Are we Employee's of Ebay or not ?

[advertisingshop]

It was most interesting, the other day when I posted about getting “spanked” by eBay, to see the numerous responses coming back mostly with the words “well if you don’t want to do it eBay’s way… don’t let the door hit your behind”.    PSS… many also said “well, great..please leave..that will give the rest of us more customers to share”

And these were words of “advise” from “private” moderators. UMMMM… But I took it all with a grain of salt as I understand… these are just lots an lots of “private” enterprisers who are looking out for their own bottom dollar.

But I started musing about those posts… and the thought came to me… Are WE working for ourselves?? Or are WE working for EBAY??

Now . Keep in mind, over the years, in both court sessions and IRS sessions, Ebay continues to state “WE are only enabler’s.” “our PLATFORM is only a means to connect the seller with the buyer and thus eBay’s fees are just payment for such “enabling”.

However, many are beginning to wonder and question this attitude and statement. An “enabler” merely gives those who chose…. “pathways” or “gates” in which to travel from one place or another… taking part NOT in the transaction but only “allowing” the transaction to take place.

Is this what we see today ? Is this what eBay really does.? Are we working for ourselves or do we work for eBay?

Ebay’s claim of only being a “enabler” gives it protection and certain “business gifts”. They don’t have to provide paid holidays, or vacation/sick time pay for their “partners”… they don’t have to pay for unemployment benefits,…nor provide ½ of the social security tax. Supposedly, they are kept out of the courts when claims are made of misconduct or misrepresentation. They don’t have to comply with social or legal laws governing employee/employer conduct or hiring practices. And so on and so forth…

In other words it’s much better for eBay to be considered a “platform” rental than a “business partner”. Partners are liable for other partners mistakes or legal wrongs. Ummm…

And then we come to the days when eBay says to all it’s “self-employees” “well… we’re only gonna allow payment thru paypal” “”we’re only gonna allow you to work “indirectly” with your customers”… “we’re only gonna allow you to list “certain” items”… “ we’re only gonna allow “certain” words in your descriptions” etc etc etc… ummmm ? “and if you cannot comply…well… you are welcome to leave (or be kicked out)… ummmm ? Employer benefits without “being” your employer !!! Or paying employer dues ! Ummmm ?

This sorta reminds me of that grumpy old man in the back room of the store… you know… “the old man”… the guy who “I’m not part of this business… I just rent them the store”… Who’s constantly butting into the business to say “well you should do it this way..or this way…” “That’s not the way “I” would do it”… “ ya know, I would never allow you to do that if “I” was in charge”…

And then he says… “well, if you don’t want to listen to me…then just get your butt outta my building” “But don’t forget to pay this months rent first…”

So, again, as eBay tells us HOW to act, WHAT to say, WHO to say it to, etc. etc.. are we in fact “employee’s” of eBay …or not..?

I hope someone figures it out soon… so we ALL know where we stand in this business… and can therefore “adjust”

And hey… put my vacation time up on the board please… 2nd week of August… mark it down… “JUST in case”…

[wrong66]

No. I work for myself using eBay's platform. Because it's their platform, I abide by their rules. Very simple.

[fab_finds4u]

Of course you are not an eBay employee. Ridiculous to think that. 

[advertisingshop]

hahahaha... says the person with NO listings...NO sold items... and NO ended items... UMMMMM?

[luckythewinner]

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@advertisingshop wrote:

hahahaha... says the person with NO listings...NO sold items... and NO ended items... UMMMMM?

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Many long-time sellers who contribute to this board use a separate posting ID when they comment on the boards. 

For instance, I have 8 eBay accounts - 6 accounts used for selling (I have been selling here since 2000), this account used for buying and posting on this board, and 1 account for reporting listings to VERO for the music artists that I represent. 

A posting ID is a prudent measure for frequent posters to prevent unbalanced people from retaliating or sabotaging their accounts just because they do not like the advice they receive. 

Using a posting ID does have its drawbacks, though, because of the mistaken assumptions people liek you make about their selling activity. 

[48hrs-clothing]

There is merit in what you say.

Enabler should not create their own rules and simply adhere to laws that are in place.

eBay is not purely an enabler as it writes and enforces it's own rules for it's own benefit therefore it could be argued that all sellers are employees as they are FORCED to abide by these rules as well as all other Laws.

Some people will say that if you don't like the rules then leaver the platform and in my humble opinion this is not an argument as what is under discussion is legal definition of employee and not whether we choose to be sellers on this platform or not.

Uber driver are employees as it is Uber who makes the rules that it's drivers are forced to adhere to and on those basis courts ( At least in some countries) have determined that Uber drivers are indeed employees therefore entitled to same protections as every other employee. 

Uber driver like eBay sellers choose to be on that platform / enabler.

[fern*wood]

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@advertisingshop wrote:

hahahaha... says the person with NO listings...NO sold items... and NO ended items... UMMMMM?

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For the one billionth time --- posting IDs  

[dan_448576]

hahaha

[gjs_16]

No.

[soh.maryl]

hahaha . . . So you had no idea that many eBayers have more than one eBay ?

Some of us have one ID for selling, one for buying and one for posting to the Boards.

Others have even more than that.  

[divwido]

While I feel the question was not a real concern, the answer is simple.

Look up the IRS definition of an employee and you will see there is no possible way you are an employee.

[luckythewinner]

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@48hrs-clothing wrote:

eBay is not purely an enabler as it writes and enforces it's own rules for it's own benefit therefore it could be argued that all sellers are employees as they are FORCED to abide by these rules as well as all other Laws.

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Nonsense.

If I set up at a flea market, I am required to abide by their rules. 

If I rent space at a dealer shop, I am required to abide by their rules. 

If I sell on Bonanza or Discogs or Etsy, I am required to abide by their rules. 

If I sell on Amazon, I am required to follow their rules. 

IMHO anyone who suggests that seller could be considered eBay employees lack a fundamental understanding of employment law. 

[southern*sweet*tea]

Easy question: Are you an employee?

Do you receive a W-2 form?  If so, yes; you are an employee.

Do you receive a 1099 form? If so, no; you are a self-employed independent contractor.

Do you receive nothing?  If so, no; you are a self-employed independent contractor.

[bestproductstore-21]

We are not employees of eBay but we are eBay Members

[advertisingshop]

"Golly mom... I saw EVERYONE else jumping off the bridge so I figured we ALL had to jump off the bridge !!"    (ie:...the question was not what others do ... the question was "at what point does one become an employee? ")  At this point Ebay takes in the money, takes out "fees" and give the remaining back to their "partners" as payment in kind...  ( It's not our money until they give it back to us ??)    It's  NOT the other way around... we are not "allowed" to handle OUR money... nor decide how OUR customers can pay... we cannot decide how to allow OUR returns...nor how to pay for those ...   we cannot know OUR customers "real" names nor be in a private conversation with them...

This is how the IRS defines an employee:

"the degree to which the worker is engaged primarily for the benefit of the employer. The IRS considers a worker to be your employee if you have the right to control not only what work will be done, but also how the worker will do it."

Legal definition of an employee:

"......... is subject to the employer's direction as to the details of how to perform the job......"

and here is one copied right of the IRS website.....

"Under common-law rules, anyone who performs services for you is your employee if you can control what will be done and how it will be done. This is so even when you give the employee freedom of action. What matters is that you have the right to control the details of how the services are performed."

Ummmmm......