Return Request

[samz54]

My return policy is 30 days. Buyer ordered back in April and just requested a return saying item is not as described. Do I need to approve this return if it's out of my 30 day return policy?

[chrysylys]

No, but be aware they can go to PP for 180 days and then their CC for up to a year in many cases.

What exactly is their complaint and are you absolutely certain of your position?

[chrysylys]

Also, when did they RECEIVE the item?

[myboardid]

You received bad advice above.  Yes, when a buyer opens a "not as decribed" case, you should accept the return.  Otherwise they can go to Paypal and get the same refund.  Your life will be much easier if you just accept now. 

[samz54]

Thanks, what's the longest time a buyer can open a request on ebay for item not as described? It was delivered April 21. Doesn't seem too fair if buyer has that much time to open a request because they could have used it and broke it or something.

If they open up a request in paypal, what options do they have? They can open up an item not as described there as well?

If you "close the return" how does it affect sellers?

[mistwomandancing]

For the best outcome, even if you HATE having to do it, is to accept the return and refund the buyer, or.. simply refund the buyer if the item is something you no longer want back.

And, of course it isn't fair.  You already state 30 days to return, and it's past that.  BUT, as stated above, your buyer can simply go through PayPal for up to 180 days for this return, so you're going to be out of luck, one way or another. 

Best to take care of this problem right here, right now.  Just take care of it and bring it to an end.  It's one of the stinkin' down sides to sales.  Especially when you aren't selling on your OWN website, or out of your OWN little brick & mortar shop, where you can make the rules. 

Figure this as one of the things that goes into the Business Loss column.  Most merchandise sales-type businesses face this too.  The returns for money back, when it's obvious the buyer did the damage, the shoplifting, the damages to merchandise that happen right in the shop and then are hidden.. where you find the broken plate hidden back behind the stack of kitchen towels on a shelf, etc.  Business loss.  Unfair.  Part of it all, never-the-less.  Stinks.

[terrycanarsky]

Honestly, call eBay.  Hopefully you have a decent working relationship with CustServ and a strong record of good sales.

As stated here, the return is outside the 30 day mark (and for reference, that time starts when the item is delivered/received).  For eBay purposes, it's important to have that papertrail of dates.  Document as much as you can, call eBay and explain the matter *before* you accept/decline. 

PayPal tends to not be so picky about pesky things like dates and truth.   So be prepared for a PayPal case in which you will again have to provide all the documentation.  The key thing is that you will have already gone through eBay channels - and that actually does seem to hold a little bit of weight in a PayPal dispute (no guarantee, of course, but it looks better for your case if eBay has already said you're not at fault).

Seems lately to be a rash of buyers who are less-than-upstanding (diplomatic language here 😉 ).  I'm getting tired of these petty thieves.

~Melody R

[terrycanarsky]

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@samz54 wrote:

Thanks, what's the longest time a buyer can open a request on ebay for item not as described?

If they open up a request in paypal, what options do they have? They can open up an item not as described there as well?

If you "close the return" how does it affect sellers?

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IMPORTANT  (from eBay policy page):  "If it's too late to start a return, it's up to the seller to decide whether or not he or she will accept a late return. Contact the seller for more information."

eBay offers a 30-day money-back guarantee, no questions asked.  Their policy, taken directly from the "What timelines should I be aware of" tab: 

• Seller’s return window: Review the seller’s return policy and return window before you make a purchase.
• If you did not receive the item, or the item is not as described, you have 30 days from your actual or latest estimated delivery date to open a request, under the eBay Money Back Guarantee.

PayPal is a bit different. 

Step 1 - Open dispute right away

You can open a disputeA buyer asks for a seller's help in resolving an issue with a transaction. in the Resolution CenterLocated in My Account, the PayPal resource for resolving issues between buyers and ... to contact a seller directly and resolveA buyer and seller come to an agreement and close the case, or PayPal comes to a decision and... a problematic transaction. You have 180 days from the payment date to open a dispute. Common reasons for opening a dispute include:

• You paid for an item but haven't received it and the seller is uncooperative or nonresponsive.
• You received an item that was significantly different than described.  (emphasis mine)
  

Click the Dispute a Transaction button in the Resolution Center to open a dispute. Then, provide more information about the issue and post a message to the seller.

Transactions older than 180 days cannot be disputed but should still be reported. PayPal tracks seller performance trends in the event we need to take action to protect other buyers.

[samz54]

What proof can you provide if they were to open a case that the item was not as described in paypal? It just seems like it would be my word against the buyer....What if you were to sell something very expensive and the buyer opens up a paypal case for item not as described?

