eBay

movieman630 · ‎07-26-2024

I looked at a chart of the past few months with my impressions and what I see is shocking.

I update my existing listings frequently. For the past 6 months I've been updating my listings using PL's and I've been setting the rate at .01% higher than the "suggested rate".

My question is this. If ebay is using PL's to show your listings to people and I'm rewarding ebay with a higher than their "suggested rate" wouldn't you think that the impressions should be going UP not DOWN?

I'd like to know what's going on. This is not right. I've been working so hard to keep my store updated and running. I have a new baby born in March. 3 kids to feed now. I need my business to be allowed to grow, NOT SHRINK!

Is this manipulation to try and get people to use their PL Advanced? If so, it's morally and ethically wrong. If I'm using PL's and giving ebay upwards of 13% more in fees I should see an increase in sales, not a decrease with 13% more fees!

Here's the image:

Impressions going down despite 13% PL rates on most of my items added during this same period.

zamo-zuan · ‎07-29-2024

@vintagecraze50 wrote:
LUCKY has the right answer here. Many variables other than what you pay for the promotion. Extremely high rate does not quarentee a sale whatsoever on a consistent basis. Depends on audience online at the time, price too high or just right, yes, supply/demand, BIG ONE. And the luck of the slot machine rotating the listings.

It's more complicated than this as well. And some of us have tested these things extensively over the years.

I can tell you that in our testing, let's say we decide to double rates from 6% to 12% without changing the price? It doesn't do A THING! Logic dictates that based on how they explain these rates to us, it should increase traffic. It doesn't. Based on our testing, there's a "minimum" rate that you must invest (for the moment 4-5%) and as long as you do that, the "traffic switch" is turned on. There's nothing you can do to improve it now.

The testing has also proven that investment DOES affect your ORGANIC traffic! This is literally defying the definition of what an organic impression is. Organic traffic should NEVER be altered by ad investment. But here we are, this is a NORMAL thing on eBay. If your Promoted traffic increases too much your organic traffic will DECREASE. On the other hand, if you invest so little in promotions that the "switch turns off" your organic traffic plummets by 80%+.

Taking this in to consideration, it's more than just the "slot machine" of listings. Because eBay will actually have a ceiling for how much traffic you have a day. Slot machines are random, and without consistency. So how does eBay have consistency for weeks-months at a time? Those of us who are in to online marketing know that real traffic is VERY random. But eBay is anything but random. Impressions may swing by 20-30%, but views will stay the same, sales will stay the same. Organic views may be 2x promoted views, but promoted sales will consistently be 2x organic sales.

Now what about the truth that eBay exposed in how their algorithms work? How during errors where promoted impressions are not being read from their database properly, the views literally REDISTRIBUTED before our eyes? Going from 0 promoted impressions 1000 organic impressions 100 organic views, to 1000 promoted impressions 1000 organic impressions 50 promoted views 50 organic views? This proven that eBay is NOT simply retrieving/displaying traffic numbers, but is instead CALCULATING the views in real time and expecting a discrepancy. They are EXTRAPOLATING their traffic pages.

You guys are too trusting of eBay, and are too quick to dismiss what sellers have experienced on here with "easy explanations" that we have already considered, tested, and tests have proven things aren't so simple. You can have the cheapest price, you can have higher ad investment, and eBay will STILL cut off your sales at the same exact number every day. Once you hit your ceiling of your limits, there's nothing you can do to raise that bar. And before you guys even start the rumor that there are no limits, there are, and eBay has even admit it.

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fashunu4eeuh · ‎07-26-2024

Hi @movieman630

Wow—you’re not kidding, you’ve obviously made a Herculean effort here.

What worked well in the past, may not work now. The market is constantly adjusting itself. To roll with the tide, i finally optimized my listings for Search, and my numbers greatly improved. Search Engine Optimization (SEO) made a difference in my organic traffic, with a corresponding 20% rise in sales.

There are plenty of reasons why one may see a downturn in impressions, and that may have nothing to do with whether or not Promoted Listings are used.

