NEW PAYPAL POLICY DOES NOT REFUND SELLER'S FEES IN CASE OF RETURNS / FREE RETURNS. WHAT WE DO ?

[ancientcoins.market]

Hello folks.

Did you know ?....  Paypal new policy does not refund seller's fees in case of a return / free return ??

HERE IT IS :

Amendments to the PayPal Account User Agreement. We’re changing how we treat refunds. If you refund (partially or fully) a transaction to a buyer or a donation to a donor, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid as the seller will not be returned to you.

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What do we do now  ???

If paypal doesn't refund seller's fees and a buyer forces a return on eBay, all sellers will start losing big money.

Any ideas folks ???

[gracieallen01]

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@ancientcoins.market wrote:

Hello folks.

Did you know ?....  Paypal new policy does not refund seller's fees in case of a return / free return ??

HERE IT IS :

Amendments to the PayPal Account User Agreement. We’re changing how we treat refunds. If you refund (partially or fully) a transaction to a buyer or a donation to a donor, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid as the seller will not be returned to you.

--------------------------------

What do we do now  ???

If paypal doesn't refund seller's fees and a buyer forces a return on eBay, all sellers will start losing big money.

Any ideas folks ???

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Go on to Managed Payments and hope that ebay doesn't follow suit.   

As the ebay and PayPal TOS state, 'if you don't agree, close your account' - adapt or move on.

[twnpopcards]

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@atifaslam6 wrote:

Hi,

I don't really understand how that works, I'm a newbie seller with a paypal account. I only know that ebay takes a 10% fee on the transaction, and paypal takes ~5% fee, but that is deducted from the buyer's transaction, say he paid $100, I will receive ~$95 and the ~5% is paypal fees, but I gave my item away in return for $95, making me lose $5 in fees.

If buyer returns the item, wouldn't the $95 transaction bounce back to the buyer and he'd be the one to lose the $5 fees? How will I as a seller make a loss on that, sorry for not being able to comprehend.

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@atifaslam6 

Unfortunately you will not be able to recover that $5 fee, it will become another cost of doing business on Ebay or any other site where you us Paypal.  The difference is that most sites do not have the return rates and policies that Ebay does so basically Paypal is tired of doing all the work only to refund the money because Ebay encourages the buyer to return the item for whatever reason.  I am not at all surprised at this move as Paypal has had to eat all the refund costs every time that Ebay makes it easier for buyers trying to increase their traffic and sales.  

Ebay is doing nothing but chasing sellers who are also buyers away with all these changes and that is reflected in Ebays lack of growth in recent quarters.  So the only way you will be able to recover that money is to do what Ebay doesn't want, raise your prices to cover these costs.  Ebay keeps sending out Emails trying to get sellers to lower their prices but they forget that Sellers have to be able to make a profit that is worth their time and effort and every time they make moves that increase costs, Sellers have to react or go out of business.  

This time Paypal reacted and it will have a negative effect on Ebays growth as more Sellers leave Ebay or stop selling their nicer items on Ebay due to the refund policy.

[atifaslam6]

Hey I think you wrongly understood my question, as your answer seems to go way beyond what I wanted to understand.

I will say it again, buyer pays $100, paypal takes $5 fees from THAT PAYMENT. Seller receives $95 total. Buyer issues return, seller refunds full money he obtained($95), buyer receives $95 WITHOUT FEES of $5 because new policy.

Where is the loss from the seller's side as stated? That's what I was asking, or maybe I didn't understand your answer. It's the buyer who is at a loss right? Or is it not?

[ensus2015]

 Actually paypal fee is 2.9%, but sticking with your example: buyer pays full amount of $100, Paypal takes $5 fee, seller receives $95.

   Buyer opens return, seller has to refund full $100 with Paypal keeping the $5 fee they initially received.   Seller is out full amount of $100. 

[atifaslam6]

Oh now I get it, so paypal takes an additional $5 from our account to refund the buyer's full amount, that sucks.

[thevintagesilvershop]

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@atifaslam6 wrote:

Oh now I get it, so paypal takes an additional $5 from our account to refund the buyer's full amount, that sucks.

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Yes, that $5?  The seller used to get that back. With the new policy, they don’t. 

[gracieallen01]

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@atifaslam6 wrote:

Hey I think you wrongly understood my question, as your answer seems to go way beyond what I wanted to understand.

I will say it again, buyer pays $100, paypal takes $5 fees from THAT PAYMENT. Seller receives $95 total. Buyer issues return, seller refunds full money he obtained($95), buyer receives $95 WITHOUT FEES of $5 because new policy.

Where is the loss from the seller's side as stated? That's what I was asking, or maybe I didn't understand your answer. It's the buyer who is at a loss right? Or is it not?

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The buyer paid $100 - the buyer gets $100 back.  It doesn't matter if the seller only gets $95 - the buyer gets $100 back.

Who do you think forks over the $5.00?

[nkpina2014]

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@buyselljack2016 wrote:

 Did we know?  Well yes, some did, as there have been some threads already, and anyone using(accepting) PayPal was notified.

That will go away when we all transition  are forced into "managed payments" processed for eBay by Adyen.   PayPal will no longer be a problem. Then eBay can do the same thing if desired. Other posts on this subject seem to state that this is a very common practice among "funds processors".  

