Any chance of me winning this dispute?

[johnbm06]

Buyer buys an item, (on my wife's eBay ID, not this one) a larger item, shipped across country, about $60 shipping cost, brand new sealed in factory box. Buyer then opens a case, wants to return it, because "Just Didn't like it"-

In my wife's return policy, it just says this, very simply: "Returns are accepted if item is not as described".

So, we don't accept this return.

I called eBay to see what their official position would be, if I told the buyer that I don't accept, and when I called the first time, I called using my phone on my eBay ID, and the eBay rep, (who spoke perfect english giving me the impression that I was speaking to a call center in the United States), said that generaly, based on what I told her about the return policy and the buyer's admission that they just didn't like it, that the buyer did not have grounds to return it, that 'buyer's remorse' was not grounds to return it - and the ebay rep volunteered the phrase "buyer's remorse'-

Here might be some interesting observations, if you sell alot on eBay:

But I had to call eBay back later with my wife present, under her ID to ask specifically about this item number, ( and my wife's eBay ID is a small, relatively new seller, whereas my eBay ID that I called under initially is a top Rated seller, a 16 year old account in which I sell over $200,000 a year on eBay), and this time we got an eBay rep with a pretty sharp accent, making me wonder if I had been patched into an overseas eBay call center, maybe due to the fact that my wife is a very small seller, and this time, we got an opposite answer: That because I allowed returns within 14 days, then I was going to have to take the return back.  ( nevermind that I allowed returns within 14 days IF item is not as described---matters not to this ebay rep and her "manager").

Maybe I call back a third time tomorrow and I get the right answer again? 

anybody got expeience in this?

[uzumakey]

First of all, did the buyer indicate that the item had been opened or used in any way? eBay only allows returns (even for SNAD) for items returned in their original condition. If the buyer indicates that the item was used/altered in any way, mention that when you respond to the case then call eBay to have it closed in your favor.

If the buyer hasn't opened the item and it's still in the condition you sold it, you are obligated to accept the return. You can put whatever caveat you want in your listing regarding returns, but the truth is that a return policy includes remorse returns. If you're only allowing returns for items not as described, you might as well not include a return policy at all - Money Back Guarantee covers all SNAD cases, regardless of return policy.

[jonathankirkland]

It is in your best interest to just accept the return because if the buyer really wants to they could claim the item is "not as described" and you would be forced to accept a return anyway, plus in this instance, you would have to pay returning shipping also.

Ebay's MBG trumps your return policy.

Forcing someone to keep something they don't want is a bad idea.

[thenobletuckylife]

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@johnbm06 wrote:

Buyer buys an item, (on my wife's eBay ID, not this one) a larger item, shipped across country, about $60 shipping cost, brand new sealed in factory box. Buyer then opens a case, wants to return it, because "Just Didn't like it"-

In my wife's return policy, it just says this, very simply: "Returns are accepted if item is not as described".

So, we don't accept this return.

I called eBay to see what their official position would be, if I told the buyer that I don't accept, and when I called the first time, I called using my phone on my eBay ID, and the eBay rep, (who spoke perfect english giving me the impression that I was speaking to a call center in the United States), said that generaly, based on what I told her about the return policy and the buyer's admission that they just didn't like it, that the buyer did not have grounds to return it, that 'buyer's remorse' was not grounds to return it - and the ebay rep volunteered the phrase "buyer's remorse'-

Here might be some interesting observations, if you sell alot on eBay:

But I had to call eBay back later with my wife present, under her ID to ask specifically about this item number, ( and my wife's eBay ID is a small, relatively new seller, whereas my eBay ID that I called under initially is a top Rated seller, a 16 year old account in which I sell over $200,000 a year on eBay), and this time we got an eBay rep with a pretty sharp accent, making me wonder if I had been patched into an overseas eBay call center, maybe due to the fact that my wife is a very small seller, and this time, we got an opposite answer: That because I allowed returns within 14 days, then I was going to have to take the return back.  ( nevermind that I allowed returns within 14 days IF item is not as described---matters not to this ebay rep and her "manager").

Maybe I call back a third time tomorrow and I get the right answer again? 

anybody got expeience in this?

---

Hi John,

And everytime you call you will get a nonbinding answer from someone who has no "skin in the game".

If the listing had a 14 day return on it...then it doesn't matter what qualifiers you added...ebay simply looks at the portion they gave you as an option...14 day return.

They will ultimately hold you to this and all the conversations in the world will not result in them looking out for you.

Sorry.

