Buyer requesting compensation for damaged item.

[roberteous]

Hi everyone,

I recently sold a reasonably expensive guitar with a hardcore. Prior to sending the guitar I messaged the buyer to inform them of when I was sending it. I had a message back from the buyer asking to put extra packaging around the guitar within the hardcase as they were worried it may get damaged whilst in transit. So I wrapped the guitar up with extra packaging so it was unable to move around in the case, I then packed it in a box with additional packaging at each end to stop the case moving around in the box. The guitar was sent and I recieved conformation of delivery from the courier and then nothing.

A week and a half later I had a message from the buyer saying they had received  the guitar the following week but there had been some damage to the case during transit. From the very poor pictures they sent me, it appears the end of the guitar has hit the end of the case from within inside and it has caused the outside of the case to bulge.  They also mentioned some of the frets were now protruding and making the guitar which I found very odd as there were no sharp frets prior to sending it.

I messaged the buyer back and said I would place a claim with the courier regarding the damage and asked for more pictures of the damage and packaging. They sent some more of what looks like a very minor bulge and asked what I was going to do about the frets.  I replied asking what they would like me to do about them - their reply was bemusing to say the least. They claimed the frets would need to be filed which would in turn mean the neck has to be sanded and refinished too which will likely be very expensive.

At this point I told them to send the guitar and case back and I would refund them. They declined, instead opting to wait and see what the courier would offer as compensation. Two days later they asked for an update to which I responded by telling them it can take the courier up to 30 days to make a decision. I again offered them a full refund if they sent the guitar and case back but this time they didn't respond.

It has now been 3 weeks and the courier have said they won't be offering any compensation - probably in part due to the super poor images of the damage that was sent. The 30 day money back guarentee window has also surpassed.

I'm a pretty reasonable guy and as a gesture of goodwill I plan to offer the buyer $50 because of the damage to the case. But I can't help but feel the buyer is trying their luck at trying to recieve a large chunk of money back and keep the guitar. Is Ebay likely to side with them if they want to push to get their money back?  

Any advice would be kindly appreciated.

[richard1rst]

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@roberteous wrote:. Is Ebay likely to side with them if they want to push to get their money back?  

Any advice would be kindly appreciated.

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The only way that eBay would side with them would be if they opened a return request and you ignored it. If you accept the return and send them a prepaid return label and then issue a refund when the item is returned to you then you are protected. If ultimately they do not send the guitar back then after a time eBay will close the return in your favor and no refund will be issued.

Now, you will see others claim that is not so. I suggest that those disagree have had situations where they themselves did not follow the proper procedures. For example I have seen others claim that they have a no return policy and feel screwed over when eBay gave a refund anyways. There is no such thing as a "no return policy" if an item is damaged or not as described.

[fbusoni]

@roberteous 

From the text of your post above it sounds as though the buyer never formally opened a return request through eBay.

Is that correct?

Even though the 30 day window for returns has passed, the buyer could, in a worst case situation, claim a credit card chargeback for the guitar.   That would take you into new and uncertain territory.   

I personally have never experienced a chargeback so I do not know the ins and outs, although I have read on these forums examples of same where the seller was able to keep the funds earned from the sale.  

The buyer in your case seems to have been more interested in playing games than simply returning the item, although its also fully possible that they have no understanding of eBay's return policies. 

You might want to go ahead and make the offer of $50.  That way, if and when eBay reviews your correspondence with the buyer, they will see that you were accommodating and reasonable.  

You also can contact Facebook/ebay and send a message there, explaining the conundrum; the reps at that site are excellent.

NOTE: Whatever you do, do NOT contact the drones at eBay customer service (or whatever it is called these days) via the eBay website; their job is to optimize the experience for the buyer and get you off the line as soon as possible and in the process you most likely will  lose everything.

[chevymontecarlo88]

First of all i agree with what others have posted already. 

The case budge could be from the box being dropped on the end which can cause what you described. Normally this occurs when the guitar is bottom heavy (like a Les Paul) and packed poorly where there is some movement and/or not much room on the ends. (of the box packing) If you have any pictures, it will help to see.

What the customer is asking to do on the frets does sound weird. Yes, frets can arrive sharp on the edges when shipped because of the humidity/temperature changes. Normally this would be an easy fix (luthier/repair) to file down the edges. Why the neck has to be refinished and sanded down makes no sense. 

