eBay

macprofessionals2012 · ‎05-17-2015

I sold a laptop to someone on eBay. He inititally opened a return because he said there was something wrong with it. I contacted him and worked it out, but he then went and opened a chargeback saying he was just doing it to cover himself and would cancel it once the laptop was fixed.

(For full discloure, what actually happened was the buyer was using the laptop and installed updates that made it stop booting up. The laptop was under IBM warranty. I helped him contact IBM, they repaired it, he confirmed all is good. I was in no way responsible and the item I listed was exactly as described.)

He told me he cancelled the chargeback on April 24th when the laptop was returned to him by IBM. PayPal within a few days of this took the money from me because they claimed I was not covered for this chargeback (they don't cover merchandise chargebacks) and PayPal claims they are fighting the chargeback on my behalf. The buyer on the other hand has been showing suspicious behavior since then, dodging my requests for info or proof he cancelled the chargeback.

PayPal as usual is of absolutely no help whatsoever. If you call them they are rude and just say there's nothing they can do, it takes 70 days, whatever the credit card company decides is final. One guy told me to stop wasting my time. The laptop was $1200 so it's a lot of money we are talking here.

Right now the buyer is with the item, I am without the money and I have also been charged a penalty fee of $20 by PayPal.

If the credit card company sides with the buyer, what are my options? Obviosuly PayPal and eBay could care less.

A police report? Small claims court?

redbud_farm · ‎05-17-2015

You try and get the credit cards customer service # and see what your options are in getting item returned.

Pay pal won't help

age is a measure of time , wisdom is the measure of how we used that time

sandypurins · ‎05-17-2015

@macprofessionals2012 wrote:
PayPal claims they are fighting the chargeback on my behalf.

If the credit card company sides with the buyer, what are my options? Obviosuly PayPal and eBay could care less.

A police report? Small claims court?

My experience is that PayPal will submit (to the buyer's credit card company) whatever information you've provided to dispute the chargeback. The buyer's credit card company will review the information and make a decision... usually within 70 days.

Some credit card companies will require the buyer to show proof that the item has been returned to the seller... others will just require the buyer to make the item available for the seller to pickup.

ugu-bubu · ‎05-17-2015

there is nothing you can do right now, until payPal cosed the chargback case in your or buyers favor. of they will close it to buyers favor give a call to the police department where buyer lives and ask them if you could make a report over the phone or online and send them info to prove that the money was taken from your account and you never received your item back. than I would file a small claim, but the thing with small claim - you need to serve it, which is nor that easy sometime. however you can do that (serve) when police investigator will call you and the buyer for questioning.

we are going to file a small claim because our buyer damaged the item and than filed a chargeback and returned it. the other buyer took pars from a laptop and returned it. we already made a report (over the phone and online) waiting for investigator to call us.

ebay and paypal WILL NOT PROTECT YOU. if you are selling expensive items ir might be better for you to get you own merchant account instead of Paypal.

anyway - DO NOT LET IT GO!!!

craigsdieselrepair · ‎05-17-2015

We once had a 40,000.00 charge back at the shop. It took over 6 months to be resolved. Luckily, we had already taken all money out of the account the card company had access to. They tried to hit that account for the $40,000 but my bank had also already put blocks on the account so they couldn't touch it anyway. I knew from talking to the card holder, he was going to try to pull something, so we were proactive. The card holder was pretty desperate since he was going out of business. He wanted part of the money back and for us to let him make payments to us on that amount. We couldn't do such a thing so he filed the chargeback claiming unauthorized use. Our attorney also got involved though. I don't even know who he spoke with or what all he did, he was a good friend by that time and did small favors for us at no charge and he pretty much took over the whole case. We ended up getting a letter over 6 months later that stated the chargeback had been resolved, and our account was zeroed out, meaning we owed nothing to the card company.

I learned from that experience, the more money involved, the longer it takes to get a chargeback fully resolved. I had closed out that merchant account. We were pretty upset that they were willing to take $40,000 back at the drop of a hat. I will not ever accept a payment for such a high dollar amount again through a credit card payment. It's to easy for someone to claim unauthorized usage, etc. and you will lose the money unless you are willing to fight, and possibly involve an attorney.

savanna.dance · ‎05-17-2015

Wow, wow and wow! The more I read the boards, the more shocking things I learn. I would have been sick to death with worry over a $40,000 chargeback. Who am I kidding, I would be sick over a couple of hundred.

·•❖•· the wolf you feed wins ·•❖•·

toppiehunter · ‎05-18-2015

I would direct paypal to look at the messages between you and the buyer if it were done on ebay and also that you shipped to the

confirmed paypal address (assuming you did).

I would sure let the buyer know that if for any reason this gets chargeback you will be filing mail fraud, police reports etc. since it's

such a large amount of money.

