eBay

michael_atw · ‎12-09-2017

I remember some time ago I got used to the "money back guarantee" aspect of eBay. I recognized that in most cases, there wasn't an issue in my mind with the streamline of the issues.

I was not happy about the absolute lack of customer service with regards to the return process; however, I've figured out ways to deal.

..until recently.

In the past, lying to eBay was grounds to close cases. Now? Nope, not anymore.

I've had two instances in recent weeks of eBayers lying to eBay about their returns and abusing the process and eBay has allowed them.

One instance, someone bought an item from me which was clearly noted as "broken". They filed a return dispute with eBay which I fought. I lost, they returned it and negged me. eBay allowed them to lie in the case when it was clear my description said it was broken. They opened a SNAD, not a buyer's remorse case. I have a 15% restocking fee that would have applied.

A couple weeks ago, I had a buyer with zero feedback and had created the account that day buy an item from me. I had a very clear vibe I'd have an issue because of it. The guitar body was unloaded of parts except for the tuning keys and a metal plate on the headstock. No strings or electronics.

He bought it and opened a dispute claiming 'missing pieces' SNAD and claimed a bunch of parts were missing that weren't in photos or description. Contacted eBay. Guess what? They agreed immediately but then, she says, "But I'm seeing a 14-day-return policy so you have to accept it back".
Unbelievable. I have shouted down this garbage before but I sternly reasserted the facts. She agreed. Then she says, "He's going to return it, but you won't pay for it." And I demanded I get my 15% restocking fee. Still in disbelief.

She agrees, when I refund him... I get to without restocking fee. I settled with it. I'm over this s***. She says, "Most of them don't return it. But if he does, let us know if there is an issue."

I checked today. It's on the way back, I checked the return button: I can't refund him minus the restocking fee. I have to call again and this time raise Cain. I'm sick and tired of being lied to. And if that label comes back "package return service" (even though I didn't pay for it) I will know that eBay themselves subsidize bald-faced lies.

This is to the point where permitting lies will damage the marketplace. You can't let people lie because they will use it as a tool to damage accounts.

In fact, I have this weird sense that this guy bought it with the sole intention of returning it and wasting my time and money. It makes little sense any other way.

After tens of thousands of transactions, I'm seeing a clear picture of growth of abusive buyers.

castlemagicmemories · ‎12-10-2017

@relztrah wrote:
@castlemagicmemories wrote:

I saw a doll recently listed as new. When you read the description, you find out the legs are not attached! The very last picture shows this.

I messaged the seller that new must be intact. She maintained that since it was new, that did not matter, so she kept on listing the doll as new.

A SNAD in the making.
I believe we have a new acronym here: NWOL - new without legs.

tunicaslot · ‎12-10-2017

People also have to take responsibility for their own actions and quit making excuses and blaming it on Ebay. No one should make comments like calling somone "dumb" - but people do have to think before listing items, answering emails, and calling scam everytime you turn around.

Most people come here upset and don't want to hear that they've done something wrong or against the rules and that is why they are in the situation thay are in. We try to help them understand so that they don't find themselves in the same situation again.

The OP has been very successful and has been lucky with SNAD returns even tho some of his merchandise may have been listed using the wrong discriptor. He's aware of it now - but still feels that the SNAD was wrongly approved. It's his choice whether to take the advice given when listing the next non working item or to take his chances listing like he has been listing.

castlemagicmemories · ‎12-10-2017

With all due respect, I did read the OP.

In one situation, you said the buyer lied. But you take returns. When you take returns, you take returns for any reason.

Change your terms to no returns if you don't want them but the MBG will override that in cases of not as described. And a restocking fee is not allowed if the item is not as described.

When you chose used, the Ebay definition says it must work. Your description does not override that. That made it SNAD.

Sorry you are upset about these things. Some may call this a pile on, and I am sorry if you are one, but this are the big picture of what happened here. Many times posters may feel like they are being piled on but it is just multiple posters pointing out what happened and why, and OPs may not want to see, or be able to see, it that objectively because they are too close and emotionally involved. Not saying this is you, but many in society today also can not accept when they are wrong; all they see is a situation that they think is unfair to them.

campesinoplastic2014 · ‎12-10-2017

It is extremely complex compared to the early days. The bad news is that very few people know how refunds and scams work until they lose a bunch of money. The information is certainly out there, but nobody (myself incuded) wants to sift through it UNTIL there is a problem, and that's expensive. I think there is more info here than probaly anywhere else. If I could be a new seller all over again, I would come here and just read it all for a month or so. It was simpler back then though, and I don't think they had these boards until later.

castlemagicmemories · ‎12-10-2017

@tunicaslot wrote:
People also have to take responsibility for their own actions and quit making excuses and blaming it on Ebay. No one should make comments like calling somone "dumb" - but people do have to think before listing items, answering emails, and calling scam everytime you turn around.

