Are you more concerned with no restocking fee and shipping discounts or losing top rated plus badge

[waterbed_bigfoot]

So 2 days away to the new policy beginning.  On June 1st we have to decide if we want to give up top rated plus and continue our policy on buyer pays return shipping on a remorse buy.  We also will lose the restocking fee and we offer free shipping on our listings.  I've been reading here a lot of top rated plus sellers are willing to forgo the discounts on shipping and the rebate of the seller fees.  But we also give up the ability to charge a restocking fee soon as well.  We have been lucky and not had too many returns at all.  We provide good customer service and have a lot of repeat buyers on here.  I know as a top rated plus seller not only do we get the badge but we get a discount on those pesky fees.  So the last I read on the shipping discounts;

Based on negotiated Commercial Plus pricing available via eBay Labels to all eBay Top-rated sellers and sellers with an average of 300 or more transactions per month.

For our store personally we don't always sell 300 per month.  So not only will we lose the badge but we will lose the shipping discounts for the best rate as well.  

So if you don't sell 300 items in a month and you drop your top rated plus badge you also probably will lose the commercial plus pricing on shipping.  That could be huge.  Please let me know if you know something different about this one.

Most of the few returns we have had in the past have been opened and out of their original packaging with the free returns we could get up to 50% and eBay says they will protect the seller.  However the last return we had not only was opened but clearly used for 30 days.  eBay did help us with that one and if that were to continue we could at least get our shipping back both ways this way.  

So what are you going to do I'm asking because I want to figure out for us if this new free returns is the way to go or not.  

[slippinjimmy]

I have never and would never offer 1 day handling, while many of my orders would make the grade a significant number wouldn't. No way would I promise something I know in advance I can't do.

I have never and would never charge a restocking fee in an consumer retail situation involving "off the shelf" merchandise.

I have offered 30 day seller paid returns for 6 years, no change needed, I paid for one (remorse) return in that time.

I do not print shipping labels via eBay, there are plenty of other postage vendors who charge the same or less, they download orders and upload tracking and they work ALL THE TIME.

There is nothing coming June 1st that would cause me to change anything I do. Maybe I'll go for 60 day returns instead of 30 just for kicks and to stay on par or ahead of competitors.

[kenwoodwinter]

As a buyer I don't plan on returning anything that arrives as expected. If that were to happen I want all my money back.  If I order the wrong item I'm the one that made the mistake and I expect to pay all shipping charges both ways. But I want discount labels provided.  I think restocking fees are not a good idea. They don't go over well with the buyers and discourage sales. It gives the impression of a none cooperative seller right from jump. I don't support total free shipping paid by seller returns if it runs the price up. I would rather eat the shipping charges for my mistakes. On the other hand if it increases sales and profits that result in lower prices then so be it.

Anything the seller can do to keep the price down gets my vote. As long as it arrives as expected or the seller makes it right.  Shipping cost is THE problem.  Free shipping is a BIG influence on a buyer.

I am not influenced by tags and ratings. As I said it gets here as expected or it doesn't.

Hope these contradictory ramblings help. 

[ted_200]

I'm mostly concerned buyers are going to have an aneurysm when they get partial refunds (in lieu of disclosed restocking fees) on their "free return", and (even worse) on their MBG disputes.  The blizzard of bad publicity is likely to be unprecedented.

As far as the rest of that stuff, there's no decision.  I already don't have a restocking fee, I already don't get shipping discounts, and I already lost my top rated plus badge.  I don't offer "free" returns, and I won't start now. 

[waterbed_bigfoot]

@slippinjimmy

We have offered the 1 day for a long time no problems.  On the few listings we can't we don't have the badge.

We have a brick and mortar store and have had since 1971.  The only ones both here and at our store we charge the restocking fee to are the ones who open and take things out of the bags and lose the material like the warranties so we can't just resell it as new.  Usually we can get 1/2 price for those items so 20% restocking is reasonable.   But I like what you and the buyer said about this and how that may turn buyers off from our listings.  Hopefully this new policy going in will help with those returns but I know the customers that get a partial return will protest it.  

The only thing I can see that will affect you is; eBay provides either a 1st Class or Priority Mail USPS label to the buyer when a return is accepted. The cost of the label is determined by the weight and dimensions of the package and will cost no more than the original outbound label if it was purchased on eBay.