As an active seller, one knows summer can be a slow time as people travel, especially after Covid. Folks are doing other things besides shopping. In addition, factors like recent rises in shipping costs may drive some to forsake mail-order. Even social unrest and global uncertainty can affect how a consumer spends his discretionary dollars.

Using PL is not a guarantee of traffic or sales. There is only so much that one can do.

As to eBay’s motivation, well, it’s here to make a profit for its shareholders. Does it have ulterior motives and a designed plan to draw more users into Advanced PL? Probably. eBay is all about adding to its income streams.

I have only used Promoted Listings on a very few items. Honestly, i question if i ever need to use it, as my items are often OOAK. So things depend on the kind of merchandise sellers are offering, too. If a thousand people are listing identical widgets, PL may be a critical strategy.

Things usually pick up around Back-to-School time.

How are your sales compared to previous time periods?

blacktopautoparts · ‎07-26-2024

I have been speaking with @zamo-zuan about this and something appears to have changed here with PL. Since 7/17/24, our sales have taken a 35% drop. Nobody over at eBay can tell us why this has happened. I have done just about everything that I know as a trick and just the regular things we do for our account. I really hope that eBay did not decide that regular PL is no longer going to really garner sales and they think PLA and Offsite ads are what they choose to prioritize. At the end, speaking with their growth advisors and a few others in the company, not too many people are using those like they have expected. So that means if we aren't making money, they are not making money and promoted listings can only carry this company afloat for so long.

We sell in eBay motors, and I have never seen it this bad. We noticed things drop around March, but we were still making decent money. Now as of 7/17/24, we have taken yet another nosedive and it is a scary one for the size of operation that we have. We are typically busy March-September, and summer vacations have no affect on used car parts.......but this year, not sure what is going on and it is way more than just the economy which still has a part in it, but not to this extent.

caldreamer · ‎07-26-2024

An impression counts when a link to your listing appears on eBay, and the buyer is ONE CLICK AWAY from your listing. This is really "useless information" because it does NOT mean that customers viewed your item.

Of course, promoted listed will have more impressions (that means EBAY promoted your listing and gave customer an "opportunity" to click on your item).

I viewed some of your items and when you go down the page....I can see that "your competitors" are selling exact same item for much cheaper price. If you want "fast sale" you should lower your price to beat your competitors. Remember, customers do not care if you "promoted listing" or not....they just want cheapest price.

luckythewinner · ‎07-26-2024

My question is this. If ebay is using PL's to show your listings to people and I'm rewarding ebay with a higher than their "suggested rate" wouldn't you think that the impressions should be going UP not DOWN?

You are only looking at one variable in a very complex and dynamic system. Impressions are not affected by your promotion rate in isolation; they affected by pricing, competition, supply and demand, buyer behavior, and luck.

If you are frequently adjusting your percentages, don;t you think there are thousands and thousands of other sellers doing the same thing?

movieman630 · ‎07-26-2024

I don't know which products you were looking at but I constantly research prices and try to make mine the lowest. Some items it's not possible though because of shipping. (ie: heavy iron items or oversized items) somehow some sellers are able to sell things for $8 that would cost me $25 to ship.

redlinear · ‎07-26-2024

@blacktopautoparts
It's just not your turn (lol). When my employees, which I allow to do this on their own, at home, in their spare time, for themselves, if they want.... When my employees walk in here empty handed for two weeks. Then, one morning carry in 10 items to package? And tell me "Hey, it was my turn yesterday".
Yeah, they know what's going on. They know it means that it was their turn for their listings to get good placement in search results (for one day). Then it's back to crickets for a few weeks.
Which is exactly how my sales work. Promoted or not.
Promoted MIGHT get you a bump every so often, but it's short lived. Raising the % doesn't seem to help much, if any at all. Lowering the % will sure effect sale though.

