After 16 Years This Is It. I'm Done! treasure.hunter.d 2003-2019 RIP

[treasure.hunter.d]

2003 I signed up on ebay.

It used to be fun. it is no longer  fun.

I used to make money, that's not happening here anymore either.

Ebay has made so many negatively impacting changes that it's simply not worth the effort for no return any longer. Ebay has literally watched the entire eCommerce world pass them by and now they panic and wonder what has happened?

They are trying to compete in the Indy 500 while driving a 1950 Deux Chevaux. To anyone that knows what to look at it is easy to see what a mess the site is, the code, the structured data that they harped and harped about, what a joke! There is no excuse for this other than ebay not caring a whit. Ebay has no interest in being, nor any intention to go back to being, an actual marketplace other than the incidental sales that haphazardly occur as a result of people posting items in order to pay the advertising company that ebay has now become. The hilarious thing about that is that ebay isn't even any good as an advertising entity, at least not for themselves anyway, lol...

Wenig said it himself when he answered questions about ebay increasing revenue streams by saying they were going to focus on taking more fees from people vs actually doing anything to increase sellers' ability to sell therefor generating those additional fees.

Every change that has been made in at least the last 5 years has either been horrendously negative in its impact for the average seller or something that was completely misrepresented or outright lied about. New stores with SEO Optimization? hahahahaha No such thing, never happened. Oh there was a store format change but absolutely nothing "optimized" for SEO. there's no one at Ebay that even knows what SEO is beyond the words themselves. GTC is great for sellers? Nope, wrong again. GTC is not great for all sellers and forcing people that it isn't good for into doing it was reprehensible. Many attempts to have someone from Ebay, anyone from ebay, explain exactly why it is good/beneficial to sellers who list only inventory count of 1 items has yielded 0 relevant or factual info. I don't need them to explain it to me you understand, I am more than well versed in all things Google/SEO/SERP/Schema (all of which people have tried to connect to the GTC change) etc but in the latter stages of this it did get a little fun listening to people twist themselves up in knots trying to explain something they were completely clueless about and then finishing by saying "So you see it's really great for all sellers right" I can almost see them nodding their heads, as if I could truly see them, trying to encourage me to do the same and get on board the GTC train with them lol.

Fees go up, sales go down, ebay collects taxes from Canadian sellers that they are 100% not entitled to collect but that hasn't slowed them down doing it. Before setting up to operate out of the US I did business in Canada for 30 years. I have been through multiple audits, with multiple companies, in several different industries, I know the tax code and laws and ebay is not entitled to collect taxes from Canadians in the manner they are taking them from sellers, PERIOD!

There is literally no longer any support of any type. No help for anything other than perhaps the most mundane of clerical errors and even that might be the luck of the draw for who you get on the phone.

The narrative though never waivers. Full steam ahead we're still one of the top marketplaces, lol. Yup that's why you are purchasing 400 million bot hits per month to the site so the numbers don't obviously crash. That btw is the easily verified minimum. The actual number is likely much higher but 400 million is the number that anyone knowing what they are looking at can see in about 30 seconds reviewing the traffic stats. Ebay  should have spent the money on a better service that masks the traffic a little better making it not so obvious lol. But they probably took advice from the same bottom of the barrel 3rd world, rubbish developers they are using to do anything on the site.

I could go on...and on...and on...and on......but I won't.

The straw that finally broke the camels back was this week ebay trying to force me to accept a fraudulent return. There is no doubt about the fraud. In fact, the fraudster was so ridiculously stupid, as to make claims in the reasons for the return that are quite literally physically impossible! I've spoken to several people in "non support", all of whom agree with me and can see the obvious nonsense but it doesn't matter. My 16 years on the site without a single return, doesn't matter. Feedback, nope, that doesn't matter either.  Despite being no help, a few of the people I spoke to were friendly enough but did nothing to help, despite agreeing with me after my pointing out the ridiculous nature of the claim. However, I spoke to 2 managers who both encouraged me to accept the return as "the right thing to do" and both of whom insisted that the Ebay Money Back Guarantee stated clearly that I had no other option and that I must accept the return. Well it DOES NOT say that, not anywhere, but that doesn't stop ebay from offering absolute no option in the return screen for me to tick off "NO" in response to the return request.

