Lots of confusion about Insurance payouts

[garmentvarmint2004]

A  few  days  ago  there was  a VERY long  Thread  in  which many  posters  advised a  new  seller  to obtain  insurance  on   some  of   her  transactions.  Several  posters   said  this  would  protect  her  when  an item   was  damaged   in transit.And  that the  seller  would  not   lose  her money. 

But  will  it  actually  do  so?  As  far  as  I know---the  PO  will often  say  that  the BUYER  must   cooperate  with  this   type   of  claim---and  will  have  to  take  the   item  in  to  his  local PO branch----to  be  inspected.     BUT  Ebay does NOT   require  buyers  to   do  this---and of course  many  refuse  to cooperate.    

So--why   all that  advice?  Has  Ebay  changed their  policies?  Has  the  Post Office  changed  THEIR policies?

Does anyone  on  this  Board  have   the  very  latest  info  on  this subject?

[baggs-2024]

Here is Heidi's response, just contributing.

[baggs-2024]

And here is another blue's reply from October.

[terryinstow]

The only value I see in insurance is if the package is totally lost by the post office, i.e. plane crash, lost in fire, etc.  It has never happened to me.  I suggested once to a buyer about the claim procedure and they just wanted a replacement or their money back from me.  

[baggs-2024]

Insurance is not for the buyer, it is for the seller.  You will be refunding your buyer, but if it is truly carrier damage, the carrier reimburses you.  Most buyers are honest and very cooperative in my practice.

[partial*eclipse]

Policies haven't changed. Either  party can file the online insurance claim; the form has a checkbox to indicate whether it's being filed by the sender or recipient. And the DMM has a specific policy about what they do if both parties file.

The seller should ask the buyer to retain the damaged item and the packaging in case their local PO wants to inspect it as part of the claim process. Of course neither the seller nor eBay nor USPS can force the buyer (recipient) to cooperate.

[garmentvarmint2004]

BAGGS..

Well  I attempted  several  times  to  figure  out  what  Heidi actually  said,  She seemed  to contradict  hersef  seeveral  times,  At  one  point  sh   talked  about  Ebay's  intention   to  protect  sellers  who  had  insurance  on  their  items.  But  in  the end she  talked  about  how  sellers   should  accept  a   return---and   refund  in  full.

So  it  sure  looks to me  like   nothing  has  changed.And insurance  will  only  protect  the  seller  on  SOME  occasions.

[baggs-2024]

Could very well be.  And would love to see what they said tested.  Will post back if I hear anything else.

[quiltgeek]

Insurance doesn't get paid out just because the item is damaged in shipping. The carrier has the right to evaluate how the item was packed. If they decide that the seller's packing was inadequate, they can refuse to pay out, since it's the seller's fault the package didn't stand up to the shipping process.

It's in the carrier's best (monetary) interest to declare the packing was inadequate.

[duchess-at-speakeasy · Accepted solution]

Some eBay sellers use eBay's default 3rd party insurance -- which is not marked on the package and not applicable to USPS or any other carrier.  In this case, the seller should file an immediate online claim with the actual insurer, preferably with photos that clearly show physical damage and the packaging.  The insurer may deny compensation based on inadequate packaging, especially for breakable items.  The insurer also may deny coverage for breakable items.  

USPS has a similar procedure but may ask that the recipient present the packaging and contents to USPS for examination.  The seller always should designate the SELLER as the one to be reimbursed.  Approved or denied, the seller still has to pay out a refund to the buyer and then wait for a decision.

USPS Priority Mail "included" insurance of $50 (or $100) does NOT apply to damage to hazmat, liquids, perishables or fragile items.  If you answer "yes" to any of these categories, you cannot file a damage claim.  The tracking record is marked "restricted insurance" -- which means coverage for a package lost in the mail and not delivered.  Paid insurance -- an extra fee -- may allow a damage claim depending on the package contents and appropriate packaging.  

In the case of total loss (not delivered), USPS and other insurers may ask the addressee to sign an affidavit to that effect.   Damage claims also involve paperwork, either in person or via mail.

UPS and FedEx hybrids (last mile delivery via USPS) usually blame each other for damage and neither will pay a claim.  

UPS and FedEx will pay claims for total loss (ground or air shipments) and may pay damage claims subject to a long list of exceptions.  For example, UPS does not cover breakables (such as dishes), antiques and artwork.

Bottom line:  Obtain your insurer's or carrier's written "waiver" list so you'll know their rules.

~~C~~

[fern*wood]

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@duchess-at-speakeasy wrote:

USPS Priority Mail "included" insurance of $50 (or $100) does NOT apply to damage to hazmat, liquids, perishables or fragile items.  If you answer "yes" to any of these categories, you cannot file a damage claim.  The tracking record is marked "restricted insurance" -- which means coverage for a package lost in the mail and not delivered.  Paid insurance -- an extra fee -- may allow a damage claim depending on the package contents and appropriate packaging.  

~~C~~

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I haven't seen that question for any of my priority shipments.  I've had the included insurance pay off on one of my shipments of a fragile item.

[garmentvarmint2004]

QUILT..  And  yes  as you  pointed  out---  another  reason  why  insurance  is  just  not   very reliable  ---  is because  the shippping  company   can   turn down any claim  and  blame  it  on  poor  packing.  Which they  often do.

[garmentvarmint2004]

DUCHESS, 

Thank  you  for rsponding.   I know   you are always  up  to date  on these kinds  of  Policies  and   rules. 

[kitschy*loot]

I was left more confused than anything by a thread from late December/early January. Even though I don't sell, I like to know the polices if I can, and I might want to list something one day.

It sounds like there is an unwritten policy where if a buyer refuses to participate in an insurance claim and the seller loses the claim because of that, the seller will be compensated by eBay after the buyer has been refunded by the seller.

I wish someone who has been compensated after a refusal would post something about it, to prove it's really going on. I can't imagine eBay willingly dishing out what must be a ton of money for compensations.

What can eBay do to enforce a supposed required participation policy after a buyer has been refunded?

[a_c_green]

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@duchess-at-speakeasy wrote:

USPS Priority Mail "included" insurance of $50 (or $100) does NOT apply to damage to hazmat, liquids, perishables or fragile items.  If you answer "yes" to any of these categories, you cannot file a damage claim.

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It would be helpful if you could point us to an on-line USPS cite for that. You made the same claim last year (here) but the USPS members here did not agree, nor have we heard from anyone whose claim was denied on that basis.