eBay Standard Envelope $.63 doesn't exist according to the PO

[aharon-milechai.com]

We have been on ebay for almost 24 years.

Our Post Office said there is no such, "eBay Standard Envelope shipping for $.63" .... every one under 1oz are pulled and sent back to us for additional postage of $.40.    We have called ebay several times over this

1: Ebay has no proof that you can ship a coin, under 1oz, for 63 cents.

2: We have to pay an additional 40 cents

3: The Post Office says if you put anything in the envelope like a coin ... the envelope requires $1.04 postage.

The Post Master says, "eBay Standard Envelope shipping for $.63" is Postal Fraud. 

Aharon

[12345jamesstamps]

"The reason they do not go through at some locations is because someone is making up their own rules"

Would that be eBay?

[1786davycrockett]

@aharon-milechai.com 

"The is "no written" agreement between the Post Office and Ebay.   There is no document to show the Post Master.    You would think Ebay would the Agreement at the ready to copy, print, and show.  Nope ... nothing."

If what you are attempting to say is that there is no written agreement between eBay and USPS, you are entirely incorrect:  Several years ago, eBay signed a contract with USPS for the sending of metered mail, under some very strenuous conditions.  There is nothing different between the contract to which eBay agreed, and similar metered mail contracts between USPS and the companies that mail my credit card bills, my electricity bills, my doctor bills, my water & sewage bills, and so on, and so on -- ALL of which are using USPS contracted metered mail.

And, obviously, neither eBay nor USPS is going to provide ANYONE (without a court order) to examine a copy of the contract signed between both those parties, since it is considered to be privileged business information.

The individuals at your post office are incorrect, since you have already received verification from other eBay sellers that those sellers have shipped out MANY coins using the ESE -- and with little or few problems.

If your coin is taped down securely between two VERY thin pieces of cereal box material (or 12 pack soda pop material), you should not have a problem shipping with the ESE.  If you are using cardboard liners, or coin holders, there may be problems regarding rigidity.

And, if the next closest post office is 15 miles away (mine is 14 miles away), it might be worth your while to switch post offices.

[buyselljack2016]

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@12345jamesstamps wrote:

"The reason they do not go through at some locations is because someone is making up their own rules"

Would that be eBay?

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No.........................................................  it is the postal employees 😁

[ajs_coins_and_alchemy]

That's a huge reason I got confused by your post.

You refer to a "standard envelope" (regular mail) but that threw me off because ESE is "EBay standard envelope" so I didn't distinguish the difference in your point of what you meant by standard envelope.

Either way... if USPS has an issue w/ EBay's negotiated ESE... that's their problem. If USPS employees are unaware of policies, thats their problem. If sellers are misusing ESE by making it too rigid or something, well, I guess that's their problem then. 🤣

I'm not using ESE and don't plan to. I'll stick to real tracking

[cnofear81]

The ebay standard envelope is a scam just so ebay can profit off of a fake tracking number. We can do the samething without ebays stupid envelope fake label by just putting one or more stamps on a padded envelope

[annadryl]

Yeah, that padded envelope will certainly need more than one stamp. And add some more if you want to buy tracking which was the point of this thread... 

[buyselljack2016]

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@cnofear81 wrote:

The ebay standard envelope is a scam just so ebay can profit off of a fake tracking number. We can do the samething without ebays stupid envelope fake label by just putting one or more stamps on a padded envelope

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as has been posted many times ..... "the tracking" is indeed not "tracking" as we generally think of it, but as has been explained many times............ it is a form of metered mail that gets "scanned" (hopefully gets scanned) along the way as the mail is processed.  If there is even just one scan somewhere along the way the seller is covered by eBay for up to the $20 limit that applies to ESE.   Not understanding how the process works................... does not make it "fake"

[onefootflippers]

Most standard envelope problems come from either overpacking or centering the item in the envelope. 

If you are having problems with a specific post office then if at all possible find another post office to mail them at.

Watch this video on the best practices to make them go through the system. It doesn't address coins directly but you can still do the same thing.

https://youtu.be/f9SPX370_IE

[aharon-milechai.com]

more coming back today ... the post office promised to pull all of $.63 ... the links and complaints isn't working.  The Florence Post Office no coins ... no way and they are standing by their promise. 

[goodnu9]

USPS doesn't even tell their employees when Forever stamps are increasing. They see it first on the news. Management is horrible at the PO! How do I know? I'm retired from USPS! 

[1786davycrockett]

@aharon-milechai.com 

Here's the complete January 2017 memo from USPS regarding "firmly-fixed coins" versus "loose coins."