The system says I must respond by Thursday 27th but doesn't elaborate what will happen if I don't. Support will not allow me to involve ebay to any extent until Friday the 28th however the systems keeps insisting that if I want to involve ebay I need to make sure and request their assistance "BY" the 28th. It DOES NOT say that I need to wait until the 28th. Someone is lying! I call in and ask "so what happens if I do nothing and wait until Friday and call and ask you folks to step in?" I'm told nothing will happen. So if that is the case then why does the system insist that I MUST respond by the 27th and leave it hanging with no explanation of what will happen if I fail to respond? Why am I being told that despite this being an obvious fraud I am likely going to lose the case? At least the river tells you up front you must accept returns but ebay lets you think you can until they force you to accept one proving you have no say in the matter. Once you are under the boot of their in house payment system they will have you, you will be theirs to do whatever they want with and have 0 recourse in so far as anything you might now be able to do through PayPal to try and protect yourself in a situation like this!

Even if there is nothing nefarious at play here, this is without a doubt one of the most absolutely messed up processes that any nightmare could come up with to give you fits over! It is obviously set up/geared to force sellers, or at least rty to force sellers, into accepting returns, even fraudulent ones without any concern whatsoever for the circumstances or the seller's well being.

So after spending hours on the phone this week trying to ascertain the best way to deal with this, after being turned down flat to have it closed in my favor immediately, I have decided I'm done. Despite them trying, ebay can offer nothing of value for justification as to why they would force me to accept a fraudulent return. There is 0 benefit to anyone except the fraudster and I suppose the fees that ebay will undoubtedly keep. Any company that would put a seller like me through the wringer like this, with nothing but callous disregard for my well being as a seller, my reputation after 16 years, the fact that in all that time I have never had a single return other than a couple other frauds (both of which I won having them immediately closed shortly after they were instigated but that was some time ago), anyone that would call themselves my partner all these years and then hand the knife to someone so they can stick it in my back, anyone like this that places 0 value in my integrity as a seller, my history of nothing but ethical behavior and outstanding customer service, anyone like that....I no longer want anything to do with them and good riddance!

treasure.hunter.d

2003-2019

RIP

[tunicaslot]

I hope you feel better after the vent and am sorry to see another long time seller go. Many of us are using Ebay along with other sites to try and make a living. Gone are the days - for many of us - where Ebay was the only venue we needed.

Pertaining to your case - if you do not accept the return by the date specified - the buyer can escalate - Ebay will rule in their favor and the buyer will keep the item as well as be refunded their total payment. You on the other hand will be out the payment, the item you originally sent but will receive a bonus gift of an unresolved seller strike. As of April 2018 - we have not been able to fight SNADs and I have no clue why CS would tell you that nothing would happen because something does happen and not in a positive way for the seller.

We are suppose to be seeing more seller protection sometime this summer but everyone is still in the dark on exactly what that will mean for sellers. I've been here since 97.  I'm winding down but will probably still continue to list here and there. Depending on the item will depend on what site I list on. 

Best to you in your future endeavors - there is life after Ebay - it's just a shame it has come to this point for so many of us that have remained loyal.

[wastingtime101]

@treasure.hunter.d wrote:

It used to be fun. it is no longer fun. I used to make money, that's not happening here anymore either.

---

I really do understand this. The site used to be easy, breezy. Sales came with little to no effort and making money was a given.

But the reality is that things change. Everything changes. E-commerce has especially changed as the internet has turned into something completely different than it used to be. Technology does not sit still.

In part it's eBay policies and treatment of sellers in a buyer-centric environment that's pushing sellers out and eBay has a LOT of room for improvement when it comes to seller protections because right now it almost doesn't exist.

But in part eBay is surviving in a competitive cut-throat field and if they didn't adapt and change then the site wouldn't exist in any form. It's not all eBay's fault. The field we're all working in has undergone a huge evolution and it's no longer the right fit for everybody. It takes a LOT of hard work to keep up with this kind of platform.