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That's not due until 2022 sometime. Just because you are using Managed Payments does not mean that you don't accept PayPal (note: right now PayPal is disallowed, but supposed to be put on the Managed Payments list shortly).

So yeah, for 3 years (or more!) sellers are supposed to eat fees when buyers want to cancel a transaction or return an item? Atrocious.

[nkpina2014]

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@ittybitnot wrote:

I would suggest that the new PayPal policy is going to adversely affect "cancellation" requests......"So sorry, I missed your message.  Your item has already been shipped." 

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And then it becomes "So sorry, your item is significantly not as described. Refund me and pay shipping back"

[mam98031]

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@nkpina2014 wrote:

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@buyselljack2016 wrote:

 Did we know?  Well yes, some did, as there have been some threads already, and anyone using(accepting) PayPal was notified.

That will go away when we all transition  are forced into "managed payments" processed for eBay by Adyen.   PayPal will no longer be a problem. Then eBay can do the same thing if desired. Other posts on this subject seem to state that this is a very common practice among "funds processors".  

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That's not due until 2022 sometime. Just because you are using Managed Payments does not mean that you don't accept PayPal (note: right now PayPal is disallowed, but supposed to be put on the Managed Payments list shortly).

So yeah, for 3 years (or more!) sellers are supposed to eat fees when buyers want to cancel a transaction or return an item? Atrocious.

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They announced last week [I think] they are now rolling in PP into the MP program.  They are ahead of schedule which is a good thing.  They had originally announced last year that it would be the summer of 2019 before PP was added.

You may not have to wait another year or two to be part of MP.  There should be another round of invitations going out sometime this summer.  For me, I would sign up once I'm confident they have their refund process resolved and PP is accepted.

[radtech1971]

I am not buying any new inventory, just get rid of what I have and then sayonara to all this stress. It used to be fun but eBay and PayPal have sucked out the last bit of enthusiasm I had left.

[micsett-99]

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@ancientcoins.market wrote:

Hello folks.

Did you know ?....  Paypal new policy does not refund seller's fees in case of a return / free return ??

HERE IT IS :

Amendments to the PayPal Account User Agreement. We’re changing how we treat refunds. If you refund (partially or fully) a transaction to a buyer or a donation to a donor, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid as the seller will not be returned to you.

--------------------------------

What do we do now  ???

If paypal doesn't refund seller's fees and a buyer forces a return on eBay, all sellers will start losing big money.

Any ideas folks ???

---

I'll tell you what I'm going to do.  I'm going to put a disclaimer in my returns policy that 1) If a buyer buys an item and then wants to cancel before the order is shipped?  We will refund the order "minus" the paypal processing fee due to Paypal's new policy.  2) We will still offer free returns, however, the purchase price will be returned "minus" the paypal processing fee due to Paypal's new policy.

That's pretty much it.  The items we sell are wayyyy too expensive to eat the processing costs of cancellations or returns.  That's the bottom line.  That cost will have to passed off to the consumer.

And if everyone adopts this policy?  This "returns are great" culture that ebay has been trying to create with consumers?  Will go away really quickly..

[mam98031]

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@micsett-99 wrote:

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@ancientcoins.market wrote:

Hello folks.

Did you know ?....  Paypal new policy does not refund seller's fees in case of a return / free return ??

HERE IT IS :

Amendments to the PayPal Account User Agreement. We’re changing how we treat refunds. If you refund (partially or fully) a transaction to a buyer or a donation to a donor, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid as the seller will not be returned to you.

--------------------------------

What do we do now  ???

If paypal doesn't refund seller's fees and a buyer forces a return on eBay, all sellers will start losing big money.

Any ideas folks ???

---

I'll tell you what I'm going to do.  I'm going to put a disclaimer in my returns policy that 1) If a buyer buys an item and then wants to cancel before the order is shipped?  We will refund the order "minus" the paypal processing fee due to Paypal's new policy.  2) We will still offer free returns, however, the purchase price will be returned "minus" the paypal processing fee due to Paypal's new policy.

That's pretty much it.  The items we sell are wayyyy too expensive to eat the processing costs of cancellations or returns.  That's the bottom line.  That cost will have to passed off to the consumer.

And if everyone adopts this policy?  This "returns are great" culture that ebay has been trying to create with consumers?  Will go away really quickly..

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You may be unpleasantly surprised when you try to add some qualifications to your return policy.  That option is gone.  Or at least on all my listings it went poof when they started Free Returns and I no longer have access to the box that you'd put it in as well.

[ancientcoins.market]

Let's turn this from Negative to Positive. 

We posted in our listings that in case of returns you will get full refund minus paypal fees since they are not refundable any more.  

This will deter  buyer's remorse returns.  

All sellers must do the same and most importantly DO IT NOW ! 

[mam98031]

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@ancientcoins.market wrote:

Let's turn this from Negative to Positive. 

We posted in our listings that in case of returns you will get full refund minus paypal fees since they are not refundable any more.  

This will deter  buyer's remorse returns.  

All sellers must do the same and most importantly DO IT NOW ! 

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This is a listing violation.  So when or if the Ebay bots find it, they will close your listings.  We are not allowed to do as you state.  You can't enforce it.  And it is against Ebay policy.  You may want to reconsider having this on your listings.  But of course it is completely your decision to make.