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Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

Looks like eBay is badly in need of somebody who knows the difference between race and ethnicity, nationality and geogrpahic location, etc. etc. When listing some jewelry, I just posted one that is a so-called Siam Niello style old vintage butterfly brooch. When looking at the pre-filled information, eBay automatically offered suggestions for item specifics, most of which were helpful, but not the one they added as Ethnicity: Asian. For starters: Ethnicity has a lot more to do with culture than with race, or geographic location. 

 

To provide an example: a person who was born in the Land of Enchantment (NM), could be of White, Black, Asian Pacific Islander, Green race (if a space Alien, think Rosewell) and anything in-between, as in mixed racial background. That is just a race as in physical attributes. However, when it comes to ETHNICITY and select one racial group, for example, White Causasian, we are talking abut German, British, Irish, or select Native Americans, Zuni Indian, Navajo, Pueblo Indian, or pick any Native American tribe or another approximately 2,000 different ethnicities around the world. All of those people who settled in this state at one time or their ancestors brought with them their specific ethnic heritage (think: cooking, baking, religious rituals, jewelry making style, linguistic specifics, etc.) My above example is even inaccurate, because German is not necessarily a homogenous ethnicity, as there are people among Germans (born in the same city, if you wish) who could be of Polish, Hungarian, Czech, Croatian, Serbian or why not, even British background.  Within each of those countries, at any given time, there could be hundreds of different ethnicities, and just because somebody happens to be from Asia (which is a continent) this does not mean they all share the same cultural (ethnic) background. Same for our U.S.A. - the number of different ethnicities here within our country possibly surpasses 1,500 or more. And while they are all referred to as Americans, or New Mexicans, their ETHNIC background could not be more different! 

 

With an other example: Togo, Zambia, Ethiopia, Morocco and Zimbabwe are all on the African continent - but this does not mean they share an ETHNIC (= cultural) background, nor does it mean they are ethnically homogenous countries, as there are various cultural groups in each and every African country (and depending on colonialism, those cultures could have been strongly influence by either French, Postugese, B ritish, German or Dutch culture, think South Africa. So, technically, there is no such thing as "South African" ethnicity.  But there are a gazillion of ethnic groups - within S. Africa. 

 

So, what would be the correct reference to the Ethnicty among item specifics, you may wonder? Well, it would be Siamese (a name earlier used for some parts of Thailand). It is a totally different ETHNIC heritage than say, Vietnamese or Taiwanese. Though all of these countries are - in Asia.  Alas, you cannot select Siam as a country of origin on eBay - it has to be Thailand which encompasses, yes, you are right: many different ethnic groups.  This particular style of jewelry, however, was only made by Siamese jewelry makers. 

 

Rant over - off to watching a movie. Happy whatever to whomever! 

PW

Message 1 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

Below my pay grade.

Message 16 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

*a glimpse at how my brain functions*

 

Somebody says "Siam"

My Brain: "Getting to know you, Getting to know all about you"

🎶

penguins_dont_fly is a Volunteer Community Mentor
Buying and Selling since 2013

Message 17 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@mr.lincoln1 

In Georgia illegal is a sick bird.

"I have the right to remain silent but I didn't have the ability." Ron White, Fritch, Texas
"Stay away from negative people, they have a problem for every solution." A. Einstein
The Devil made me do it! - Flip Wilson
If the band can only play loud - they ain't no good - peps too J.R. Johnson
Message 18 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@goldenmeowie Thank you for sharing. I am a culture buff and love love love to hear about cultures - perhaps that is why I reacted with a big OUCH. And ethnicities! I guess New Zeeland would also be a good example, with the Maori and the White people from all types of cultures, how different ethnic groups can live in a certain geographic area, with all kinds or ethnic background. 

 

PW

Message 19 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@upgradedendmills You are correct, I did not list Hispanics - but thought about this later. Not that they deserve to be dismissed, not at all! I was just recapturing my trail of thoughts and I believe I wanted to mention that but ran out of time for editing, and then just said, Oh, well, what gives! I made my point already. But let me  make up for my omission by some  (hopefully) helpful (hopefully) information. 

 

Many poeople mistakenly believe Hispanics is the same as Mexican - which is totally not the case. There are Mexcican people who directly descend from the Maya and Aztec culture (so they are ethnically totally different, with a distinct language of their own, mostly still live in Guatemala, too, not just Mexico) and then there are those people who came in from Spain, under the gold rush (e.g., with Coronado who also brought the first horses to NM by the way and thus to the N. American continent because horses were not found here until then). El Dorado, as they called it, never existed, but Coronado and his troupes firmly believed that it did, and they arrived here with about 3,000 people and many were horse-riding soldiers). Those interested in learning more should check out the Coronado State Historic Monument online, to learn more. 