(That said, I'm one of the first to jump up and say how dysfunctional eBay's search has become and how that surely has an impact on our sales because I know how it affects my purchases.)

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@treasure.hunter.d wrote:

The straw that finally broke the camels back was this week ebay trying to force me to accept a fraudulent return. My 16 years on the site without a single return, doesn't matter.

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I think that 16 years without a single return is a darn good track record. Congratulations, man, that was a great run.

I've encountered fraud on this site since the beginning so I think you're lucky to only be facing it now. If that's what ultimately pushes you out the door then all I have left to say is: good luck to you!

[laurabeardsley]

There is not only ZERO seller protection but buyers can leave false Negative feedback to rub salt in the wounds and there is ZERO protection for that as well!  They should advertise SELL AT YOUR OWN RISK

[Anonymous]

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@laurabeardsley wrote:

They should advertise SELL AT YOUR OWN RISK

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They do. It's called the "User Agreement".

[treasure.hunter.d]

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@tunicaslot wrote:

I hope you feel better after the vent and am sorry to see another long time seller go. Many of us are using Ebay along with other sites to try and make a living. Gone are the days - for many of us - where Ebay was the only venue we needed.

Pertaining to your case - if you do not accept the return by the date specified - the buyer can escalate - Ebay will rule in their favor and the buyer will keep the item as well as be refunded their total payment. You on the other hand will be out the payment, the item you originally sent but will receive a bonus gift of an unresolved seller strike. As of April 2018 - we have not been able to fight SNADs and I have no clue why CS would tell you that nothing would happen because something does happen and not in a positive way for the seller.

We are suppose to be seeing more seller protection sometime this summer but everyone is still in the dark on exactly what that will mean for sellers. I've been here since 97.  I'm winding down but will probably still continue to list here and there. Depending on the item will depend on what site I list on. 

Best to you in your future endeavors - there is life after Ebay - it's just a shame it has come to this point for so many of us that have remained loyal.

---

I hear you. I told several of the folks I spoke with about this emphatically that I did not want to pack it in over this but that if they were going to attempt to force me to accept what is obviously a fraud then that is what will happen. The alternative? Allow it to happen? That's as good as condoning it, encouraging it, whatever and I'll not be a party to that. So a ding, whatever ebay thinks, does, whatever doesn't really mean anything now does it? I know I'm right and that's all that matters. I also know that I am right and because of that I am steadfastly rooted in opposing anything ebay does about this and that includes their trying to take the $$ back from me.  I will not allow it, PERIOD!

I didn't make my post as a rant to make myself feel better. That would be awfully childish, and as a rule, most rants are not particularly on target or full of factual information. They tend to be just fairly mindless, wind-filled and excessively loud, diatribes issuing from the left brain of boorish gascons.

It was written as the epilogue in the chronicle of my story here. A warning to others that come behind perhaps as well!

[treasure.hunter.d]

@wastingtime101 wrote:

@treasure.hunter.d wrote:

It used to be fun. it is no longer fun. I used to make money, that's not happening here anymore either.

I really do understand this. The site used to be easy, breezy. Sales came with little to no effort and making money was a given.

But the reality is that things change. Everything changes. E-commerce has especially changed as the internet has turned into something completely different than it used to be. Technology does not sit still.

In part it's eBay policies and treatment of sellers in a buyer-centric environment that's pushing sellers out and eBay has a LOT of room for improvement when it comes to seller protections because right now it almost doesn't exist.

But in part eBay is surviving in a competitive cut-throat field and if they didn't adapt and change then the site wouldn't exist in any form. It's not all eBay's fault. The field we're all working in has undergone a huge evolution and it's no longer the right fit for everybody. It takes a LOT of hard work to keep up with this kind of platform.

(That said, I'm one of the first to jump up and say how dysfunctional eBay's search has become and how that surely has an impact on our sales because I know how it affects my purchases.)

