04-24-2019 10:15 AM
I have again entered what I believe to be the Ebay black hole. You can always tell when you've entered it by the following:
1) No sales (goes without saying)
2) No questions
3) No new feedback/reviews
4) Few views
This period will continue for an unknown period of time until like magic, at 10:32 a.m on a Tuesday all of sudden in 1 hour 3 items will sell, then again lights out. When you average the lights out to visible times, it is nearly impossible to make any reasonable amount of money. When things are hot, you can list items on a given day and usually 1-2 of them will sell within the day. When it's lights out, you can list 10-20 items and crickets. Frustrating!
04-24-2019 11:44 AM
04-24-2019 11:53 AM - edited 04-24-2019 11:54 AM
@ekmadonna wrote:I don't think the "PRICES WEIGHT" has much to do with the algorithm. that one single sale of mine in the last 5 days was for a book priced at $19.99, mine was the MOST EXPENSIVE out of about 20 or so, some as low as 5 bucks but most between 5-12 bucks. Most of the other sellers except for 1 or 2 were not huge book dump warehoses with stock photos.
They constantly are changing it.
Around a year ago, up until May, it was the top factor. Which was weird, bc this is when they were pushing "Free Returns". According to Terapeak, anyone who switched to Free Returns had a huge drop, and only the sellers who didn't (and focused on price instead) stayed on top. (This was one of my main criticisms on here at the time).
Since then, it's been fluctuating through all the different factors.
Problem is, if you record the statistics daily, you can see fluctuations in the way traffic is distributed once or twice a month. They're tweaking the algorithm constantly.
For "Best Practices" to actually work, they need some sort of consistency with weights, and for the variables being weighed to work cooperatively, not have to sacrifice one variable for another.
04-24-2019 12:32 PM
What are your thoughts on some sellers getting squeezed intentionally in order to be forced into Promoted Listings by REDUCING their visibility? I have been bombarded with all kinds of reminders and messages almost with veiled threats about using them and I will not. I am also deeing a NEW MESSAGE when ending listings saying "UPGRADE YOUR STORE SUBSCRIPTION FOR BETTER VISIBILITY" Like Paying for a Premium store is not good enough now, I am being told to Upgrade my store if I want more views and sales? It feels very Mob like
04-24-2019 01:15 PM - edited 04-24-2019 01:16 PM
I see so much of this being discussed. I too feel I am "turned on and off" by platforms I sell on. The bottom line is this: you pay a platform to bring you tools and traffic. If you are not getting the tools you need or the traffic that generates sales, then what are you paying for?
If you have to work too hard to get traffic/sales then its possible the platform is just not a good place for your products. If you feel the platform needs too many changes in order for you to succeed then its possible said platform is not where you should be selling. Does your platform even WANT your products on their site? Its a harsh truth you must think about.
Platform selling is changing constantly. There are many more options and much more competition. Some items have too much competition and prices are driven down. Some have little/no market on some platforms while others may be booming on the same or different platform. Some platforms want you to follow their rules and if you don't then you are not of value to them.
Its not what it was 15+ years ago when everything was all so much simpler. Good luck to everyone trying to figure it out... hope you do!
04-24-2019 01:59 PM - edited 04-24-2019 02:02 PM
Oldtapeguy - You blanket statement on the category shows your lack of understanding of it. Within the clothing and shoe categories, there are items which there are thousands of and don't sell and others which there are relatively few of and sell well. You can't make such sweeping statements. The better question is why are you bothering to sell VHS movies for $5 with free shipping. How can you make any money on this?
04-24-2019 02:02 PM
@ekmadonna wrote:What are your thoughts on some sellers getting squeezed intentionally in order to be forced into Promoted Listings by REDUCING their visibility? I have been bombarded with all kinds of reminders and messages almost with veiled threats about using them and I will not. I am also deeing a NEW MESSAGE when ending listings saying "UPGRADE YOUR STORE SUBSCRIPTION FOR BETTER VISIBILITY" Like Paying for a Premium store is not good enough now, I am being told to Upgrade my store if I want more views and sales? It feels very Mob like
I mean, I'm not sure if people realize it, but "Sponsored Listings" by design are intended to do exactly what you describe.