If you have an attorney have them send him a certified letter. If not, you may want to type up a letter yourself and do the same.

toppiehunter · ‎05-18-2015

From the threads on chargeback I have read, upload the tracking to paypal and if you sent it to the address with signature

confirmation you should be okay. If you didn't use signature confirmation and/or didn't ship it to the paypal address they used on

checkout you may have a problem.

Here is another thread with some info

http://community.ebay.com/t5/Selling/Paypal-Chargeback-Panic-Attack/m-p/23178239/highlight/true#M362...

sandypurins · ‎05-18-2015

@toppiehunter wrote:
From the threads on chargeback I have read, upload the tracking to paypal and if you sent it to the address with signature confirmation you should be okay. If you didn't use signature confirmation and/or didn't ship it to the paypal address they used on checkout you may have a problem.

That applies to INR (Item Not Received) and Unauthorized Transaction situations both of which are covered by PayPal's Seller Protection Policy. The OP's situation is a SNAD (Significantly Not As Described) chargeback. SNAD chargebacks are not covered by PayPal's Seller Protection Policy.

toppiehunter · ‎05-18-2015

@sandypurins wrote:
@toppiehunter wrote:
From the threads on chargeback I have read, upload the tracking to paypal and if you sent it to the address with signature confirmation you should be okay. If you didn't use signature confirmation and/or didn't ship it to the paypal address they used on checkout you may have a problem.
That applies to INR (Item Not Received) and Unauthorized Transaction situations both of which are covered by PayPal's Seller Protection Policy. The OP's situation is a SNAD (Significantly Not As Described) chargeback. SNAD chargebacks are not covered by PayPal's Seller Protection Policy.

That's true. When he said the case had been opened and he worked it out, I assumed that meant the case was closed and then the person filed an unathorized use chargeback but if it was for SNAD I agree.

craigsdieselrepair · ‎05-18-2015

If the card company would have gotten their hands on that money, I would have been sick to death. LOL

They said the problem was, I didn't get the card holder's signature authorizing the usage of the card. Well, he was out of state, and a pretty good friend to Craig and I, we traveled with him and his wife quite a bit so I had no reason at the time of payment to think anything would go wrong. He had paid higher bills than that in the past with no problems. But, he ran into financial problems and money seems to bring out the worst in people. Luckily I did have him on a recording, giving me the card info and authorizing the payment, which our attorney ran with that. It was a mess but since the card company couldn't get their hands on the money, I wasn't too worried. Now, had they gotten the money, it may have ended very differently. LOL

I asked the guy from the card company when we first spoke, when he was using the no signature excuse, I asked him 'what about people who purchase items online, from Wal Mart, etc. so they can just claim unauthorized usage and get their money back and keep the item since the online company has no sig.?' He stated yes they can. So I told him I had to go, I had a bunch of credit cards and I was going on a shopping spree. LOL He said I shouldn't do that, and I hung up the phone and my attorney talked to them from that point on. Of course I didn't do such a thing, I was just being difficult I guess. LOL

Christa

rarecoinbroker · ‎05-18-2015

@craigsdieselrepair wrote:

I asked the guy from the card company when we first spoke, when he was using the no signature excuse, I asked him 'what about people who purchase items online, from Wal Mart, etc. so they can just claim unauthorized usage and get their money back and keep the item since the online company has no sig.?' He stated yes they can.

Christa

^ One of the dirty secrets of online sales.

That story is a great lesson for online (no signature / card not present) sellers to take to heart.

timetochow · ‎05-18-2015

@rarecoinbroker wrote:
@craigsdieselrepair wrote:

I asked the guy from the card company when we first spoke, when he was using the no signature excuse, I asked him 'what about people who purchase items online, from Wal Mart, etc. so they can just claim unauthorized usage and get their money back and keep the item since the online company has no sig.?' He stated yes they can.

Christa
^ One of the dirty secrets of online sales.

That story is a great lesson for online (no signature / card not present) sellers to take to heart.

This is true,if you accept credit card online,you dont get a signature from the customer,you dont even getto see the back of the card for his signature/

What most merchants do is to call the customer's cc issuer and verify the identity and the charge,some will call the customer and chat on the phone,some crooks can be friendly and chat with you.

Without your own merchant account ,you are relying on PAYPAL and there are some information about the case which would not be revealed to you,afterall it is Paypal who owns the merchant acount,not you and they dont want to talk to you.

timetochow · ‎05-18-2015

Paypal is not always useless,but Paypal would not tell you much about the case except submit your side of the story to your buyer's cc issuer.

The clerk on the other end review many cases,you need to be provide facts and relevant correspondence to prove your point and make sure it is clear and not to confuse the clerk,

It looks like the best you can do is to ask for the laptop back.

(There are situations where Paypal can submit more information gathered on their end,esp with cases where the cardholder claimed he did not authorise the charge and did not buy the item,but Paypal trails showed he has been on a buying spree and made multiple purchases but just disputing yours)

Once I won a charegback for INR by submitting an email from the buyer who told me she has paid customs on that item.