Most people come here upset and don't want to hear that they've done something wrong or against the rules and that is why they are in the situation thay are in. We try to help them understand so that they don't find themselves in the same situation again.

This is it in a nutshell, many thanks for posting this!

The OP has been very successful and has been lucky with SNAD returns even tho some of his merchandise may have been listed using the wrong discriptor. He's aware of it now - but still feels that the SNAD was wrongly approved. It's his choice whether to take the advice given when listing the next non working item or to take his chances listing like he has been listing.

And this, too. Exactly.

castlemagicmemories · ‎12-10-2017

@tunicaslot wrote:
Thanks Lynn - I was going to point that out as I tried listing one myself and there is a for parts / not working selection available. There is nothing about it not working in the title or the small item description box that pops up when you choose used or not working.

Plus the feedback says the buyer asked for a cancel - and it was sent anyways. If a buyer asks for a cancel - don't fight it as you can see what happens. As frustrating as CS can be - this time they got it right.

Important fact there somehow not included earlier.

castlemagicmemories · ‎12-10-2017

@michael_atw wrote:
For those of us who read descriptions, the description clearly says it's broken.

Yes, but sadly the condition definition of used says it must work.

It won't make you feel better, I know, but many sellers miss that used is supposed to work; it states that in the definition of used by Ebay.

Parts, not working, would have coincided with the not working description.

tunicaslot · ‎12-10-2017

The forums have been around forever! But I agree that a new seller or buyer will get more information here and in terms they can understand - than trying to go thru the help tutorials and policies.

I have the utmost respect for the posters here who know the rules, policies and regulations in and out - but I have them hard to read and decipher myself and I think newer sellers and buyers may also have problems. Plus many of us jump in with both feet and never read the how to's.

I do agree that things were simpler in the past - but there were still many bad things going on back then and it was mostly sellers taking advntage of buyers who had no recourse. I had little problems back then - but imagine being a buyer who pd $125 for a broken item not advertised as such or getting a knock off bag you paid $300 for - and you had no recourse.

I'd never buy here again if that happened to me so although I think we have swung too far to the left and sellers have less protection - I don't know that there is a happy medium when it comes to online selling on any of the venues.

michael_atw · ‎12-10-2017

There's nothing contradicting about saying a broken pickup is used. It is used.

And it says in the description it is broken.

How this is my fault? Well, eBay forum posters are good at figuring that out. I'll leave it up to you.

I bet I've sold 30 and counting over the years of broken pickups and not had an issue.

But please, continue to tell me how I'm wrong. Or, be more productive and move along somewhere else.

michael_atw · ‎12-10-2017

Ain't that the truth. We all know the real reason why people have posting IDs.

It's because they get attacked.

I have never come here much for advice - nor will I ever. In fact, from what I see, this forum is dominated by a very few.

michael_atw · ‎12-10-2017

Implying I didn't follow the rules is idiotic.

michael_atw · ‎12-10-2017

No, you clearly did not read the original post.

I said the buyer lied in the dispute process. What does that have to do with me accepting returns? The buyer lied. This is against eBay policy - that's why they have a useless report button for it.

woodyscollectibles · ‎12-10-2017

You said you had a feeling he was going to do it. I hate selling to new accounts. I think we all do. We all know the process. I always make sure I describe the stuff really good to a new buyer with a message before I box the item up. If I have a feeling something is headed south I will go out of my way to get the buyer to not buy the item. I send a few messages to make sure they know what there buying. Talk them out of the sale and get them to agree on canceling the purchase if you have a feeling there going to burn you. I have avoided a full problem sales that way. It's impossible to do that with everything but the new buyers and sellers I stay away from.........

michael_atw · ‎12-10-2017

I sell tens of thousands of dollars a year, I estimate, to new accounts. International sales have seen an uptick in this regard.

I am not concerned with the fact he was new. I'm concerned with the fact that he lied to eBay, they allowed it, then they lied to me, and that his newness is suspect. I suspect he isn't new at all.

New accounts with old faces is what I "fear".