@treasure.hunter.d wrote:

The straw that finally broke the camels back was this week ebay trying to force me to accept a fraudulent return. My 16 years on the site without a single return, doesn't matter.

I think that 16 years without a single return is a darn good track record. Congratulations, man, that was a great run.

I've encountered fraud on this site since the beginning so I think you're lucky to only be facing it now. If that's what ultimately pushes you out the door then all I have left to say is: good luck to you!

Thats just it though man. This has nothing to do with work, effort, changing, adjusting whatever. Nothing, absolutely nothing.  My work ethic is unquestionable, it's how I'm wired but there is simply no amount of work that can be done to be profitable both consistently and safely, on ebay any longer. You know this when you understand what is wrong and that its not being fixed.

I hear all kinds of people talking about all of the sales they are making and rarely does anyone put up any proof! They are all the exception to the rules I guess when the numbers show how dismal all of the selling prices are!

Forget all of that though, as true as it is. Anything you are doing now, can be taken away from you in an instant and there's not a thing you can d about it because ebay will do it for some reason that suits them.

Sorry but anyone who answers post like mine with It's all about change and keeping up and some people aren't cut out for it anymore" that's all talking head rubbish. you don't put that over on someone who has been in business for 30+ years  and has stayed on top of every single innovation that has ever touched ecomm. I'm not sure what your background is but I'll put my credentials in all facets related up against yours any day of the week.

You guys talk about things that are meaningless like somehow they matter. They don't not a bit. At this point it literally really doesn't matter what you are selling on ebay unless you happen to be a golden child and thats more about promises made than content but even they are leaving.

If you sell bananas on the corner, and the city builds a new building in front of your stand and suddenly nobody can see you or walk by, what good does it do to stop selling bananas and start selling shoes, or anything else for that matter.

Sorry mate but people come in here all the time with these responses about keeping up, changing yada yada yada, then somehow it goes to you're just not cut out for this anymore. Great spin/shift, suddenly it's all the sellers fault lol.  Those responses have no more merit now than they ever have, perhaps even less.Personally I really don't care other than to say what I have but I often feel sorry for the young, inexperienced sellers that hear that nonsense and believe it!

Then you close with saying what, because I refuse to accept/condone fraud and make a choice to leave what has become a completely unethical environment, I am what, taking my toys and running off? You kind of left it hanging there. Not that it matters.

[deborahbrosene]

I just wanted to let you know that I completely and every so empathetically felt the pain in every word which you spoke. 

There are simply no words to express the feeling of betrayal when insane policies give way to any type of human logic. 

I too, in the past two days started to take steps to transfer my merchandise to another platform so that I could close my store when it came up for renewal. The exact same issue - a fraudulent return I was forced to eat is what set it off - that, plus the fact that I had to drive to the police department and call an officer in from out on his rounds to file an 'incident' report on a pair of shorts so that I could receive my 'seller protection'. Honestly - were you aware that is what is required to get money back in that situation now?

We cannot even leave negative feedback to warn other sellers of a buyer's bad behavior! Forgive my lack of terminology - but sellers are just expected to bend over and take it up the butt and leave positive feedback while we do so. 

We have no control over our stores or our businesses at this point. You worded it so well in the passion, you knew the strategy, and you hit the nail right on the head.

 I know all you say is true and not exaggerated because I have heard it from other long term sellers, as well. 

This is so unfair to you. I can tell you love what you do - for a treasure hunter, of which, I am also, it is the ultimate way to make money...or was, in any event.  I urge you to seek out other platforms. Don't give up what you love because eBay has abandoned us - take your talent elsewhere - I really feel for you and I really feel your pain.  I just wanted you to know that I heard your words. I am wounded, also. 

