Buyer says item was stolen but i think they are attempting to scam

[famousnate717]

Buyer messaged me aug 3rd and said that the package arrived torn and items stolen/missing and sent a picture of the package but usps failed to deliver it on Aug 1st  and the tracking hasn't updated from the attempted delivery on Aug 1st. I think the buyer is trying to scam ebay and or me into refunding them etc, I had a few red flags jump out at me After asking the buyer to file a police report and a postal report and asking more questions about it all. I asked them again to get me the police report # and postal report etc and recieved no reply only a few hours later I get a email from PayPal and the buyer opened a claim via PayPal on both items I sold them, this was possibly a red flag as well, wouldn't the buyer file with ebay? They told me they "already talked to ebay and they said we would have to work it out" the buyer also said they called the post office and police and said they said the same thing... I find this odd as mail theft is a serious crime and at this point I really question the buyers willingness to sign a affidavit with any sort of authority under penalty of law etc, i really did give the buyer the "benefit of the doubt" until things got "fishy" and so on... 

What should I do? What can I do? Any suggestions? Any help please?

[desmasreborns]

This is why I attach a signature confirmaton to my art work when I ship it. They have to sign for it and it proves they received it. My reborn babies are not rediculously highly priced but they are still enough that if I loose one, all of the materials that go to make them is lost.  It is only when a buyer buys enough of my babies and I get to know them that I drop the signature confirmation. 

[mam98031]

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@famousnate717 wrote:

what happens when or if the tracking gets corrected and or usps confirms it was delivered? they have the mailer the items were in they sent pictures of it tore open. They are saying the items were stolen or something they opened their mailbox to find it like that apparently. I plan on contacting USPS today to see what they say. another odd thing is that the tracking said a notice was left on the 1st that the item could not be left due to no safe location, but obviously got delivered sometime after that cause the buyer has the packaging, i also see the buyer is now selling a lot that may or may not include the items, just seems suspect that they listed the lot of 26 of them including 2 of the type that they bought from me and listed it the same day they filed a claim and contacted me.. who knows it could be a coincidence but suspect....

should i reply with something right away in paypal dispute or wait to see what usps says etc..  can i say something like im looking into this ? should i still ask for a return? they are claiming item not received 

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A couple things.

When a package is damages while inside the USPS delivery system, in my experience they always put a note on it.  Official USPS notes.  Sometimes they will even bag it or tape it up.  But always a note saying it was damaged.

When USPS leaves their little pink notification that a package was attempted to be delivered but wasn't for whatever reason they may state.  There are only two ways in which that package will get re-delivered.  One the customer takes the pink notice and goes to the PO to pick up the package.  Or they can put a note on the pink notification telling USPS it is OK to re-deliver the package to the address on a specific date.  

IDK why you would go to all this effort.  It isn't going to help you in any way except maybe mentally.  What I shared with you earlier still stands.  You may want to look at the type of claim your buyer actually filed a little closer.  Disregard what they said, what type of claim is it.  If they opened an INR saying they got the package empty, then the INR was incorrectly filed as they did receive the package.  If the filed an INAD [or whatever PP calls it] saying they received the package but the contents were missing, it is important to determine what kind of claim you have here first to then determine what your best action is.

https://www.paypal.com/us/brc/article/customer-disputes-claims-chargebacks-bank-reversals

[famousnate717]

i asked the buyer to take a picture of the notice and they said there was one, I added tracking to the paypal case, should i state that i think the package was delivered and the buyer is attempting fraud? should i add pictures and messages they sent me? or would paypal not even need any of that since the item not recieved case wont go through because of the tracking, I went on USPS.com and initially scheduled a redelivery thinking that might update the tracking.  Im assuming it is not updating because the package was picked up or delivered and possibly not scanned out properly or something not updating the tracking. Should i state to paypal in the case that it was delivered because the buyer had the mailer and packaging etc and sent me the message stating it was left like that and or stolen etc.? I thought the same thing as well on the note, 99.99% of the time the package is retaped or has USPS branded tape on it or a note stating it was damaged etc like you said this was another red flag when the buy said it was found like that, it was just a bubble mailer but the pictures look like it was just tore open nothing shredded or crazy holes or anything like that, really it just looked like how one might open it normally etc. 

Im hoping that you guys are all right and paypal will find in my favor regardless but how can i speed it up or how should i proceed with the case etc? Since the case was opened paypal of course has temp. taken the funds back. 

can anyone help me out with like a sample or a example on what to state and how to state it to paypal in this case? and or what i should do to make sure everything goes smoothly? Fornately I haven't had to dispute a buyers claim on paypal very often, i think the one in only time (more than likely one... Maybe two over 10years+) was years ago and that was a easy one and involved a charge back and buyer claiming unauthorized purchase on the last day possible to do so (30 day mark or something) That one was pretty easy the buyer left feedback and even sent a message after receiving the item stating how thankful they were and how much they loved the item... so any help tips and everything said so far and everyone's help has been much appreciated.

[monster-deals]

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@famousnate717 wrote:

i asked the buyer

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I would stop talking to the buyer and not volunteer paypal any additional information that might hurt you.

If you have tracking and they opened a INR your'e fine and nothing more needs to be done after you upload the tracking numbers. You might call it in and see if they can manually close the case out but other than that stay quiet and keep your head down.

[fashunu4eeuh]

Hi again @famousnate717 

Below is a link to the PayPal policy pages on how to handle a Item Not Received case. It should tell you everything you need to know about how to proceed. You have 20 days to come to an agreement with the buyer, and if it cannot be resolved, then PayPal steps in to make a ruling. The case might be eligible for an earlier intervention with PP. You will need to read the terms. Do upload your tracking number to the case. Good luck to you, and hope this is resolved in your favor. 

https://www.paypal.com/us/brc/article/customer-disputes-claims-chargebacks-bank-reversals

[famousnate717]

OK so yesterday I filed a inquiry with usps and today received a email back stating the local post office did not receive any damged packages that week at all and if they would have their policy is to note the package and tracking number info that they received it damaged, the post office also pulled the photo from the package sorting and noted the package was not damaged nor opened in that picture. The postal clerk and delivery postal worker both agreed package was delivered in perfect condition to the buyers mailbox. I asked them for the photo and to update the tracking hoping that will help... any ideas? thoughts? Should I add this info to paypal or just wait

[famousnate717 · Accepted solution]

Case decided in my favor attempted delivery is a delivery thanks everyone appreciated 

[24ra_20]

You got lucky, don't count your chickens yet... An empty package is in fact reason for a case of INAD, the buyer filed an INR instead and thus lost but they can still open one (granted it may be they have outdone themselves with cases so ebay isn't letting them), they may be suffering from porch pirates visiting, we don't know if these things are true or a scam.

[famousnate717]

I have confirmation from USPS that the package was in fact delivered in perfect condition and they even pulled the sorting image and saw no signs of damage to the package and if they had they would have noted the tracking and package of said damage