refunding for overpayment of shipping, ethical or just plain dumb?

[keziak]

Someone bought 4 things from me and paid instead of waiting for an invoice with combined shipping. It's always been my policy to determine the actual shipping cost and refund for the overage. My husband thinks I'm dumb as a stump for doing that. Surely if they paid they are satisfied with the shipping. But it just bothers me to accept a payment for way more than the actual shipping cost. Any thoughts? I'll add that when I refund and let them know why they virtually never acknowledge this or say thanks. 

[equid0x]

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Do you also buy on ebay?  Would you continue to buy from a seller that is dishonest?  I know I have my favorite seller list who I purchase from even if they charge a bit more because they go up and beyond in the way they treat their buyers.  Also postage is right there on the box so buyers can see if they have been overcharged.

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Being charged the invoice amount for a purchase isn't "overcharging." Seller have a right to mark up shipping costs. If you don't want to pay it, buy from someone else. 

[equid0x]

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@mcdougle4248 wrote:

I always refund for overpayment of shipping charges.  I, too, very rarely get any kind of acknowledgement or thank you from buyers.  That's  fine, I do it because I feel it's the right thing to do. 

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Because the buyer doesn't care. They already made their buying decision based on your sales and shipping charges when they paid you. 

[equid0x]

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@nobody*s_perfect wrote:

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@keziak wrote: .... It's always been my policy to determine the actual shipping cost and refund for the overage.... 

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You should at least hold back enough to pay for the increased final value fee.  And remember, sellers are allowed to charge a handling fee to cover expenses such as packing materials.  eBay doesn't expect sellers to charge only the actual postage cost, so buyers shouldn't expect that either.

I state very clearly in my listings that the postage cost shown is the actual USPS postage based on package weight, and that for multiple purchases I will send a revised invoice that reflects the actual postage.  

About half of the multiple-item buyers do not heed this policy, and just go ahead and pay.  I send a refund of about HALF of what they've saved.  Never once have I gotten any acknowledgement or thanks.  I suspect that buyers who fail to wait for the combined invoice in the first place are just careless with their money, or oblivious. So the half-refund satisfied my conscience and also by the way pays for the final value fee for that overpayment since eBay doesn't give partial credit for final value fees when you give a partial refund.

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Why bother? The only amount you were obligated to charge was the one shown to them on the screen when they completed the purchase. 

[equid0x]

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@mam98031 wrote:

I have this happen frequently too.  If it is more than a buck, I too just refund.  However I do not do as you do.  I don't figure out my actual shipping costs and refund anything above that.  To do that is for me to lose money and I'm not big on doing that.

First, Ebay charges you the FVF on shipping based on the amount the buyer paid, so unless you call Ebay to get that refund on the amount you refund, this is a loss.  If the buyer paid with separate payments, there is the 30 cents transaction fee by PP that you have to pay.  And I do charge a small handling fee.

I have a message that I send all my buyers that over pay shipping.  I have one designed if they do it all in one payment and a different one if they pay in separate payments.

Since it is really rare for a buyer to even say thank you when I just refund their over payment, I put a copy of the email in their package and I hand note on it how much I refunded.  That also rarely results in a thank you, but I still do it because I think it is the right thing to do.

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Then, they open an SNAD and you get screwed on the full return shipping.

[equid0x]

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

But it is dishonest to keep the overpayment after the fact.

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There is zero dishonesty when the charge was right on the screen when you completed the sale. Sellers have a legal right to mark-up the shipping, whether you like it or not. 

[equid0x]

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Why should a buyer be grateful for getting back the money owed them?

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Because they weren't owed anything in the first place. Shipping charges were on the invoice. They agreed to pay THOSE charges. End of story. 

[equid0x]

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Buyers come here who don't have a clue about how ebay works and that they have to ask about combined shipping.  They figure the seller will take care of it.  

As a buyer I look at what I was charged vs what it says on the label, and if a seller takes advantage of me, then I will never buy from them again.

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Who cares? Its not the sellers' responsibility to teach the buyer how to buy. That's up to eBay. That's what we pay them for. 

[equid0x]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Buyers come here who don't have a clue about how ebay works and that they have to ask about combined shipping.  They figure the seller will take care of it.  

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Why would they expect a seller to take care of anything like that? Most marketplaces don't operate with shipping refunds. Amazon won't allow combined shipping for their marketplace sellers. I can only think of one other place off the top of my head that does offer combined shipping. If a buyer doesn't have a clue about eBay and how it works, then they're probably used to all the other venues where shipping is stated and that's it - no partial refunds for combining things.

