Army field manuals

[wallenda]

I am trying to list an army field manual and keep getting a restricted item warning.  there are 500 field manuals on now so why would mine get bumped??

[sam9876 · Accepted solution]

Machine gun.

[variety_nook]

Because that item is the property of the U.S. military! You're not even allowed to have it in your possession unless you are a "CURRENT" member of the U.S. armed forces. . It's confidential. Please don't tell me that you're a Veteran (or active member) and you do not know that! Geez!!!!!!

[m60driver]

Most field manuals are unrestricted and in the public domain and are sold wholesale to any army-navy store with an interest. Manuals that are restrticted will state that on the cover or inside page.  But you can't list anything on Ebay with the term "machine gun" or even "M-60" so  that particular manual will take some creativity to list. I would just list "Field Manual 42-9-19" and hope for the best.

[coolections]

@m60driver

Please do not explain how to get by Ebay rules here on the boards. That manual does not belong on Ebay.

[wallenda]

Thanks, I know that they are legal to have etc.   30 years Army service.  I did some more research and Ebay actually restricted all military field and tech manuals in 2013.  Apparently they slip through occasionally and get listed.  Once blocked though there computers pick up on key words like manual, etc and continue to block it.  I tried to just list it as "FIELD MANUAL" and still got blocked so I listed them on Etsy.  I appreciate the positive nformation as compared to the other stupid ones.

[variety_nook]

Really!? Then perhaps you would'nt mind walking into any military recruiting office and requesting field manuals so as to sell them on eBay. I'd love to see that!

All U.S. Military field manuals are considered the property of the U.S. Gov/Military and are also considered confidential. Not for the public domain. Just because you see them for sale or in the hands of a private civilian doesn't make it legal or OK!

Oh, and by the way, all outdated field manuals are to be destroyed, NOT SOLD, to the private sector. Hence, if you are in possession of ANY military field manuals, then you are in illegal possession of U.S. Government property! Simple as that.

So lets see that bill of sale from when you purchased a used, outdated field manual from the D.O.D.

[berserkerplanet]

Really.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Field_Manuals
"They are usually available to the public at low cost or free electronically. Many websites have begun collecting PDF versions of Army Field Manuals, Technical Manuals and Weapon Manuals."

https://usacac.army.mil/sites/default/files/misc/doctrine/CDG/fms.html
https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/
https://armypubs.army.mil/ProductMaps/PubForm/TM_1_8.aspx
http://www.survivalebooks.com/usmilitarymanuals.html

Appears that the contents of anything except restricted publications are readily available to the public which makes then not "confidential". Restricted publications appear to be those involving tactics, policy, strategy,etc not technical manuals.

If the information isn't sooper-secret-double-classified, then the government isn't going to care about a 40+ year old paper version of it.

[7606dennis]

---

@coolections wrote:

@m60driver

Please do not explain how to get by Ebay rules here on the boards. That manual does not belong on Ebay.

---

Please quote the eBay policy stating that this manual does not belong on eBay.  I don't believe advising the OP on how to avoid bots from mistakenly identifying the item being listed as a firearm is a violation of any policy. 

[div_style]

I have bought 100s of outdated Army, Navy, Marine Corps manuals at auctions on military bases from the Defense Reultilization and Marketing Service, which used to run live auctions, but now only internet sales, farmed out to liquidation.com.

[coolections]

@7606dennis

Since I refuse to research for you every time you ask I won't this time either. You can do your own research OR you can ask the OP since he did research Ebay policy and stated in reply #6:

" I did some more research and Ebay actually restricted all military field and tech manuals in 2013."

[7606dennis]

---

@coolections wrote:

@7606dennis

Since I refuse to research for you every time you ask I won't this time either. You can do your own research OR you can ask the OP since he did research Ebay policy and stated in reply #6:

" I did some more research and Ebay actually restricted all military field and tech manuals in 2013."

---

Since you made the assertion I would expect you to provide the evidence to back up your assertion.

[7606dennis]

---

@wallenda wrote:

Thanks, I know that they are legal to have etc.   30 years Army service.  I did some more research and Ebay actually restricted all military field and tech manuals in 2013.  Apparently they slip through occasionally and get listed.  Once blocked though there computers pick up on key words like manual, etc and continue to block it.  I tried to just list it as "FIELD MANUAL" and still got blocked so I listed them on Etsy.  I appreciate the positive nformation as compared to the other stupid ones.

---

I wasn't aware of that change in eBay policy from back then.  Of course, not dealing in that particular type of goods I've never had reason to check it.  Thanks for the info.

[div_style]

I can't speak as to the date eBay began restricting sale of military manuals, but I know that they did so, because I used to sell bunches of them on eBay, and then a few years ago I couldn't list them any more.

[berserkerplanet]

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/prohibited-restricted-items/military-items-policy?id=4342

From that eBay page:

Not allowed
   Technical data as defined under Part 120 of the ITAR, including
   user manuals for military items

From Part 120 of the ITAR:
  https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=86008bdffd1fb2e79cc5df41a180750a&node=22:1.0.1.13.57&rgn=d...

§120.10 Technical data.
(a) Technical data means, for purposes of this subchapter:
(1) Information, other than software as defined in §120.10(a)(4), which is
    required for the design, development, production, manufacture, assembly,
    operation, repair, testing, maintenance or modification of defense articles.
    This includes information in the form of blueprints, drawings, photographs,
    plans, instructions or documentation.

Operation is the key word from the above that would apply to an M60 Machine gun field manual.

From Part 121 of the ITAR:

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=86008bdffd1fb2e79cc5df41a180750a&node=22:1.0.1.13.58&rgn=d...

(i) Technical data (as defined in §120.10 of this subchapter) and defense services
    (as defined in §120.9 of this subchapter) directly related to the defense articles
    described in paragraphs (a) through (h) of this category. Technical data directly
    related to the manufacture or production of any defense articles described elsewhere
    in this category that are designated as Significant Military Equipment (SME) shall
    itself be designated SME. 

 which relates to

Category I—Firearms, Close Assault Weapons and Combat Shotguns
*(a) Nonautomatic and semi-automatic firearms to caliber .50 inclusive (12.7 mm).
*(b) Fully automatic firearms to .50 caliber inclusive (12.7 mm). 

and

(2) Significant Military Equipment. All items described within a USML paragraph
    or subparagraph that is preceded by an asterisk (*) are designated “Significant
    Military Equipment” (see §120.7 of this subchapter). Note that technical data
    directly related to the manufacture or production of a defense article designated
    as Significant Military Equipment (SME) is also designated as SME.

Looks like eBay does prohibit listing of manuals such as OP's, even though they are available online, and can be bought and sold elsewhere.