eBay

ibuyyoulongtime · ‎09-19-2019

I know most of you will have noticed a huge increase in canceled transactions over the past year. My worst day was a month ago with 5 cancelations. I wont get started on the huge increase in fraudulent returns as that's a rant for another day.

I've noticed that some of these buyer cancelations seem to just be used to get free feedback (buying the cheapest item) which is rather annoying since their "free feedback" costs me $0.30 in paypal fees every time. Luckily paypal "for now" backed off on not refunding any fees at all on canceled transactions or it would be a nightmare come true.

eBay needs to remove all feedback when an item is canceled by the buyer and accepted by the seller. That would put a dead stop to people using it for free feedback. In-fact I'd be far more happy if ebay did away with the buyer cancelation option. Its just making buyer less and less responsible, in a world where they barely even read the title let alone the description.

This is not my selling account...

myjunqueyourtreasure · ‎09-22-2019

@buyselljack2016 wrote:
@ibuyyoulongtime wrote:
Ebay has already started to implement their new payment system. Once its fully in place (probably over a year from now) I will probably fully switch to it.
I'm investing more away from ebay every day anyways because I know it's going down the hole slowly.
I will look into the options for auto feedback (probably been years since I looked at them) I just can't be bothered do it manually as its hundreds of sales a week.
If I had hundreds of sales a week buyer free feedback would not be a concern.

I do not see the logic in a "buy and cancel" for meaningless buyer feedback. Not sure that I think that is happening.

I'm more inclined to believe that eBay displayed an item for a lower cost right after purchase prompting the cancel request. Something that did not show during their search, or they did not search well enough for it to display.

Yep, I had an almost instant cancellation (hit the button by mistake they said) yet they later left me positive FB saying they 'loved it' which leads me to believe they canx mine and bought a cheaper one.

Reality is the leading cause of stress.

equid0x · ‎09-22-2019

@mam98031 wrote:
@equid0x wrote:
@pjcdn2005 wrote:
@mam98031 wrote:
@ibuyyoulongtime wrote:
The key info is "credit cards or debit card processed through the seller's internet merchant account" that pretty much coveres every card processor.
PayPal is so intergrated into the buyers ebay experience still I'd say not accepting them any time soon would hurt sales allot.
Most sellers posting here don't have their own Merchant accounts.

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/listings/choosing-get-paid/accepting-credit-debit-cards?id=4185

Even if they have their own merchant account, they haven’t been able to use them on eBay since May 1.
Ahh haa. So we're all just individual privately run businesses?

I've never had an advertising agency tell me which payment processor I must use before.
Then you've never sold on Amazon. There is one choice and one choice only on Amazon as there will be on Ebay in a couple years. Etsy is the same way. Other sites have limited options. Ebay has always had limited options.

I will point out that Amazon is already under investigation for violation of FLSA and the exact question that the Cali legislation touches on has been asked by the FTC: Are Amazon sellers employees?

edit to add:

I currently do and have been selling on Amazon for quite some time now... like YEARS.

mam98031 · ‎09-22-2019

@equid0x wrote:
@mam98031 wrote:
@equid0x wrote:
@pjcdn2005 wrote:
@mam98031 wrote:
@ibuyyoulongtime wrote:
The key info is "credit cards or debit card processed through the seller's internet merchant account" that pretty much coveres every card processor.
PayPal is so intergrated into the buyers ebay experience still I'd say not accepting them any time soon would hurt sales allot.
Most sellers posting here don't have their own Merchant accounts.

https://www.ebay.com/help/selling/listings/choosing-get-paid/accepting-credit-debit-cards?id=4185

Even if they have their own merchant account, they haven’t been able to use them on eBay since May 1.
Ahh haa. So we're all just individual privately run businesses?

I've never had an advertising agency tell me which payment processor I must use before.
Then you've never sold on Amazon. There is one choice and one choice only on Amazon as there will be on Ebay in a couple years. Etsy is the same way. Other sites have limited options. Ebay has always had limited options.
I will point out that Amazon is already under investigation for violation of FLSA and the exact question that the Cali legislation touches on has been asked by the FTC: Are Amazon sellers employees?

edit to add:
I currently do and have been selling on Amazon for quite some time now... like YEARS.