We have Stamps.com and a Fed EX account but I've never used them for eBay.  I also wonder if we do the free returns and since you do it already do you send a label out to customer with your order if they want to return an item? 

[waterbed_bigfoot]

@kenwoodwinter

This is great.  We don't plan on returning stuff that we order either and if we get the product and it comes on time and is what we ordered we've never returned anything like that.  We have had people send us the wrong thing and the sellers have always stepped up and shipped us out the right thing that did that.  

The only ones we charge a restocking fee too are the ones that return opened items that are missing things like the warranties.  We've even had clearly used items come back with no paperwork or bags they were in simply a customer that tried it out and changed their mind.  We obviously can't resell those things and we don't so it is a total loss to us.  Some of the items can be sold as used for 1/2  price.  Some can never be sold and get thrown out.  If a customer just changed their mind currently they can return an item to us and we keep the price low by them paying for the return shipping.  Then if the items come back in great shape we give them a full refund.  We never get a refund on the postage since we include it in our price.  So without the restocking fee we will be out that completely but I'm actually okay with that as a cost for doing business and keeping the customer happy.    

[waterbed_bigfoot]

@ted_200We are worried about the partial refunds due to customers that open and send back the products missing items since most of our items can't be repacked and sold.  I'm not sure how good eBays new policy on protecting us as sellers in this case will work.  We are going to try this free return shipping on some items to see how this works out.  

[ted_200]

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@waterbed_bigfoot wrote:

@ted_200We are worried about the partial refunds due to customers that open and send back the products missing items since most of our items can't be repacked and sold.  I'm not sure how good eBays new policy on protecting us as sellers in this case will work.  We are going to try this free return shipping on some items to see how this works out.  

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If past experience is any indication...  it isn't going to work very well!

It's a nice idea... partial refund for damaged packaging.  Missing parts is sorta fraud, but at least you can dock refund for that too. 

I discussed this more elsewhere, here's an excerpt from my post:

I think that's going to be an epic trainwreck.  Not just on the seller side (which has been discussed here quite a bit), but on the buyer side.  Sure, that sounds good to buyers, but eBay attempted to fix the "faulty return" problem with a partial refund provision.  Buyers are going to hit the roof, because the "free" return ended up costing them money.  Buyers are going to distrust the MBG program, because it's included in that, so whatever benefit the MBG has provided (not without great pain to sellers) will be undercut.  And eliminating the re-stocking fee is supposedly going to end false SNADs to avoid the fee, but the fee was at least visible to the buyer at the time of purchase.  Sellers - at eBay's direction and with eBay's blessing - are going to use the partial refund to replace the re-stocking fee (open box return, missing tags, etc.).  But buyers will not know it's coming, they'll scream bloody murder, and probably file at PayPal to recoup the rest of the payment (even though they're supposed to appeal to eBay), then eBay and PayPal will start Sgt. Schultz-ing buyers.  Sellers are conditioned to this sort of treatment by eBay/PayPal by now, but it's going to be a total shock to buyers.

Like I said, I hope I'm wrong... but this has the makings of the mother of all bad ideas written all over it.  In just a few days now, we shall see.

Another problem I didn't cover there is seller fraud.

We could have sellers issue partial refunds (on Free Returns, or MBG) on items that are returned EXACTLY as they were shipped. 

We could also have sellers who list a non-op phone with a broken screen and moisture inside as "new" or "like new" or "refurbished" with 30 Day Free Returns, ship it, get the return, and issue a 50% refund claiming the buyer sent back a broken phone.   eBay may or may not cover the other 50% for the buyer, but the buyer isn't going to be happy having to deal with another eBay process on the appeal even if they do.  And eBay is then going to protect the seller from feedback on that (I think that's what I remember it saying, am I right?)? 

Some items, you don't know it's non-op until you unpackage it.  That's a straight up SNAD MBG claim, but the seller is going to dock refund because it was opened? 