I can walk out back, grab 30 random parts, list these 30 parts and put them all on "Shelf 50".
I'll sell a few of those parts in the 1st week or two. Then nothing.
Somewhere around the 90 day mark, I'll get to work and go get items to ship...and SEVERAL of my sales will be pulled from "Shelf 50". Different parts for different customers.
Like you, I have hundreds of storage locations.
Every day ONE of those locations gets way more attention when getting items to ship.
My hired help jokes and says "it was just their turn".
I think has more to do with a rotation turn based on time listed instead of any particular user ID.

movieman630 · ‎07-26-2024

@redlinear wrote:
@blacktopautoparts
It's just not your turn (lol). When my employees, which I allow to do this on their own, at home, in their spare time, for themselves, if they want.... When my employees walk in here empty handed for two weeks. Then, one morning carry in 10 items to package? And tell me "Hey, it was my turn yesterday".
Yeah, they know what's going on. They know it means that it was their turn for their listings to get good placement in search results (for one day). Then it's back to crickets for a few weeks.
Which is exactly how my sales work. Promoted or not.
Promoted MIGHT get you a bump every so often, but it's short lived. Raising the % doesn't seem to help much, if any at all. Lowering the % will sure effect sale though.

I can walk out back, grab 30 random parts, list these 30 parts and put them all on "Shelf 50".
I'll sell a few of those parts in the 1st week or two. Then nothing.
Somewhere around the 90 day mark, I'll get to work and go get items to ship...and SEVERAL of my sales will be pulled from "Shelf 50". Different parts for different customers.
Like you, I have hundreds of storage locations.
Every day ONE of those locations gets way more attention when getting items to ship.
My hired help jokes and says "it was just their turn".
I think has more to do with a rotation turn based on time listed instead of any particular user ID.

You said it! I've noticed that trend too. It's absolutely stunning when it happens and totally obvious that it's not organic in nature. What are the odds that I have over 200 shelves/bins and yet I'll have a spurt from "Bin 36" in one day.

movieman630 · ‎07-26-2024

@luckythewinner wrote:
My question is this. If ebay is using PL's to show your listings to people and I'm rewarding ebay with a higher than their "suggested rate" wouldn't you think that the impressions should be going UP not DOWN?

You are only looking at one variable in a very complex and dynamic system. Impressions are not affected by your promotion rate in isolation; they affected by pricing, competition, supply and demand, buyer behavior, and luck.

If you are frequently adjusting your percentages, don;t you think there are thousands and thousands of other sellers doing the same thing?

I get what you're saying... Now I want you to think of what the purpose of having variable percentages in the PL settings is for?

If it's not to get more exposure, then what? I just feel like giving ebay more money just to do so? What is the variable percentage option supposed to generate for the seller?

redlinear · ‎07-26-2024

@movieman630
I used Promotion for cross listings. To get my listings inside of competitors listings.
I feel that the higher % you choose will get your items cross listed in more places, more times.
However, some users have tracked this best they could, and don't see More traffic at a higher %, vs a lower %
IF promoting gets you better placement in a search result...it's not for very long...if at all.

Before you promote, you have only Organic (what WAS this number?)
After you promote, you have both Organic and Promoted (is this number higher?)
That would be a way to compare, but, your items may have changed or some other factor may have changed.
If you had two user ID's with the same amount of the same listings over the same time period? Then you could track it.

blacktopautoparts · ‎07-26-2024

None of this makes any sense at all. This drop started on 7/17/24 and I am also noticing trends where we will go 3-5 hours without a single sale. I am actually seeing this today for example. They have made some change in the backend to affect stores this badly. I did just go and also turn off the option that makes customer have to pay automatically. Ours was not turned on till a few weeks ago, and I have not had any items sitting in "Awaiting Payment" for weeks. We used to get a lot of this, which I would find annoying at times, but now I wonder if this also added to this mess.

I am going to give offsite ads a shot with the free money they gave for it, since we are a larger store we do get more money towards it. I figure, I might as well give this a shot and see what the data shows.

I honestly have not seen a company that has had such a nice thing going just go out of their way to destroy it all due to greed. The cheerleaders can come on here and say what they want that peoples products are not good, it is the economy, and everything else under the sun. When we have been doing this for over 20+ years on here and when my supplier who also sells what we sell has taken quite the dip, there are bigger problems with the platform.