Mr C

[hidy-hoo]

" ( nevermind that I allowed returns within 14 days IF item is not as described"

Hi, @johnbm06...sorry, but a seller either has a return policy for any reason or a "no return" policy for "buyers remorse"...you can't have both!  Stating that you will only accept returns if the item is SNAD and then listing the item as "returns accepted" is not allowed.

[muttlymob]

That because I allowed returns within 14 days, then I was going to have to take the return back.  ( nevermind that I allowed returns within 14 days IF item is not as described---matters not to this ebay rep and her "manager").

The eBay rep and her manager were right.

Here is the relevant policy:

https://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/return-policy.html

If you accept returns, a buyer can return an item for any reason, even if they change their mind about a purchase.

[slippinjimmy]

If a listing officially offers returns under ANY circumstances then returns are allowed for ANY reason.

The only way to refuse a remorse return if if the original listing stated This Seller Does Not Accept Returns. Any conditional statements within the description area are meaningless, unenforcable and a violation of eBay policy.

Thousands of sellers have such statements within their descriptions, it might discourage buyers from attempting returns but that's all. If eBay is asked by either the buyer or seller to resolve the matter the buyer will win every time.

[retrose1]

If it is a snad - no chance of winning.

If it is just a return request, you are not under obligation to send a return ship label and the buyer might change their minds about returning once they see how much it will cost them to actually return it.

But to be honest, a large, high dollar or expensive to ship item should have been listed on your id...because scammers tend to avoid experienced sellers and target newer/lower feedback sellers.  I do not believe that you will get out of this unscathed.

[phcd1]

It's simple, if you return policy (that little drop down box) says returns accepted, you accept returns for any reason. You can't disallow any returns and won't have that option. If you have "No Returns" listed as your return policy, you will have the option to deny this return as the buyer indicated "Just Didn't like it" (which is a buyer remorse return which is only covered with a return policy).

[johnbm06]

Thanks for the input. I admit I am assuming the buyer opened it because they chose "just didn't like it" as their apparent cookie cutter reason, then apparently wrote in, "not what I expected", and those comments imply to me that they opened it, because otherwise they would have never been able to determine that it was not what they expected. 

Good input though very helpful. I forgot about that little catch about the buyer needing to return it in the same condition that it was in. And it was factory sealed with bands around it. 

[johnbm06]

But.. would ebay allow them to change their 'reason' for wanting to return it? maybe even eBay, under appeal, would see them trying to change their reasoning as probably bogus. In fact, I doubt if they would even allow a second claim or dispute?

[johnbm06]

Thanks Mr C-

Truth is, I don't mind taking it back if A: the item is still factory sealed and B: I don't eat any of the shipping, then I have noooo problem at all. 

Even if eBay has lame policies like this, to me, there is still a benenfit in fighting it: They at least hear the reality of the impact of their lame policies and have to handle them and argue them and devote time to defending and enforcing and battling the consequences of lame policies....

[thenobletuckylife]

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@johnbm06 wrote:

Thanks Mr C-

Truth is, I don't mind taking it back if A: the item is still factory sealed and B: I don't eat any of the shipping, then I have noooo problem at all. 

Even if eBay has lame policies like this, to me, there is still a benenfit in fighting it: They at least hear the reality of the impact of their lame policies and have to handle them and argue them and devote time to defending and enforcing and battling the consequences of lame policies....

---

Hi John,

Thanks for the reply...also remember that if the item is returned opened it will be a lot tougher for you to get a customer service rep to side with you because they all of a sudden will say that they have no proof of what you sent to begin with.

Settling cases is not something that ebay does logically...it is what is soley in the interest of making sure buyers return and they figure you, the seller, can afford the loss if necessary...not right but it is how it works here.

Mr C

[johnbm06]

Hidy-hoo, nobody has a return policy for 'any reason' . If the buyer takes a baseball bat to a set of china, then claims a return because it didn't stand up to the baseball bat beating, then that seller is saying--"No, I don't think so". There are conditions to my accepting a return, And in my case, it is that I accept returns if the item is not as described. 

Now ebay I expect will force me to take it back, but that doesn't mean I accept it. It means they shoved it down my throat. I'm right, but I'll lose the case anyway, I expect. 

[johnbm06]

Mutly, but you should read on... here is what follows what you cut and pasted:

"This is true as long as the return meets your return requirements, for example, returning an item within your stated time frame, and meeting item condition requirements"........

This return request does NOT meet my return requirements. 

I'm right, but eBay holds the money. And they aren't concerned so much with being right as those of us who pay for their wrong ways.