eBay

bitcollect · ‎08-22-2024

Hi. I've been selling over 20 years and never ran into this, so I'm hoping someone has some insight. Thanks in advance for the help.

I sold a high ticket item just under two weeks ago. The label was purchased on the eBay shipping platform(I double checked and the dimensions, weight, etc were entered correctly). All went well until the item reached the destination city. Once there, tracking froze for several days. UPS customer service was no help until yesterday when I was finally told that their fraud team had flagged the package and was provided a contact email. They told me that the item would not be returned to me or be delivered. They stated,

"Going forward, to avoid a similar scenario, we strongly encourage you to inquire and verify that the vendors you purchase from are using legitimate UPS products/services."

When I informed them that it was purchased on the eBay shipping platform, they suggested contacting eBay and said they would have more information. They also refunded the portion of my shipping that I paid for insurance as an adjustment for overpayment.

I contacted eBay and they didn't give me any information as to why it was flagged as fraudulent. They said that the insurance wouldn't be valid since UPS refunded it. (If UPS thinks it's fraud, they wouldn't pay out anyway.)

The eBay rep I spoke to seemed to think I'd still be covered, but I'm not so sure. I'm just baffled at the situation. I never thought I'd purchase a label on eBay and have it flagged as fraud. After the fact, I looked up the issue and found some instances where people were using discount brokers or purchased labels that appear to have been either counterfeit or purchased through a 3rd party that had hacked someone else's account to purchase the label. I'm not finding anything for eBay.

I have a bad feeling I'm going to end up out the item and a large amount of money. The customer had been fairly understanding until I informed him of this. He's become a bit irrational and accusatory and I believe chargeback is imminent, if not already completed.

Anyone have any experience and/or suggestions on this?

Thanks in advance!

rfmtm · ‎08-23-2024

Wow, so UPS is claiming a counterfeit label. You would need to look at the UPS tariffs on their website to see what remedies are available to dispute this.

@wastingtime101 Can you shed some light on this situation?

titipeo · ‎08-23-2024

I have a feeling that your label had been previously used by someone else, a hacker, and you got caught when "legally" purchasing it. eBay is certainly a valid 3rd party provider, no doubt on that, but someone beat you on the labels. Scammers are getting very good at predicting labels. eBay needs to step up here and solve this issue for you, as it is not your fault.

fbusoni · ‎08-23-2024

@titipeo wrote:
I have a feeling that your label had been previously used by someone else, a hacker, and you got caught when "legally" purchasing it. eBay is certainly a valid 3rd party provider, no doubt on that, but someone beat you on the labels. Scammers are getting very good at predicting labels. eBay needs to step up here and solve this issue for you, as it is not your fault.

You have a "feeling" that someone has hacked into the UPS system and is creating phony labels with the precise number / letter / code arrangement that a prospective seller might randomly purchase at any given time on eBay?

Please explain, that sounds like wizardry to me.

eBay seller since 1999. This is a posting ID.

bitcollect · ‎08-23-2024

@rfmtm @titipeo

Thanks for the responses. I pushed back to the UPS fraud team and this was their newest response:

"

Unfortunately, we have determined that the above-referenced shipment was intercepted in our network due to the suspicion of fraudulent activity and misappropriation of UPS products and/or services. Accordingly, UPS has exercised its right to refuse service to remove fraudulent shipments from our network.

As much as we want to help you, we can only provide additional details to the account owner, in this case eBay. Please contact the eBay regarding this shipment. "

I've discussed again with another eBay rep. Now I'm not so sure it was the label. They haven't given me a definitive answer on anything, or provided their correspondence with UPS, but have asked me to upload the email documentation, and have assured me that I'm covered. At this point I'm not sure I'll ever find out what the real issue is, but hopefully they hold true to their word in backing me. They said they cant step in on the case until next week, as 3 business days is their process. This leads me to believe maybe there's something else going on. I don't want to point fingers without solid evidence, but I don't know why they would step in to resolve a case in my favor like this if there wasn't. Of course they may be telling the buyer the same thing, and provide him with compensation as well. I'm not sure. I haven't had any communication with the buyer since I informed him that the package was confiscated, and he accused me of being part of a fraud ring conspiring against him. I'll keep you updated when I have more information.

titipeo · ‎08-23-2024

@fbusoni wrote:
@titipeo wrote:
I have a feeling that your label had been previously used by someone else, a hacker, and you got caught when "legally" purchasing it. eBay is certainly a valid 3rd party provider, no doubt on that, but someone beat you on the labels. Scammers are getting very good at predicting labels. eBay needs to step up here and solve this issue for you, as it is not your fault.
You have a "feeling" that someone has hacked into the UPS system and is creating phony labels with the precise number / letter / code arrangement that a prospective seller might randomly purchase at any given time on eBay?