If we go by the motto of "we make no money, if you make no money", then why are some of us larger sellers that continue to add new inventory on a daily basis and are running our accounts how eBay wants it having such difficulties?

vintagecraze50 · ‎07-26-2024

@luckythewinner wrote:
My question is this. If ebay is using PL's to show your listings to people and I'm rewarding ebay with a higher than their "suggested rate" wouldn't you think that the impressions should be going UP not DOWN?

You are only looking at one variable in a very complex and dynamic system. Impressions are not affected by your promotion rate in isolation; they affected by pricing, competition, supply and demand, buyer behavior, and luck.

If you are frequently adjusting your percentages, don;t you think there are thousands and thousands of other sellers doing the same thing?

It’s a lot more about luck than anything else.

vintagecraze50 · ‎07-26-2024

@redlinear wrote:
@blacktopautoparts
It's just not your turn (lol). When my employees, which I allow to do this on their own, at home, in their spare time, for themselves, if they want.... When my employees walk in here empty handed for two weeks. Then, one morning carry in 10 items to package? And tell me "Hey, it was my turn yesterday".
Yeah, they know what's going on. They know it means that it was their turn for their listings to get good placement in search results (for one day). Then it's back to crickets for a few weeks.
Which is exactly how my sales work. Promoted or not.
Promoted MIGHT get you a bump every so often, but it's short lived. Raising the % doesn't seem to help much, if any at all. Lowering the % will sure effect sale though.

I can walk out back, grab 30 random parts, list these 30 parts and put them all on "Shelf 50".
I'll sell a few of those parts in the 1st week or two. Then nothing.
Somewhere around the 90 day mark, I'll get to work and go get items to ship...and SEVERAL of my sales will be pulled from "Shelf 50". Different parts for different customers.
Like you, I have hundreds of storage locations.
Every day ONE of those locations gets way more attention when getting items to ship.
My hired help jokes and says "it was just their turn".
I think has more to do with a rotation turn based on time listed instead of any particular user ID.

Rotation of the listing greatly effects the visibility just common sense.

vintagecraze50 · ‎07-26-2024

@vintagecraze50 wrote:
@redlinear wrote:
@blacktopautoparts
It's just not your turn (lol). When my employees, which I allow to do this on their own, at home, in their spare time, for themselves, if they want.... When my employees walk in here empty handed for two weeks. Then, one morning carry in 10 items to package? And tell me "Hey, it was my turn yesterday".
Yeah, they know what's going on. They know it means that it was their turn for their listings to get good placement in search results (for one day). Then it's back to crickets for a few weeks.
Which is exactly how my sales work. Promoted or not.
Promoted MIGHT get you a bump every so often, but it's short lived. Raising the % doesn't seem to help much, if any at all. Lowering the % will sure effect sale though.

I can walk out back, grab 30 random parts, list these 30 parts and put them all on "Shelf 50".
I'll sell a few of those parts in the 1st week or two. Then nothing.
Somewhere around the 90 day mark, I'll get to work and go get items to ship...and SEVERAL of my sales will be pulled from "Shelf 50". Different parts for different customers.
Like you, I have hundreds of storage locations.
Every day ONE of those locations gets way more attention when getting items to ship.
My hired help jokes and says "it was just their turn".
I think has more to do with a rotation turn based on time listed instead of any particular user ID.
Rotation of the listing greatly affects the visibility just common sense.

It’s like a slot machine. LOL!

iamtoplease · ‎07-26-2024

i really question if it's even worth doing standard PL in situations like this. you'll see great majority of the impressions are from promoted listings. while OP doesn't show the views, I'm going to guess that the great majority of the page views are from organic impressions (that's how it is for me at least). If this is the case, then PL destroys a seller's click through rate. Assuming click through rate is an important factor in the search algorithm, then non-promoted listings would have much higher click through rate (5x higher click through rate in my case) and thus organically rank higher in search and have better sales without the need to pay for PL.