Your posts often leave me scratching my head. This is no exception. My guess is we aren't going to find any common ground here so I'll move on.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

vie_3448 · ‎09-22-2019

ebay is a great place

vie_3448 · ‎09-22-2019

Thanks for the answers that made me so happy

min-266710 · ‎09-22-2019

Great answer

min-266710 · ‎09-22-2019

I like this answer of yours thanks for that

equid0x · ‎09-22-2019

@mam98031 wrote:
Your posts often leave me scratching my head. This is no exception. My guess is we aren't going to find any common ground here so I'll move on.

https://burruezolaw.com/independent-contractor-or-employee-part-1-the-flsa-perspective/

"The FLSA factors are:

The extent to which the work performed is an integral part of the employer’s business. If the worker’s job is an integral part of the employer’s services, this points to an employee relationship.
The worker’s opportunity for profit or loss depending on his or her managerial skill. The hiring and supervision of workers, or investment in equipment to affect the opportunity for profit or loss suggests that the worker is an independent contractor.
The extent of the relative investments of the employer and the worker. If a worker shares the risk of loss with the employer, this suggests an independent contractor relationship.
Whether the work performed requires special skills and initiative. A worker who demonstrates skill and initiative to operate as an independent business indicates an independent contractor relationship.
The permanency of the relationship. An temporary relationship suggests (but does not determine) an independent contractor relationship.
The degree of control exercised or retained by the employer. For example: If the employer sets pay amounts and work hours, determines how the work will be performed indicates an employee relationship. If the worker is free to work for others or hire helpers, this indicates an independent contractor relationship."

...

"More recently, in an ongoing matter at the time of writing this article, courier workers serving the online retail giant Amazon are challenging the company for misclassifying them. In October of 2015, a number of Amazon Prime Now drivers working for an Amazon courier subcontractor sued Amazon in California alleging that the company had misclassified them as independent contractors, and it owed them wages and other benefits under FLSA laws. A second lawsuit was filed in Phoenix in January 2016 with similar allegations. The drivers allege they must cover their own work-related expenses, including providing their own vehicles and gasoline, but they have also been asked to wear Amazon uniforms and take Amazon surveys. In an effort to mitigate penalties, Amazon has decided to re-classify these workers as employees, while the suits are pending."

https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/2/20751705/ebay-amazon-managers-lawsuit-poaching-racketeering-fraud

"Online retailer eBay has sued three Amazon managers for allegedly infiltrating eBay’s platform to poach sellers. The lawsuit, filed earlier this week in California, claims Amazon employees signed up for eBay under false names and pretenses. Then, they would allegedly send private messages inviting sellers to Amazon, actively circumventing eBay’s rules and filters.

eBay has accused Amazon of poaching before. It sent a cease and desist letter last October, alleging that 50 Amazon sales representatives sent over 1,000 messages to eBay sellers. Amazon promised a “thorough investigation,” but eBay proceeded with a lawsuit that was later sent to arbitration. This new suit focuses on a few higher-up figures that eBay accuses of racketeering and fraud over their allegedly coordinated behavior."

Are we independent contractors if eBay thinks it can sue Amazon for "poaching" its sellers? I've never heard the term "poaching" applied to anyone who is not an employee.

mam98031 · ‎09-22-2019

No we are are NOT "independent contractors". Ebay didn't hire us to do anything. You always miss a critical part to all of this. To be an "independent contractor" for Ebay, first they would need to hire us and second they would need to pay us. Neither of which they do. We in essences hire Ebay to be the site we have chosen to run our little businesses on. We pay Ebay for the use of their site. Ebay does NOT pay any seller for anything. We are not sub contractors for Ebay.

Sellers are independent businesses one and all. Yes we have to adhere to the rules of the site to sell here, but that is no different than any other similar site. We can choose to sell here or we can choose not to. That is always within our power.

I don't know why you are going way off topic to want to discuss the Ebay law suit against Amazon. It has absolutely nothing to do with anything being discussed here. Ebay is suing Amazon for using Ebay owned software to try and poach active sellers on the Ebay site. They used the Ebay email system. That has nothing to do with anything being discussed here.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

the*dog*ate*my*tablecloth · ‎09-23-2019

Your legal cases are referring to couriers hired by Amazon to deliver packages. That is totally different from third party sellers who hire Amazon to advertise their items.

equid0x · ‎09-25-2019

@mam98031 wrote:
No we are are NOT "independent contractors". Ebay didn't hire us to do anything. You always miss a critical part to all of this. To be an "independent contractor" for Ebay, first they would need to hire us and second they would need to pay us. Neither of which they do. We in essences hire Ebay to be the site we have chosen to run our little businesses on. We pay Ebay for the use of their site. Ebay does NOT pay any seller for anything. We are not sub contractors for Ebay.

