. "

I focused on India because you focused on India.

And as I said in my last post, even if you remove my mention of India the essence of my post does not really change:

"If you believe that shill bidding, mis-identifying precious metals, and shipping surcharges are only a problem with sellers from overseas and that USA sellers do not get away with these practices, I would say that your time as a buyer here has been very lucky indeed. "