Hey Michelle! [Imagine.ink] Remember when you promised?

[taylor_memorial]

Well I finally found the box with the tin types and daguerrotypes and stuff and you promised to help me figure out what I might have, so 

VOYLA, HERE I AM!

No pictures yet, but let me know what you need and if I need to back light anything on glass. And basic levels of desirability, flaws and stuff to know to look for that won't show up in a decent digital pic

Thanks in Advance

[imagine.ink]

Hi David!  First of all (not that it really matters), it's Michele with one "L."   

Post a pic of what you have (just a digital photo will be fine) and we can start from there.  You can group everything together or if you have too much, just separate into like groupings.  

Once I see the photo(s), I can advise you better.

If you have any photos that have a mirror-like surface and are hard to photograph, that's probably a daguerreotype, which is the earliest photo form dating from the 1840s to about 1860.   Those are difficult to photograph unless you hold at an angle.  But the rest you can just lie on a flat surface and take an overhead pic.  

[lux.ra_14]

So, no pics ...?

[imagine.ink]

No, I haven't received any pics to review either privately or on this forum. 

I also don't even remember promising anything ... but I don't mind helping out.

[taylor_memorial]

Once upon a time, I was a box of rocks with a different name, and then a bag of hair, and then eBay decided that books had nothing to do with real life and pretty much killed this board.  You were you, I wasn't. Sometimes I wonder what happened to the most of the regulars. Some I still see on antiquarian FB sites.

It was ten years ago. At least. I'd remember the box of pictures, and when I asked it was a general what do I look for and what sells and that sort of newbie kind of thing; and frankly, it still is because images, while often accompanying what I do sell lots of and know something about, are not something I sell or know anything about.

I remember one longish discussion of a picture of yours, I think: a two story wood frame building, 19th century. a couple of people adding scale and purpose. Trying to figure out what a couple parts of the scene were. It might still be hanging around at the end of the queue, depending on how protective eBay is of memory. 

You offered. End of, until now. At the time there were almost daily postings of old pictures, lots of talk about Gettysburg and the evils of Texas Oil cartels in comparison with Midwestern Mobs. We've all moved on. Come to think of it, that's closer to 20 years. I think you've moved at least once since then. Little wonder you forget. Maybe winterish 2001.

Thanks for the tip, what I wanted to know. The box is on my next pile of pictures to take, so I'll get there. I can play with what I have (3 overhead photographer's spots with filters) to see what offers the best pictures. It's time for me to cook now, so I'll be taking pictures tomorrow or Thursday if it doesn't rain tomorrow--I have to pick up the lumber to replace my shed doors.

Sorry for the lengthy between times, this board is slow, I have what I think is a lot to do and I'm old and achy so doing a lot at once is kind of not happening too much. 

[taylor_memorial]

This is one of four, three of them seem to be a family group and the fourth is probably related. (Single purchase estate auction) Case is pressed wood, with paper coverings. The pictures are on glass with a black back-coating that looks like early rubber or might be dried tar. 

The images are much clearer than this untouched picture shows. If I can't bring them up with Picasa, I will need suggestions: I took them with about 3200 W filtered white light, white back ground.

All the pictures have a similar gold-tone oval frame over-placed and under glass (except a damaged one). Hook and eye clasps, they work but actually grabbing the post is iffy.  One of them has two clasps, the rest one. The damaged one lacks the gilt oval frame and original glass with a piece of cut double strength glass over it for protection. This is a replacement: the case does not close tight with it, the others do, so it must be single strength.  [Glass designations that won't matter to anyone but I was a glass guy, "strength" = thickness, like pipes].

Yes, I have more pictures. But I know this is all you need for what I need right now: what kind of photo is it? I'm thinking 1880 ish.

Oh yeah, one of them has a debossed maker's mark from some shop in Philadelphia. If it is important, let me know.

Thanks again, Michelle. We've lost far too many along the years. 

 

[taylor_memorial]

A couple more. Daguerrotypes, you're right. This is the only case that has a ?stamped ?burnt/branded? source. The bottom picture is of one that was busticated when I bought them, and the glass is not original. A little research here tells me these are probably 1/9 plate.

[imagine.ink]

Your image shown above is NOT a daguerreotype, because dags are produced on copper plates.  Because your photo is on a black-coated glass plate, it's an ambrotype.  