Sellers are independent businesses one and all. Yes we have to adhere to the rules of the site to sell here, but that is no different than any other similar site. We can choose to sell here or we can choose not to. That is always within our power.

I don't know why you are going way off topic to want to discuss the Ebay law suit against Amazon. It has absolutely nothing to do with anything being discussed here. Ebay is suing Amazon for using Ebay owned software to try and poach active sellers on the Ebay site. They used the Ebay email system. That has nothing to do with anything being discussed here.

There is basically zero legal difference between an "independent contractor" and an "independent business". All "independent contractors" ARE "independent businesses."

Again, you've avoided the question. How can "independent contractors," "independent businesses," "people who just bought a service," or whatever you wish to call be "poached" by another company if they are NOT considered employees.

equid0x · ‎09-25-2019

@the*dog*ate*my*tablecloth wrote:
Your legal cases are referring to couriers hired by Amazon to deliver packages. That is totally different from third party sellers who hire Amazon to advertise their items.

I'm well aware of that. It doesn't change the fact that Amazon's actions are under scrutiny.

There is another inquiry active by the FTC into Amazon's actions in cutting independent sellers of its marketplace for Apple products and contracting directly with Amazon to sell Apple's products.

There is another inquiry open into Amazon's payment processing and specifically, the way in which it pays its sellers - the exact model being emulated by etsy and eBay's Managed Payments program.

mam98031 · ‎09-25-2019

@equid0x wrote:
@mam98031 wrote:
No we are are NOT "independent contractors". Ebay didn't hire us to do anything. You always miss a critical part to all of this. To be an "independent contractor" for Ebay, first they would need to hire us and second they would need to pay us. Neither of which they do. We in essences hire Ebay to be the site we have chosen to run our little businesses on. We pay Ebay for the use of their site. Ebay does NOT pay any seller for anything. We are not sub contractors for Ebay.

Sellers are independent businesses one and all. Yes we have to adhere to the rules of the site to sell here, but that is no different than any other similar site. We can choose to sell here or we can choose not to. That is always within our power.

I don't know why you are going way off topic to want to discuss the Ebay law suit against Amazon. It has absolutely nothing to do with anything being discussed here. Ebay is suing Amazon for using Ebay owned software to try and poach active sellers on the Ebay site. They used the Ebay email system. That has nothing to do with anything being discussed here.

There is basically zero legal difference between an "independent contractor" and an "independent business". All "independent contractors" ARE "independent businesses."

Again, you've avoided the question. How can "independent contractors," "independent businesses," "people who just bought a service," or whatever you wish to call be "poached" by another company if they are NOT considered employees.

I guess if you assume "poaching" can ONLY happen with employees, I suppose you can look at it that way. But the word "poaching" is not specific to only employees. There are many things that can be Poached. The first thing that leaps to my mind are CUSTOMERS. But hey that is just me.

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

mam98031 · ‎09-25-2019

@equid0x wrote:
@the*dog*ate*my*tablecloth wrote:
Your legal cases are referring to couriers hired by Amazon to deliver packages. That is totally different from third party sellers who hire Amazon to advertise their items.

I'm well aware of that. It doesn't change the fact that Amazon's actions are under scrutiny.

There is another inquiry active by the FTC into Amazon's actions in cutting independent sellers of its marketplace for Apple products and contracting directly with Amazon to sell Apple's products.

There is another inquiry open into Amazon's payment processing and specifically, the way in which it pays its sellers - the exact model being emulated by etsy and eBay's Managed Payments program.

Wait, you keep referring to Ebay sellers as Employees of Ebay [unpaid employees] then why aren't you referring to Amazon sellers as employees of Amazon? Just askin??

mam98031 • Volunteer Community Member • Buyer/Seller since 1999

coolections · ‎09-25-2019

I doubt there are many buyers who purchase just for the fun of getting feedback. It's not very logical. If they are cancelling you need to look at other reasons to prevent or lower the amount you're getting. I rarely ever have a cancellation.