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

As a buyer I look at what I was charged vs what it says on the label, and if a seller takes advantage of me, then I will never buy from them again.

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I can only recall one package I received out of all my purchases in the last 2 years that showed a shipping cost on the label.

Not combining shipping does not mean a seller is taking advantage. Those funds can be used to cover the cost of the packing materials, fees charged on the shipping, etc.

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I agree with you except combined shipping discounts are kinda a "thing" on eBay. But that't fine. Its still up to the buyer to "make it happen." Seller has ZERO obligation to provide ANY discounts. 

[equid0x]

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Why would the buyer pay $14 under that circumstance, unless ebay has another glitch and charges them the higher amount.  So yes the buyer is owed the $4 difference based on the listing.

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The buyer is owed NOTHING other than what was shown on the purchase invoice. Just like EVERY OTHER BUSINESS in the world. 

[equid0x]

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@mam98031 wrote:

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Buyers come here who don't have a clue about how ebay works and that they have to ask about combined shipping.  They figure the seller will take care of it.  

As a buyer I look at what I was charged vs what it says on the label, and if a seller takes advantage of me, then I will never buy from them again.

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That may be true for some buyers, but it certainly isn't true about others.  

What label?  You mean on the product you purchased from the seller?  Why in the world would you think the seller took advantage of you if you paid more than some label on the product?  Did you not do your own price comparisons?  Did you not decide that the price the seller was asking for the item would work for you and you AGREED to purchase it for that amount?

I get new old stock all the time.  Some of the items I sell are old but never were used by anyone.  They may still have stickers on them for the original pricing.  So lets say I'm selling a pattern from the 1960's and the price on the book is 1.00 and I'm selling it for $25.  Do you think you should have only paid a $1 and that I took advantage of you?

Similar situations can hold true on OOP [out of print] stuff, hard to find things, limited editions, etc.  There are endless reasons why a "label" may be different than the price charged on an item.

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This country has turned into the land of entitlement. 

I agree with you. Buyer is owed NOTHING. Seller can sell for 8000% markup so long as buyer agrees to buy it. Seller can ship at 8X USPS shipping cost so long as buyer agrees to pay it. That's business.

If we were all selling and shipping everything at cost then there would be ZERO items on eBay. 

[equid0x]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Why would the buyer pay $14 under that circumstance, unless ebay has another glitch and charges them the higher amount.  So yes the buyer is owed the $4 difference based on the listing.

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In the example the total the buyer agreed to was $14. $5 for the first item plus $1 each additional. 5 + 9 = 14

That poster was saying if the actual shipping cost is $10 the buyer is not owed $4 because they agreed to pay $14.

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And the seller is an idiot considering they would need to sell at least 3 at a time to make the numbers work. 

[equid0x]

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

If I want to purchase multiple items from a seller I contact them and ask if they will combine shipping.  If not, I move on to another listing.

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Sounds like cheapskate material. 

[equid0x]

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@aggrkat-0 wrote:

Not true at all.  But I also look at what I think the cost of the item should be and how much shipping cost should be and if their listing is way over that, I move on.

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Right. Because seller should make no money yet stay in business. 

[equid0x]

There are ZERO B&Ms who refund "excess postage." That should tell you something. 

[equid0x]

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@moo*cow*corner wrote:

@keziak 

My comment was not directed to you personally. My apologies if you felt attacked. I had no such intention.

It's the buyer entitlement that annoys me. No one fills their cart at Walmart and demands a combined discount. There are very few places left on the net where a customer can even negotiate shipping.

I need whatever it is that I need in order to get a customer's order to them safely and in a timely fashion. If I don't cover all my expenses and still show a profit, I won't be in business very long. That's the simple truth.

See, to me the Golden Rule applies a bit differently than commonly interpreted. I prefer to find out what someone values, and then do those things. Even if it's something I don't value much at all. Doing something unto someone who doesn't appreciate that thing does nothing.

But if you feel better, I see no harm in it. Just understand that if no thanks are even offered, then that particular person did not value the refund in the same way that you might. To me, that's OK too!  It's when these things become entitlements (AKA owed to someone) that I get annoyed.

All that being said, I do offer a combined discount set as a percentage of additional purchases (50%). If a buyer buys more than 3 lots, sometimes I do refund a bit. Shipping charges above 3 purchases tend to appear to be somewhat inflated, especially if a buyer in in a near zone to me.

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DING DING DING

Finally, someone who gets it.