Ambrotype photos are negative images produced on a glass plate, viewed as positive by the addition of a black backing.  Ambrotypes were introduced in 1854 and their peak years were 1857-1859, although they were still produced into the early 1860s, soon to be supplanted by carte-de-visites (CDVs). 

Because ambrotypes are negative images, they are one of a kind and cannot be reproduced unless someone took a picture of the image itself.  The fact they are not easily reproduced makes them collectible, especially if you have a compelling image. 

It's hard to see the image, but it looks like a man with possibly a woman sitting next to him.  It probably dates to the late 1850s-early 1860s.

Sizes are ranked like this:

1/16th plate ~ 1- 3/8" x 1-5/8"

1/9th plate ~ 2" x 2-1/2"

1/6th plate ~ 2-5/8" x 3-1/4"

1/4th plate ~ 3-1/8" x 4-1/8"

Half plate ~ 4-1/2" x 5-1/2"

Full plate ~ 6-1/2" x 8-1/2"

Hope this info helps! 

[imagine.ink]

That velvet part of the case (where the photographer is identified) is called the pillow.  It's uncommon to find a photographer identified on a case (sometimes they stamped the mat, as well, with their name).  This makes it more desirable because some people only like to collect photos within a certain geographic area.  Too bad the photo itself is missing, but you may still be able to sell the case parts and someone can choose to insert their own photo.  Your ID'ed pillow is from Waterson & Bradley of Philadelphia (Phineas Waterson and Adolphus Bradley).

According to this website, they advertised their business at 82 South Street in 1854, 1855 and 1856. 

https://gary.saretzky.com/photohistory/philadelphiaphotographers.html

[lux.ra_14]

---

@taylor_memorial wrote:

Case is pressed wood, with paper coverings.

---

Can't tell from your pics, but gutta percha would be more typical in that era. 

[taylor_memorial]

I thought gutta percha was softer--a limp sort of cover, but this is thicker than those. 

The picture is of a man/woman and baby in swaddling clothes. It kind of comes up on my screen but I plan on taking them again. Sixth plate. 

Am I better off selling singly or as a lot of 4? Same subject, varying conditions (one is incomplete) but none of them match. Is the case still a union case or is that a specialized term for only dags?

[taylor_memorial]

Thanks. This stuff is a whole lot easier now that it was 20 years ago! 

[imagine.ink]

Hi David, actually gutta percha is an inaccurate term for thermoplastic cases (although a lot of people still use the description gutta percha to describe the harder photo cases instead of the correct term of thermoplastic).  Gutta percha is made from the sap of Malaysian tree and was used to produce small boxes, buttons and cane heads in the 19th century. 

Samuel Peck introduced thermoplastic cases and his patent dates to 1854.   The substance used in thermoplastic is primarily a compound of sawdust and shellac.   Before that, starting in the 1840s, cases were made of wood frame covered in leather with elaborate geometric or floral designs stamped on the leather.      

[imagine.ink]

In answer to your second question, you're better off selling the photos individually.  Buyers often collect by subject, so while some photo collectors like 19th century images of women (and their accompanying fashion), others prefer children or men depicted in 19th century photos.  Younger and prettier women sell for more than older and/or unattractive women (sexism is eternal!). 

The most collectible and desirable, of course, are photos of Civil War soldiers and in that genre, the more arms and weapons displayed by the soldier, the higher the price.  Also, any identified photos will bring more  because then, just like now, people often didn't put the subjects' names on their photos.  Lastly, the photo case you showed with the Philadelphia imprint will sell for more because some collect photos taken by local and/or identified photographers.  

[taylor_memorial]

the one site I found that sounded as knowledgeable as you called them "plastic" using quotes, describing the same thing. 

That really thin brown stuff glued to the surface is actually leather and not paper? It just doesn't seem thick enough. 

So I put them up at ridiculously high starting prices because I don't have good pictures of the pictures. Almost immediately I get an inquiry asking for permission to use the picture of the pillow in some guide they were writing because it was better than theirs. "Yay me".  Well, I said yes, and hopefully the reason given was actually real. 

Thanks for the high spots.  I think I decided to list all four of them because eBay limits are no longer a constant barrier and I had to add pictures. Glad it was confirmed.