USPS charging extra for a media mail shipment?

[johdevas]

I had recently sold a drybox cooler and it included free shipping. Based on the buyer's location it was going to cost me $100 for Priority mail or $37 for UPS, I couldn't afford either so I chose the media mail option which was like $8.50. 

Now the customer is emailing me saying USPS wants to charge them $120 for him to get the item? I checked the shipping and it's almost as if they shipped it priority cause it was saying initially like a week for it to get from Orlando to NV and it only took 3 days? 

The label said Media mail, not priority and had all the proper dimensions and weight when I placed the order so what's going here?

The only odd thing here is that when I checked the tracking it said that the item was undeliverable at the buyer's address. Could that have something to do with it?

[epowerbargains]

Recently I sold a set of educational flash cards and the eBay system did not allow me to select media mail. I did some research and asked a question here and another helpful eBay community member sent me proof from USPS that educational flash cards are considered Media Mail by USPS. I contacted eBay support and they reviewed the information and set in motion the steps needed to amend the eBay system so that  educational Flash Cards would show up as media mail eligible. I sent the cards USPS priority mail ( they were over 16 oz) so that the customer would get them in the proper time frame as it was projected by eBay that changes to the system would take 2-3 weeks. I post this to point out how sensitive sellers must be to the tight rules and restrictions USPS has for media mail. When in doubt - research - if in doubt don't send via media mail - unless you are positive your item falls well within the guidelines.  The OP has gotten some great guidance from the helpful eBay community .

[nobody*s_perfect]

eBay's block on access to labels for Media Mail was originally based on the main top category, but lately they have been trying to revise the eligibility of subcategories so specific eligible items won't be blocked (or will be blocked, such as magazines). I see a past Sold listing where you had flash cards listed in the subcategory "Other educational toys." It's unlikely that eBay will exempt that entire subcategory.

Its a shame that you got stuck paying for Priority Mail.  You could have purchased Media Mail through other online postage sellers (such as PayPal) or even at the PO counter.

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@epowerbargains wrote: ...  When in doubt - research - if in doubt don't send via media mail - unless you are positive your item falls well within the guidelines. .. .

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The OP's expensive situation arose because he had no doubts; he assumed that eBay offering MM meant that his item was eligible.

[bamfcomicsva]

You most likely committed Mail Fraud and shipped an item that was not eligible for Media Mail like comic books and such and they charged the correct rate for the item at full Parcel Post. For a full list of what's legal to ship thru Media Mail here's their website.

MEDIA MAIL SERVICE (usps.com)

[wastingtime101]

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@epowerbargains wrote:

Recently I sold a set of educational flash cards and the eBay system did not allow me to select media mail. I did some research and asked a question here and another helpful eBay community member sent me proof from USPS that educational flash cards are considered Media Mail by USPS. I contacted eBay support and they reviewed the information and set in motion the steps needed to amend the eBay system so that  educational Flash Cards would show up as media mail eligible. I sent the cards USPS priority mail ( they were over 16 oz) so that the customer would get them in the proper time frame as it was projected by eBay that changes to the system would take 2-3 weeks.

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Adding more context on flash cards.

I helped another poster with educational flash cards a few months ago. From what I recall:

Educational flash cards are eligible if and only if they are mailed with the accompanying testing material. So something like a generic pack of math flash cards you might get for kids in the toy or book section of a store does not qualify because there are no testing materials - it's just a box of stand-alone flash cards.

If your item qualified because you had accompanying testing materials, then you could have purchased a MM label anywhere (pirateship, paypal, retail counter, etc).

[nobody*s_perfect]

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@wastingtime101 wrote: ... Educational flash cards are eligible if and only if they are mailed with the accompanying testing material. So something like a generic pack of math flash cards you might get for kids in the toy or book section of a store does not qualify because there are no testing materials - it's just a box of stand-alone flash cards....

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This chart issued by USPS for staff says that educational flash cards are eligible, with no qualifiers:

https://liteblue.usps.gov/news/link/2013/04apr/Media-Mail-Guidelines.htm

[wastingtime101]

Yeah, that's where I got the info. The chart cites "Customer Support Ruling # PS 017" and when you look that up here it says:

Accessories to objective test materials include articles such as answer sheets, scoring keys, directions how to take the test, pencils and similar devices, which are mechanically or procedurally necessary to take the tests and permit central scoring. These items are acceptable at the Media Mail prices only when mailed with the actual printed objective test materials to which they relate.

Are flash cards not an "accessory" to test materials.?

[nobody*s_perfect]

I think that ruling sees the flash cards themselves as testing materials; they certainly aren't accessories like pencils or answer sheets (though I suppose you could say that each flash card has its own answer sheet on the back). 

[albertabrightalberta]

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@johdevas wrote:

No I didn't get a warning about media only. The label generator had the weight and dimensions of the item and still allowed me to create the label. 

I have never used media mail before, only Priority, First class and UPS. I used MM cause it was the only option i could afford. The free shipping amount was included into the price, I don't know why they're ripping my head off for this thing just to go from Orlando to Vegas, it's not like I'm sending it to Moscow. The most I was expecting was maybe $20, not $100. There was no way to know this would happen. 

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Your package was over 1 cubic foot (1728 cu inches) so you're hit with dimensional pricing.

The listing clearly shows that you've promised to ship by priority mail and you are NOT allowed to downgrade shipping, especially to one that's disallowed for the category of item you're selling. 

This is from the listing: 

[buyselljack2016]

What I want to know is how you dropped the item off. If you selected media mail and printed off a label and took it to the clerk and they scanned it, the clerk should have gotten a red flag then and there. The system would have notified the clerk once they placed it on the scale and scanned it.