What was the guitar sold and at what price? (make, model, price) eBay auction number if possible. 

Sounds like the buyer is trying work you for a partial refund. 

[roberteous]

'From the text of your post above it sounds as though the buyer never formally opened a return request through eBay.

Is that correct?'

Hi, yes that is correct. When the buyer insinuated that the work for  would warrent a sizeable partial refund I refused and told them to send it back for a full refund.

They asked to wait and see what compensation the courier would grant first. Once I knew how long the decision could take I again offered a full refund but this time they didn't respond. Now it's been 3 weeks with no contact from them.

[klhmdg]

The courier will not offer any compensation for damage.

They will say that the item is not packaged well. 

If the buyer contacts you again, respond Please Return for Refund. Nothing else just "Im sorry you are not happy and this happened. Please return for refund."

This way IF they file with their CC, you will have proof you requested them to return the item and were trying to work with the buyer.

I think the buyer is trying to work you for a discount.

[luckythewinner]

Now it's been 3 weeks with no contact from them.

If clock runs out his window for filing a dispute will close. 

Then all you have to worry about is a charge back for "not as described", which you would almost certain lose, and not get your guitar back 😠

[fbusoni]

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@roberteous wrote:

'From the text of your post above it sounds as though the buyer never formally opened a return request through eBay.

Is that correct?'

Hi, yes that is correct. When the buyer insinuated that the work for  would warrent a sizeable partial refund I refused and told them to send it back for a full refund.

They asked to wait and see what compensation the courier would grant first. Once I knew how long the decision could take I again offered a full refund but this time they didn't respond. Now it's been 3 weeks with no contact from them.

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@roberteous 

Others may disagree, but I would contact Facebook/eBay and get yourself on record as having attempted to address this.  

I do not know what your chances would be of surviving a credit card chargeback, but I do not think it can hurt to proactively reach out to eBay (via Facebook) and show that you are a "concerned" seller.

Many years ago, I encountered a situation somewhat similar to yours -- with a buyer in the UK.   eBay volunteered to compensate the buyer at eBay's expense.  I refused their offer on principle and ended up losing some money.  Not the end of the world, but it did show that when you talk with the right people, eBay can indeed be helpful.

[12345jamesstamps]

If the item is to be repaired from a shop by the buyer...have buyer send an invoice in an email to you of the bill and pay the buyer back.

Think of the money saved(shipping) for you paying for it to be returned and maybe more damaged from shipping.

You are an experienced shipper...will the buyer be?

It could be more than $50 or less than $50.

Courier might say you didn't pack it good enough even though you did...so I would expect no compensation from the courier.

Work it out with the buyer who wants it still.

Ask buyer what is a reasonable solution.

'3 weeks' now...sounds like a decent buyer waiting it out.

[bonjourami]

Did you offer a return label to the buyer with the return?

[roberteous]

Did you offer a return label to the buyer with the return?

Hi, yes I did. Twice. The first time the buyer wanted to wait and see what the claim with the courier came back as. The second the buyer didn't respond/hasn't responded to me. 

[roberteous]

Then all you have to worry about is a charge back for "not as described", which you would almost certain lose, and not get your guitar back

How does that work? I've read a bit about on these forums but I don't understand how the money is recovered and from where?

I don't have PayPal and as I don't sell much on Ebay, Ebay held the money for 2 weeks before they let me transfer it from them into my bank account.

[klhmdg]

If a Cc charge back goes through, eBay will take the money from your pending fund or bank account when you lose OR send you to collections.

[roberteous]

What was the guitar sold and at what price? (make, model, price) eBay auction number if possible. 

The guitar sold for $1150 and it was a fender Precision bass  in a molded hardcase. The guitar was well wrapped within the case to try and prevent the movement you mentioned (headstock and its cavity were densely wrapped as well as the body and body cavity.  So where I understand strong forces will cause movement, the damage caused by the guitar on the case doesn't make logical sense. 

I'm unable to upload an image as it says I don't have permission to?

[jerseyboymusic]

@roberteous 

I don't see anything sold or listed on this account... so maybe you sold it from another account, or maybe it was well over 30 days ago?  If that's the case, the buyer is outside the Ebay MBG.

When you say "courier", it sounds like someone hand delivered it for you? Or did you use a delivery service like USPS, FedEx or UPS?

I didn't catch what the damage was... on a bass, did you loosen the strings before shipping?