Think about it like this. The first page of search is basically what sellers have to thrive for. Once you get on that first page, you get more exposure (impressions = times you appear in search). Then once someone clicks you, or buys your item, you get improved SEO statistics on eBay. Which gives you better search ranking. (You can check these metrics with the Analyze function on the Growth pages of Sellers Hub).
Traditionally (prior to 2018) your search placement was primarily your Product History. Meaning if you had a strong sales history of purchases and repeat customers, you had better placement.
In late 2017 they started implementing other metrics. They started factoring impressions/views/conversion rate. Then introducing Free Returns, Guaranteed Delivery, Sponsored Listings, Promotions, etc. These all got implemented.
Let's fast forward to nowadays. If you do a search and scroll through the first page, how many of items are "Sponsored Listings"? I just did 3 consecutive searches, and the number was: 10, 8, 9.
This means rather than fighting for 50 spots, we now only have ~40 spots to fight for. In order to get those other spots, you HAVE to pay.
But we also have to factor something else. It's not just 40 spots we're fighting for. That would be assuming the spots are all dedicated to items that are "naturally ranked high". But search is somewhat randomized, and intended to include "varied listing types".
Outside of Sponsored Listings, the search engine considers the "eBay Sales Ranking" but also tries to include at least a couple listings containing:
- Cheapest price without free shipping.
- Free Returns.
- Guaranteed Delivery.
- Promotions/Discounts.
- Items with strong sales/ product history.
- Refurbished items
Among other factors.
Now if we think about it like this, let's say you're a seller that offers Free Shipping, Guaranteed Delivery, and Free Returns? Only a fraction of the first page results is dedicated to this type of listing!
This is what I mean when I say there's design issues with the new search system. Everyone's potential for appearing in search is more limited. We're fighting for less spots, and those spots are now being cycled through different variables.
The problem is the variables conflict with each other. Each of those offerings reduces your margin somehow. Seller's can't possibly offer all of those while staying competitive. If they do, they are bringing base price up, which not only hurts their possibilities for appearing in search, but less sellers "click" on expensive items.
The only thing we can do that will be a sure-fire way to improve search placement, is invest in promotions/sponsored listings. But again, this takes away from the margin, and you have to sacrifice in those other areas to gain it.
This issue is what has been leading to a slow, steady decline for top sellers on eBay. I've mentioned the alarming news many times on the forum here, in 1 year the Top Seller Market Share dropped from 40% to 27%. Meaning top sellers are doing ~33% worse than a year ago (and still dropping).
The 1st problem: It's impossible to lead to anything else but a slow decline as long as the system is designed like this. As long as the design is factoring things that conflict, it's not possible to "score very high" in all areas.
The Pre-2018 method of "Product History worked far better because sellers simply had to focus on providing the customer better offerings, and they were rewarded with search placement in return, at which point they just needed to keep metrics/feedback high.
Now, there's no way to be rewarded. No matter what you do, you're sacrificing elsewhere, and fighting for a smaller piece of the pie. No quality control of good vs bad sellers. No reward for being a good seller. EBay doesn't even know what advice to give you to appear better in search, because no matter how much you tweak the different factors, you can't score "high" anymore.
We have a number of competitive items that are #1 Sales Rank according to eBay. Which means we're doing everything as best as possible. Even those items are showing declines in visibility. Our year to year chart is showing decline 20-30% (or more) since the beginning of 2018. Yet we're still #1 in our category, and all competitors are dropping just as much.
The 2nd problem: Sellers having to pay eBay for sponsors money, which is margin that goes directly to eBay, rather than offering anything to the customer, is bringing eBay prices up on the marketplace. This is making eBay prices non-competitive vs Amazon and other major marketplaces. If you want enough exposure for your business to survive in 2019, you HAVE to raise your prices above the prices other marketplaces provide.
04-24-2019 02:29 PM
@zamo-zuan wrote:
@tunicaslot wrote:I haven't had any sales in 2 days but the weekend always creates more sales usually than during the week. Depends on who's looking for what you sell and when - especially if others can see your items.
They definitely tweaked the algorithm in the last couple days, it's performing much different than it did for a long time.