 

There were, of course, several other conquistadors and they were not all Spaniards but most were. Besides those with Mayan, Spanish or Aztec ancestry, there were also Natives from all kinds of ethnicites settled in what today is called Mexico and even the U.S. State of NM. 

 

Also interesting fact that the proportion of Hispnics and Latinos in NM was about 47% per  2012 Census data 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_Hispanic_and_Latino_population

 

which is currently probably a little bit higher. 

 

As for the difference between Hispanic and Latino, here is a good explanation for that: 

 

https://www.diffen.com/difference/Hispanic_vs_Latino

 

PW

Message 20 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@luckythewinner Yes, indeed - that my point, precisely - and when we expand the same statement to "every continent of the world" (which is what eBay is using in item specifics, as I pointed it out, calling the ethnicity of Siamese jewelry "Asian) then there is even more variety of ethnicites to think about!  One cannot just lump all Asian countries together as some ethnically homogenous snowball. The diversity and rich ethnic variations make for a treat for the history and culture buff like me. I think that eBay as an internationally active huge company could do a better job at determining the "ethnicity" of jewelry, and specifically, allow the seller to at least enter his / her own Country of Origin. It is not just Siam that is missing, try to find Bali - no luck! Yet, there are tons of Bali beaded jewelry and beautiful carvings from Bali and it is a distinct style. 

 

Thanks

PW

Message 21 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@penguins_dont_fly Sheesh, you are cracking me up! If I wanted to get to know someone closer, I would not say "SIAM" - but maybe, "MAIS." There. 

🐵

 

PW

Message 22 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@dippitydoo Thanks for your understanding and empathy! Yes, I do list Siamese jewelry with these words in title and description. The problem is, buyers who may search for ethnically specific jewelry will not get too far with Siamese as their search word, because per eBay (currently), such ethnicity does not exist, only "Asian" does. And while technically speaking Siam no longer exists, because it is now under Thailand - when it comes to Vintage and Antique jewelry, it still does! 

 

Have a great one

PW 🐵

Message 23 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@inhawaii "Asian" is not nearly as bad as "Oriental". 

 

I agree. Good reminder!  And while at it: Nobody should call the Inuit people "Eskimos," as they would feel greatly offended. 

 

PW

Message 24 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT


@prettywoman-2012 wrote:

@penguins_dont_fly Sheesh, you are cracking me up! If I wanted to get to know someone closer, I would not say "SIAM" - but maybe, "MAIS." There. 

🐵

 

PW


🎵Though you may not agree today, in time, mais oui, we may🎵

 

I've got a musical for any occasion LOL ... You never know what will trigger song lyrics in my head 🙂

 

Siam=The King and I=Getting to Know You

 

penguins_dont_fly is a Volunteer Community Mentor
Buying and Selling since 2013

Message 25 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

@bigdeals.etc Thank you for your input! You wrote, "There are many who deem the word oriental as offensive I think mainly because of how it was used in context in the past." I think much depends on the context the word Oriental is used in - for example, Oriental Philospphy and Religion (e.g., Confucius, Taoism or Daoism, Buddhism, Shintoism, etc.) or Oriental Medicine (e.g. alternative healing methods that are so different from the pill-pushing in Western medicin) to me, ring all kinds of positive " bells," and so does "Oriental Art," as I immediatelt think of the gorgeous porcelain from Satsuma, Kutani or Imari kilns, the ink-paintings, the pagodas and other architecture from ancient China and Japan, the Silk brocades etc., the many treaures of the "Orient." 

 

But used with derogatory connotation or accompanied with dismissive gesture or facial expression, the word "Oriental"  could definitely offend somebody. Asian Art would probably be just a collective noun, so if we wish to be precise, we need to call the Art we talk about exactly what it is - Chinese, Vietnamese, Taiwanese, or even more precisely, whatever ethnic group we think of. 

 

Thanks again, have a nice day! 

PW

Message 26 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

*a glimpse at how my brain functions*

 

Somebody says "Siam"

My Brain: "Getting to know you, Getting to know all about you"

 

I see the two cats Si and Am in Lady and the Tramp


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Message 27 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

That was supposed to be, "immediately." At least 2 mins for editing would be lo-ve-ly, eBay...

PW
Message 28 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

Oriental Medicine (e.g. alternative healing methods that are so different from the pill-pushing in Western medicien

 

acupuncture  - yay!

tiger bones, rhinoceros horn, black bear bile, musk deer musk, seahorse etc - boo!


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Message 29 of 41
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Re: Since when is "Asian" an ethnicity? OMG - RANT

"Oriental" is a rug







We Don't Want the Government to Shut Down

We Want them to SHUT UP!

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