I think this just opens up he said-she said fraud to both directions, with a "we'll split the difference" money solution that will make no one happy.  Now, instead of "I want a free phone" buyers, those people will have to settle for "I want a phone for half off".  It's a more level playing field though... now sellers can ship a rock too, they'll just have to settle for only keeping half the payment.  I expect eBay to tire of paying for this fraud quickly, they'll start denying appeal claims for the rest of the refund frequently, and many of those denied will be legitimate buyer victims. 

Quite apart from the fraud discussion, return rates for legitmate transactions between legitimate buyers and legitimate sellers will skyrocket too. 

It was a nice thought, but I think they failed to think it all the way through.  We'll see, won't we.

[slippinjimmy]

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@waterbed_bigfoot wrote:

@slippinjimmy

We have offered the 1 day for a long time no problems.  On the few listings we can't we don't have the badge.

We have a brick and mortar store and have had since 1971.  The only ones both here and at our store we charge the restocking fee to are the ones who open and take things out of the bags and lose the material like the warranties so we can't just resell it as new.  Usually we can get 1/2 price for those items so 20% restocking is reasonable.   But I like what you and the buyer said about this and how that may turn buyers off from our listings.  Hopefully this new policy going in will help with those returns but I know the customers that get a partial return will protest it.  

The only thing I can see that will affect you is; eBay provides either a 1st Class or Priority Mail USPS label to the buyer when a return is accepted. The cost of the label is determined by the weight and dimensions of the package and will cost no more than the original outbound label if it was purchased on eBay.

We have Stamps.com and a Fed EX account but I've never used them for eBay.  I also wonder if we do the free returns and since you do it already do you send a label out to customer with your order if they want to return an item? 

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Any type of return situation is very rare for me, most are Not As Decribed because I made a mistake, usually I don't want the item back but it's somethat I could resell and return shipping is cheap I will ask for the return. For a remorse situation I've only had one.

In all cases if an actual return is required/wanted I send the buyer a a label myself so I can control the service used and the address the return goes to. I can print some shipping labels for foreign countries but mostly I can't, in those situations I suppose I would send money via PayPal or promise to make it a part of the item refund. Can't say for sure because I've never had an International return, just a few SNAD where I wouldn't pay to get a defective item returned.

[synplet]

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@luckythewinner wrote:

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@lintbrush* wrote:

The CommPlus discount used to be good, but for the past few years it's only 3% off CommBase Priority.

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For the 8 oz first class international rate, I believe the discount is 10% ($11.97 vs $13.30). For the 2 lb first class international rate, I believe the discount is also 10% ($20.10 vs $22.33). 

That is a $1.33 or $2.23 savings on every single FCI package I send. 

That dwarfs the 15 or 25 cent discount I would get for TRS Plus. 

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@luckythewinner

Are you sure about this?  From my experience (and research) it appears there is NO international first class discount from Comm Plus.  Where are you getting these percentages?

[nobody*s_perfect]

Indeed, the USPS published rates for FC Package International are identical for Commercial Base and Commercial Plus:

https://pe.usps.com/text/dmm300/Notice123.htm#_c391

Perhaps eBay actually has negotiated a special deal for that service. (I don't ship internationally, myself.)

The 3% difference between Base and Plus seems to be specific to domestic Priority Mail.

[jtur4487]

Let's wake this topic up one more time.  So, now it has been roughly two months since the activation of eBay's new policy for Top Rated Plus status.  I am a store owner and I have Top Rated status.  I do not have Top Rated Plus.  Several months ago, i did have Top Rated Plus.  The reason I currently do not have it is because I choose not to offer free shipping on returns.  The reason why is because with just two returns a month, I would begin losing the money that I would save on eBay fees and all of my returns are the customer didn't read the listing thoroughly.  I don't get alot of returns, but my store is still a baby.  I offer free shipping and 30 days return.  I have 100% feedback.  I have consistently had all the requirements for Top Rated Plus except for the free return policy and here is another fact.  I wasn't getting the final value fee discounts when I was Top Rated Plus.  Why? Idk!  But when a dog bites you, do you stick your other hand out to see if they will do it again?  Now does the Top Rated Plus sticker matter?  Since June 1st, my sales are up 100% and my listed inventory has only increased by 15%.  Why? Because consistent quality customer service, competitive prices, quality products, and careful market analysis before investing in growth. Customer service, pricing and quality products matter to the customer, not some sticker.  So at this point, it isn't worth it.