[terrycanarsky]

This is where a strong listing and good pictures are so important.  You have the opportunity of providing the photos, etc., to PayPal to prove your case - as does the buyer. 

In many ways, this *is* a he said/she said.  In the end, the decision to fight it or to just refund boils down to how much money you're losing and integrity.  Recently we just fought a long battle with a less-than-upstanding buyer; eBay refunded the monies (from their coffers because of their  30-day policy) but the case was found in our favor due to our documentation, photos, and honesty. 

~Melody R

[threshold.sales.group]

Fwiw, nobody here has any idea whether of not the buyer will request a return through Paypal if you deny the return on eBay.  If they do you're just in the same situation you are now - except that the buyer pays return shipping on a paypal return - an advantage to you, compared to the current open request on eBay that will have you paying the return shipping.

IMO, 30 days past recept is plenty of time to determine if the item is in the condition described. You are not providing a warranty - just responsible for the item being as described at delivery.  

[myangelandmyprincess]

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@threshold.sales.group wrote:

Fwiw, nobody here has any idea whether of not the buyer will request a return through Paypal if you deny the return on eBay.  If they do you're just in the same situation you are now - except that the buyer pays return shipping on a paypal return - an advantage to you, compared to the current open request on eBay that will have you paying the return shipping.

IMO, 30 days past recept is plenty of time to determine if the item is in the condition described. You are not providing a warranty - just responsible for the item being as described at delivery.  

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This.  I have no idea why anyone is saying accept this return just because the buyer might go to PayPal.  At least with PayPal the buyer has to pay to return 

[retrose1]

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@myangelandmyprincess wrote:

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@threshold.sales.group wrote:

Fwiw, nobody here has any idea whether of not the buyer will request a return through Paypal if you deny the return on eBay.  If they do you're just in the same situation you are now - except that the buyer pays return shipping on a paypal return - an advantage to you, compared to the current open request on eBay that will have you paying the return shipping.

IMO, 30 days past recept is plenty of time to determine if the item is in the condition described. You are not providing a warranty - just responsible for the item being as described at delivery.  

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This.  I have no idea why anyone is saying accept this return just because the buyer might go to PayPal.  At least with PayPal the buyer has to pay to return 

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Double this.....^^^^^^^^^

And the pal keeps a little better track of buyer complaints because in many cases the pal is footing the bill for the return shipping and they lose all their fees when the refund happens.

If I were the OP, I would call ebay and have a US CS take a look and close the dispute for you.  If they open with the pal, the OP saves on return shipping.

[megadestroyers]

A return request does NOT immediately equate to a refund.  Accept the return request, but issue NO refund at the time of acceptance, not even a partial.  Here's how it should go, imho:

Buyer requests return (and not simply via message.  Has to be initiated through ebays return process).  Accept return with short statement saying "please return.  Full refund will be issued once item RECEIVED and verified in same condition".  Then no more back and forth.  Ball now in buyers court.

Depending on your buyers location, you may have to pay return shipping (US).  If your buyer is located off-shore but used a US forwarding shipper, you do NOT have to pay for return shipping from his off-shore address.  The buyer also has a certain time limit (5 biz days) in which to return the item.  Off-shore buyers who use a US forwarding shipper address are held to the same time standard.  The buyer also needs to return the item via same method it was sent, and provide tracking.

It may be cost prohibitive for the buyer to initiate a return, or just too much of a hassle.  They may also be unfamiliar with the return requirements they have, and figure it's not worth it.  Then they'll ask for a partial refund??

If you know the buyer requirements in the return process, you may not want to rush off and send a reply to a potential partial refund request.  Think about it for a day or two.  Whatever you know of your buyers location (off-shore?) should help in your decision whether to issue a partial or not.  Me?  Nope!!

Now, if the buyer returns item and meets all return requirements, and you receive the item, you have 6 days to issue a refund.  If the item is NOT in the same condition as sent, you MAY have a snowballs chance of documenting this, taking it to ebay, and actually have them rule in your favor.  Snowballs.  But hey, who knows........  If your satisfied with the process, issue refund.  Then go about and enjoy the rest of your day.

Now, the fly on the giant pile of cr.............Paypal.  At anytime during the return process through ebay, right up to the second ebay may decide on a claim, your buyer can open a claim on Paypal.  Yeah.  It sucks!  If that happens, the ebay claim will immediately close, regardless of where you are in the process.  What Paypal does, seller defect generation, etc, etc..............well (shoulder shrug).........

Good luck.

[mistwomandancing]

So many great viewpoints here and ways to consider handling this buyer request.  Many thoughtful answers here, and perfectly illustrates one of the greatest strengths of these discussion boards... the various ways to handle problems/requests/buyers here, given for your consideration.