We have a high volume of traffic/sales and we check sales points 4 times a day, every day.
Usually by 10am, then 1pm, we have a semi-consistent amount of sales. The last 2 days prior to today (and today) it has been half at these times.
For some insight, having such slow mornings end on a normal day has not been a characteristic of our store for many, many months. Highly doubtful it's coincidental, as this is such a large statistical anomaly that has went on for a few days now consistently.
Also it's a bit strange, as the majority of auto parts sales comes by 2PM PST (due to that being the time mechanics order). The last two days we did end at an "average" sales amount for the end of day. So it's quite odd that the mornings have been half the speed of normal, but ended at an "average".
Another oddity: Yesterday and the day before had the same exact number of total sales. And the total sales amount for the day was only $20 different.
This year they have been tweaking the algorithm more than past years. I'm assuming related to the effects GTC had.
We just have to roll with the punches. 😕
Thanks zamo - you're the man! You are more in touch with these things so I appreciate the update. I know the ebbs and flows and hate to jump to conclusions. Another algorithm change - I can't take much more of this.... I finally start to get a good flow going and they change things up again. I'm down 36% from last year and things should be picking up now - not go down.
04-24-2019 04:36 PM
@tunicaslot wrote:
@zamo-zuan wrote:
@tunicaslot wrote:I haven't had any sales in 2 days but the weekend always creates more sales usually than during the week. Depends on who's looking for what you sell and when - especially if others can see your items.
They definitely tweaked the algorithm in the last couple days, it's performing much different than it did for a long time.
We have a high volume of traffic/sales and we check sales points 4 times a day, every day.
Usually by 10am, then 1pm, we have a semi-consistent amount of sales. The last 2 days prior to today (and today) it has been half at these times.
For some insight, having such slow mornings end on a normal day has not been a characteristic of our store for many, many months. Highly doubtful it's coincidental, as this is such a large statistical anomaly that has went on for a few days now consistently.
Also it's a bit strange, as the majority of auto parts sales comes by 2PM PST (due to that being the time mechanics order). The last two days we did end at an "average" sales amount for the end of day. So it's quite odd that the mornings have been half the speed of normal, but ended at an "average".
Another oddity: Yesterday and the day before had the same exact number of total sales. And the total sales amount for the day was only $20 different.
This year they have been tweaking the algorithm more than past years. I'm assuming related to the effects GTC had.
We just have to roll with the punches. 😕
Thanks zamo - you're the man! You are more in touch with these things so I appreciate the update. I know the ebbs and flows and hate to jump to conclusions. Another algorithm change - I can't take much more of this.... I finally start to get a good flow going and they change things up again. I'm down 36% from last year and things should be picking up now - not go down.
Thanks for the kind words 🙂
I just keep hoping for a positive algorithm change. One of the ones in mid Jan seemed good for about a month. But then each successive one seems like more of a decline.
BTW, one key way I've noticed that you can tell when they recently changed algorithms is the sellers hub sales chart timing will be off for a few days. If you look on the overview, rather than saying to a current time, it will be delayed a few hours. Right now it says "Data for Mar 25 – Apr 24 at 1:17pm PDT". It's 4:30PDT, lol. Yet the statistics are measured only to that time.
That's one more piece of the puzzle, btw, as not only do sales seem to be coming in hours later than they ever have in this category, but the sellers hub measurements seem to be behind a few hours as well...?
Makes it much harder to track the daily sales. You have to check the actual orders pages and make sure it matches whenever the Sellers Hub catches up.
If I were to assume, I'd say this is the result of the system being a bit behind while re-adjusting to changes. But I want to be transparent that this part of what I say is only a theory.
The part I mention about sales acting differently which implies an algorithm change, that's based on statistics being different/abnormal.
Best we can wish for is some stability, but I don't know if eBay will realize that this year, or until it's too late... (although it's already too late for many sellers it seems).
Strange that eBay is doing such good marketing for other marketplaces as they degrade their own value to sellers 😞
04-26-2019 05:43 AM
I feel like i was blacked out/turned off or whatever you would want to call it this week. Unusual to go 3 days w no sales at all. No messages no nothing. Wonder if there's an issue w the site or if they just flipped a switch and turned me off?