Please explain, that sounds like wizardry to me.

I work as a licensed customs broker doing mass clearance of e-commerce shipments worldwide, but primarily from China, Shei, Temu, among others. Shipments already come prelabeled with UPS/USPS Fedex post, they cleared customs, are set up on gaylords, and eventually recovered by the final mile delivery agent, UPS/USPS/Fedex, PIttney Bowes, etc. Routinely US Customs, and USPS inspectors come to our facility to doble check the validity of the prepaid labels. We've even had entire shipments seized due to counterfeit labels. Wizardry no, reality and a way to cheat the system, yes.

wastingtime101 · ‎08-23-2024

@rfmtm wrote:
@wastingtime101 Can you shed some light on this situation?

Sounds like an issue on the carrier's end. eBay is (per above post by the seller) offering seller protections and requesting the carrier's documentation so eBay can address it with the carrier. Good to see eBay apply protections since the label was purchased using their UPS account.

We've seen an increase in label fraud problems this year among different carriers and so far eBay's been stepping up and stepping in to make sellers whole.

GLORIOUS!

bitcollect · ‎08-26-2024

Thanks @wastingtime101

Just to provide an update- As I previously stated, ebay Customer Service advised me to wait until the 27th (tomorrow) so that they could step in on the case... Well, I woke up this morning to emails stating that the case has been closed and a payment dispute is now open, so the buyer did go ahead and file a chargeback. Ebay customer service is now backtracking a bit, as they don't seem as eager to back me on the issue. They have stated that the payment dispute is ruled by the buyer's institution. I fully understand that, ,but it doesn't change the situation. The chargeback process varies by bank and he's already told me he is filing his with Amex, which tends to have pretty lenient chargeback rules, as long as their customers don't have a pattern of abuse. I'm going to try to get in contact with someone else at ebay. I'm not sure if I can request previous reps I spoke to or not. This situation seems crazy to me. It's almost like they don't want to make UPS or Amex mad. They seemed fine when it was coming from the buyer, which it should, but now that Amex is involved, they're backing down and I'm the one paying. Very frustrating.

wastingtime101 · ‎08-26-2024

Wow, that's super frustrating @bitcollect . If the buyer waited one more day eBay would have refunded them from their pocket. Keep at it with CS and let us know what happens.

GLORIOUS!

bitcollect · ‎08-26-2024

Thanks. I'm working on it. I had a call escalated this afternoon. I was hoping that I would make more progress. Ebay is not understanding UPS's stance. UPS will not give me any information since the shipping account is in Ebay's name. UPS refunded the amount I paid for insurance (not the insured amount) as a shipping adjustment, invalidating any insurance, and will not allow me to file any claim, I assume because it's flagged as fraud. UPS says that Ebay shipping has more information, but the CSRs I spoke to today did not seem to think so. The guy last week acted like they did. Of course, I spoke only to CSRs. They don't seem to want to relay me to the shipping department. Today's escalation team all but told me that the buyer's financial institution controls my money now. He kept saying that "the financial institution is above eBay." They've asked me to contact the local UPS location and law enforcement, which seems like a last ditch effort. I hope it's not the case, but it feels like my only chance is to somehow get my package back, or hope to get through to someone at Ebay that will cover me with the seller guarantee they said I was covered by prior to today. I don't know how the seller guarantee can change based on whether or not the buyer files a chargeback. I am beside myself after it appeared to be all but settled last week. It's a lot of money to me right now.

gurlcat · ‎08-26-2024

The recommendation to contact local law enforcement may not be as absurd as it sounds. I have seen numerous posts here where that appeared to be just the ticket to having eBay issue a courtesy refund to the buyer from their own revenue. Basically their thinking is, 'What criminal would get the cops involved?'

bitcollect · ‎08-26-2024

I plan to do everything they told me to do, but was looking at it from how effective law enforcement would be in getting my package or money. I'm glad you brought this point up. I hope you are right. I'm in a negative headspace right now and not thinking clearly. Thank you!

gurlcat · ‎08-26-2024

Hey I feel ya. I had a box of live guppy fish seized by Homeland Security for 9 days once. -They survived it though, believe it or not. 😁

But yeah, it's all about the report serving as proof that you filed a report, not what the police can actually do.