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Much has changed at the Post Office.  I am not privy to the policy directives that have been distributed, but as I understand it, with the implementation of the APV, clerks (whatever employees) are to scan the item, and send it on the way. They are not to spend their time verifying size/weight/class on the accepted items.

As we are using labels purchased "online", we have already verified that there is nothing liquid, fragile, perishable, or potentially hazardous contained in the shipment, so no point in spending precious postal time asking that question. Back a while I was asked that question when I brought my "pre-paids" to the counter for acceptance, but can not remember the last time I was asked. I realize that at some offices I was not asked because they knew me, but at other places I am also now not being asked.

In the past (pre APV) if they spotted an obvious error they could/should/would reject the item at that point. Now, I know that there have been posts about that happening, but I suspect that is just employees that have the mindset that they are supposed to do that because that is what they have been doing for 10-20 years. Some also as a courtesy to people they know. (friends/neighbors/their regular customers)

My PO, and a nearby one that I sometimes use do not provide/do not have the ability to provide...... printed receipts. Also 4 out of 5 going in the other direction do not have that capability.

Was talking "fake" forever stamps with an employee early this month. Employee said "a local customer" used the "fake" ones. Employee said nothing to the person about the stamps.  I did not question as to why that stance. To me it seemed like sort of a disservice to the customer. The mail could be seized, and held by USPS. If paying a bill it could be a problem.

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As a general statement.....................  as odd as it may seem to many of us here................  selling hundreds, or even thousands of items on eBay does not mean that someone would know what MM is.  Yes, they should, and are responsible for their actions, but again does not mean that they are aware.

[albertabrightalberta]

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@soh.maryl wrote:

What "quick decision" will even come close to making this right?  

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I inferred the quick decision to be that @johdevas has to decide whether to issue a full refund now or wait for the buyer to file INR and win the dispute because of the incorrect shipping method used. At the point that the buyer files, they WILL win the dispute and it might be weeks, months or never that the seller gets the item back (with $240 postage due)!

[mtgraves7984]

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@albertabrightalberta wrote:

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@soh.maryl wrote:

What "quick decision" will even come close to making this right?  

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I inferred the quick decision to be that @johdevas has to decide whether to issue a full refund now or wait for the buyer to file INR and win the dispute because of the incorrect shipping method used. At the point that the buyer files, they WILL win the dispute and it might be weeks, months or never that the seller gets the item back (with $240 postage due)!

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@albertabrightalberta 

It's splitting hairs, but won't the $120 charge stand (for the OP) if the package is refused by the buyer? (I didn't know that it was assessed each direction.) 'Splitting hairs' in that the OP probably doesn't want to pay either to get the cooler back...

[varebelrose]

Over 9600 positive feedback as a seller, and you didn't know media mail is only for...media? I am assuming you have been cheating the system  and getting lucky for a very long time...

[gkn29]

Most of the items people complain about on these forums are pretty close to qualifying. A cooler? Nope. 

[wastingtime101]

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@nobody*s_perfect wrote:

I think that ruling sees the flash cards themselves as testing materials; they certainly aren't accessories like pencils or answer sheets (though I suppose you could say that each flash card has its own answer sheet on the back). 

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I'd like to believe you have the correct assessment. I viewed flash cards as a study aid for a test, not an actual test. I'm probably splitting hairs. Want to be careful that I don't give wrong advice to someone resulting in postage due for MM.

Back on the main topic:

• No, eBay should not have presented MM as an option.
• Yes, OP should have known better with their years of experience, but we all make mistakes.
• OP created a SNAD by downgrading from advertised Priority mail service. That's a policy violation OP needs to be aware of to avoid repeating it.
• OP's takeaway that they should have used UPS instead ignores UPS rates as estimates and dimensional weight is often billed after the package is shipped, along with other surcharges.
• The root cause of this issue was OP setting up their listing with an incorrect shipping method. Regardless of MM regulations, what shipping options eBay presented, etc - this all stemmed from the OP offering Med Flat Rate box.

My suggestions to @johdevas are:

• Refund the buyer, forfeit the cooler to USPS and write off the loss on taxes.
• Before listing anything large/heavy, make sure you understand fully how dimensional rates are calculated for different carriers and what surcharges you might face. If unsure, come here and post package dimensions + weight before listing the item for sale. Posters will help you figure out the best shipping options and how to set up the listing's shipping section if you're unsure.

[albertabrightalberta]

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@mtgraves7984 wrote:

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@albertabrightalberta wrote:

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@soh.maryl wrote:

What "quick decision" will even come close to making this right?  

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I inferred the quick decision to be that @johdevas has to decide whether to issue a full refund now or wait for the buyer to file INR and win the dispute because of the incorrect shipping method used. At the point that the buyer files, they WILL win the dispute and it might be weeks, months or never that the seller gets the item back (with $240 postage due)!

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@albertabrightalberta 

It's splitting hairs, but won't the $120 charge stand (for the OP) if the package is refused by the buyer? (I didn't know that it was assessed each direction.) 'Splitting hairs' in that the OP probably doesn't want to pay either to get the cooler back...

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I thought the seller would have to pay return shipping also if he wants the cooler back. 

And on another note, the best thing that could have happened and what I wish had happened is that the item would have been delivered to the buyer and USPS would have notified ebay of the $120 underpayment and ebay would have charged @johdevas 's account. 

That way, the buyer would get what he/she expected and wouldn't have been inconvenienced by the seller's wrongdoing.