The first two paragraphs DEFINITIVELY prove that USPS permits mailing firmly-fixed coins as USPS First Class Mail rates, with no additional postal fee for non-machinable mail.

Download it for yourself, if you'd prefer, and show it to your Florence, CO postmaster.  She is ignoring this update,  and choosing instead to abide by the old, out-of-date regulations.

Good luck.

 

Customer Support Ruling

Small Flat Odd-Shaped Items in Envelopes at Automation Letter Prices

UPDATED January 2017

PS-328 (201.3.10)

This Customer Support Ruling (CSR) describes the preparation of letter-size automation compatible envelopes that contain coins, tokens, or similar small flat odd-shaped items.  This ruling does not pertain to items thicker than a U.S. nickel.

Subject to Domestic Mail Manual (DMM®) standards for automation, small flat odd-shaped items are permitted in automation-compatible letter-size envelopes when they are firmly affixed to a component in the mailpiece and wrapped within the contents so that the contour of the mailpiece is streamlined.

In addition, small flat odd-shaped items prepared in envelopes may be mailed at automation letter prices if the item is firmly affixed to one of the components and the mailpiece is prepared under the following conditions:

• Sufficient additional material such as letters, response cards, envelopes, or advertising matter is included in the envelope to ensure that the mailpiece is streamlined for automated processing.
• When a closed-panel window envelope is used and the item is visible through the window, a second wrapping may be used to cover the item. This second covering is in addition to the window panel material and may be made of cellophane or a similar see-through substance. The mailpiece must have sufficient additional contents that the entire mailpiece remains streamlined for automation processing.

The effect of including additional material or coverings to streamline the mailpiece meets the intent of wrapping the item within the contents.  Small flat odd-shaped items cannot be placed in a position that would obscure the address or barcode.

When any envelope contains loose coins, tokens or similar small flat odd-shaped items that are not affixed to a component within or if the inclusion of such items results in the mailpiece not being streamlined, the mailpiece does not qualify for automation letter prices. It may be mailed, but is subject to the nonmachinable surcharge for First-Class Mail letters or the nonmachinable prices for USPS Marketing Mail letters.

(signed)

Sharon Daniel

Manager

Mailing Standards

Headquarters, US Postal Service

Washington, DC  20260-3436

[wastingtime101]

Bring 4 copies to your PO and highlight the relevant parts @aharon-milechai.com because according to your other discussion, another seller that uses your PO said it's the OIC and 3 clerks all causing problems and rejecting ESE envelopes.

I suggest printing from the USPS website, not from the pasted text in above post.

https://pe.usps.com/text/csr/ps-328.htm

[ebeths_eclectic_collectibles]

Read many of the replies and all I know is when I ship a coin ESE they seem to get delivered without any issues. 

[aharon-milechai.com]

UPDATED January 2017   <-- showed to Susan Park OIC  at the Florence Post ... she pointed out this is an old document has been superseded .

We have tried links, we found where coins are permitted by OIC  at the Florence Post said we are not reading this right. Ebay can't help ... Going to another Post Office isn't a solution because there is a "costs and time" evolved.  

Basically, what I have learn this is like Monty Python - damned if you do and damned if you don't.  We have no choice but to stop selling anything under $5 or $6 on Ebay and raise prices to cover the extra postage to cost the extra costs.  

Susan Park OIC  at the Florence Post is the gate keeper. 

[wastingtime101]

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@aharon-milechai.com wrote:

UPDATED January 2017   <-- showed to Susan Park OIC  at the Florence Post ... she pointed out this is an old document has been superseded .

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By what? Ask her for a print out of what she believes is currently relevant because it's not an old document. It's a current document that hasn't been altered since Jan 2017; there's a difference.

Here's a link to the current, active DMM @aharon-milechai.com 

https://pe.usps.com/cpim/ftp/manuals/dmm300/201.pdf

Go down to this section:

3.10 Rigid and Odd-Shaped Items Rigid items (e.g., pens, pencils, keys, bottle caps) are prohibited within mailpieces. Reasonably flexible items (e.g., credit cards) are permitted. Subject to 3.12, odd-shaped items (e.g., coins and tokens) are permitted if firmly affixed to and wrapped within the contents of the mailpiece and envelope to streamline the shape of the mailpiece for automated processing.

Subject to 3.12, so here's 3.12:

3.12 Flexibility Standards for Automation Letters

3.12.1 Machinability To ensure transport through automated mail processing machines, a mailpiece and its contents must bend easily when subjected to a transport belt tension of 40 pounds around an 11-inch-diameter drum.

Unless the coin is unusually large, it should be fine due to the size of the drum it wraps around.