Take care,

Debby

[purple-rain-store]

Sounds like you had the kind of day I had! I'm going on 18 years with ebay, not sure why I keep coming back and giving them more chances! Just ended my Premium Store so it won't renew for July. The last straw like you was a **bleep** return. Doesn't matter if a seller takes the time to take measurements of items and provide them for buyers and make sure size tags are shown in listings. All a buyer has to do is claim item is not a size as tagged and ebay sides with them. I had a case open with a buyer who had done just this, I offered her a partial, money for the item only, ebay was giving her more than 30 days to click accept or decline. So today she clicks decline stating she'd be in the ER and couldn't deal with returning and that she would just keep item. So ebay's system then kicks it back to me with stating I have to respond in 3 days with the option of giving her a full refund or ask ebay to step in. So since her statement was right in the case saying she'd just keep the item, I asked ebay to step in and close the case and noted buyer's saying she'd was going to not return and keep item. What does ebay go and do within a few minutes of asking them to step in, they inform buyer she can return the item and provide her with return shipping label to use that will be billed to me when she uses it. So I waited for over 2 weeks and it was getting near the July 8th cut off of her not responding for the case to be closed and this **bleep** happens! I am working on liquidating what inventory I have left and washing my hands of this joke of a platform! Let me tell you it can't come soon enough for me to be off here for good!

[joesoucie22012]

It was the strawberries......

[fashunu4eeuh]

You sound surprised to discover eBay expects sellers to refund in full for Item Not Described cases. Where have you been? If you had kept up with the yearly Seller Updates, you would have known this could happen.

You said you have kept up with the evolving e-commerce world, but never noticed eBay was devolving? I don’t mean to be harsh when you face the end of your eBay business. I just honestly wonder how it is you didn't know that sellers are bearing the brunt of fraudulent returns.

This is eBay’s playpen. They make the rules. Not everyone has the means to walk away from their business. Yet you act as if staying and taking it makes them slugs. You attack other posters who are here doing their best to help the community. This isn't a paid gig.

This is other sellers just like you, making the best of what they have to work with. Volunteering their time.

Helping sellers like you, who are surprised to discover that they are going to have to refund a fraudulent return. Not because they are mindless sheep, or stupid or have no values, but because they agreed to follow the rules here, just like you did when you listed your item for sale.

So if you have to leave , i understand and wish you well. But please don’t judge and criticize those who are here to help and guide fellow eBayers who cannot leave. This is a community and some may not have anywhere else to turn. Good luck to you in your life after eBay.

[oldwestgold]

So 1 return defines who you are and you become defeated?  Really?  You should be actually thankful for the great run without any returns.  My record and duration on eBay mirror yours. Have I had a few scammers?  Sure. What do I do?  First off, don't waste my time getting more frustrated with the eBay bots/humans.

I have someone across the country once do a chargeback on a $100 item after they had it. What did I do?  I got PO'd. $100 wasn't going to make or break me but it was the principal.  I sent messages to the con letting her know exactly what I was going to do and date of when the action would be taken.  Each following action would be to ratchet up to the next level. Gave a week then send to the Inspection Service for fraud. Their boots shook a little. Contacted my local police along with the police of their area. My police department sent them a certified letter. They could not believe I went to such lengths for $100. Shocked! I got the item returned. Now I understand some people will not cave but it is a poker game. Don't flinch and follow through.

[popeye3165]

I am also a long time eBay inmate and am so sorry that you feel like so many other LONG TIME sellers that helped to establish eBay as an eCommerce power and are now having to surrender to eBay's continual takeover of seller's control over their listings and products PLUS the never ending LOWER PROFIT margin for sellers as eBay continually tries to satisfy the Wall Street "investors".

At least eBay was smart enough to establish the China MEGA SELLERS to keep their ship afloat while they get rid of the smaller American sellers they don't want anymore.

[popeye3165]

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@purple-rain-store wrote:
Sounds like you had the kind of day I had! I'm going on 18 years with ebay, not sure why I keep coming back and giving them more chances! Just ended my Premium Store so it won't renew for July.  I am working on liquidating what inventory I have left and washing my hands of this joke of a platform! Let me tell you it can't come soon enough for me to be off here for good!

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Sorry to hear it but you are like so many other longtime sellers that have FINALLY had it with eBay after helping to establish them as an eCommerce power. I suppose you can just say it was a good ride while it lasted.

[coolections]

Take the return and move on as it is causing you way too much stress. Count your blessing in 16 years you have had only one.