Empty Box Scam (Round 2)

[billiards74]

Buyer purchased a $2700 Rolex from me about 3 weeks ago. Then, claimed the old "I received an empty box" routine.

After about a week of losing sleep and worrying about what eBay was going to do, they finally came back and ruled in the buyer's favor. Less than 24 hours later, eBay called me and said that, not only were they reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay. Great. I won the case.

Fast forward one week later...

I get an email from PayPal. The buyer opened the same case with them.

So, I provided PayPal with the following information:

Local police report #

IC3 case #

Postal Investigation #

eBay case # and disposition

Buyer's police report # (made online outside of his jurisdiction)

Additional police report # for a WalMart claim made in Dec. 2015 (similar circumstances. Again, made online outside his jurisdiction)

Detective's name who wrote the report

After speaking with the rep from PayPal, I'm pretty much assured that the buyer doesn't have a leg to stand on here.

Anyone else have similar experiences? Outcome?

[acar8174]

When ebay NARUs the buyer before the case is closed, or before appeal, it is much more likely that ebay will find in the other party's favor or give a courtesy refund than if the buyer's account was and is in good standing.

But the buyer's paypal account may still be in good standing.

[impfac]

You said before ebay closed this jokers account after you escalated and won the high value case, so I'd think that would reflect in your favor as well. Sounds like you are fully covered. I was told when ebay decides in your favor, paypal looks on that favorably.

[tarpedge]

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@billiards74 wrote:

After about a week of losing sleep and worrying about what eBay was going to do, they finally came back and ruled in the buyer's favor.

Less than 24 hours later, eBay called me and said that, not only were they reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay. Great. I won the case.

Fast forward one week later...

I get an email from PayPal. The buyer opened the same case with them.

---

Is this the timeline?

1. eBay ... ruled in the buyer's favor.

• So the buyer got a full refund.

2. 24 hours later, eBay ... reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay.

• So the buyer still has the refund.
• And eBay has to pay the seller out-of-pocket.

3. one week later ... buyer opened the same case with [PayPal]

• Why? The buyer already got a full refund from eBay through PayPal.

[billiards74]

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@tarpedge wrote:

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@billiards74 wrote:

After about a week of losing sleep and worrying about what eBay was going to do, they finally came back and ruled in the buyer's favor.

Less than 24 hours later, eBay called me and said that, not only were they reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay. Great. I won the case.

Fast forward one week later...

I get an email from PayPal. The buyer opened the same case with them.

---

Is this the timeline?

1. eBay ... ruled in the buyer's favor.

• So the buyer got a full refund.

2. 24 hours later, eBay ... reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay.

• So the buyer still has the refund.
• And eBay has to pay the seller out-of-pocket.

3. one week later ... buyer opened the same case with [PayPal]

• Why? The buyer already got a full refund from eBay through PayPal.

---

PayPal informed me that the buyer did not receive a refund.

[blackbird*singing]

After everything that happened I can't believe the buyer went ahead with a PayPal case. Sorry you're STILL dealing with this, billiards. Hopefully paypal will settle in your favor and soon!

[badgers_36]

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@prefontained wrote:

After everything that happened I can't believe the buyer went ahead with a PayPal case. Sorry you're STILL dealing with this, billiards. Hopefully paypal will settle in your favor and soon!

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At that point, it might be 2 cases down/1 to go (if buyer paid with a CC)

[al-sutt]

please don't sell what you can not afford to lose here, pretty basic

[ymeagainlord]

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@billiards74 wrote:

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@tarpedge wrote:

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@billiards74 wrote:

After about a week of losing sleep and worrying about what eBay was going to do, they finally came back and ruled in the buyer's favor.

Less than 24 hours later, eBay called me and said that, not only were they reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay. Great. I won the case.

Fast forward one week later...

I get an email from PayPal. The buyer opened the same case with them.

---

Is this the timeline?

1. eBay ... ruled in the buyer's favor.

• So the buyer got a full refund.

2. 24 hours later, eBay ... reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay.

• So the buyer still has the refund.
• And eBay has to pay the seller out-of-pocket.

3. one week later ... buyer opened the same case with [PayPal]

• Why? The buyer already got a full refund from eBay through PayPal.

---

PayPal informed me that the buyer did not receive a refund.

---

Presumably why they're now trying to get one out of PayPal

[shawk2011]

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@billiards74 wrote:

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@tarpedge wrote:

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@billiards74 wrote:

After about a week of losing sleep and worrying about what eBay was going to do, they finally came back and ruled in the buyer's favor.

Less than 24 hours later, eBay called me and said that, not only were they reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay. Great. I won the case.

Fast forward one week later...

I get an email from PayPal. The buyer opened the same case with them.

---

Is this the timeline?

1. eBay ... ruled in the buyer's favor.

• So the buyer got a full refund.

2. 24 hours later, eBay ... reversing the case, the buyer is no longer a registered user of eBay.

• So the buyer still has the refund.
• And eBay has to pay the seller out-of-pocket.

3. one week later ... buyer opened the same case with [PayPal]

• Why? The buyer already got a full refund from eBay through PayPal.

---

PayPal informed me that the buyer did not receive a refund.

---

I hope PP can see the writing on the wall and decides in your favor. This will not only be the right decision to make, it will also send an expensive message to the scammer, which may deter him from continuing his fraudulent practices.

I'm sorry to hear you have to deal wirth this low life thief again.

[merceemay]

• Why? The buyer already got a full refund from eBay through PayPal.

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PayPal informed me that the buyer did not receive a refund.

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Presumably why they're now trying to get one out of PayPal

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I won a case once, AFTER the money was refunded to the buyer.  eBay told me to escalate it after, so I called eBay and they looked at everything and found for me and refunded.  I really wanted to be a fly on that lady's wall to see what she said.  lol

[usmc*usnmom]

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@badgers_36 wrote:

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@prefontained wrote:

After everything that happened I can't believe the buyer went ahead with a PayPal case. Sorry you're STILL dealing with this, billiards. Hopefully paypal will settle in your favor and soon!

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At that point, it might be 2 cases down/1 to go (if buyer paid with a CC)

---

I would think that any credit card company would rule against the buyer considering the OP has a boatload of negative evidence against him.

Then again  credit card companies IMO are quite sleazy, so nothing would surprise me.

I really, really hope the Postal Inspectors come banging on this guy's door.

[shawk2011]

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@merceemay wrote:

• Why? The buyer already got a full refund from eBay through PayPal.

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PayPal informed me that the buyer did not receive a refund.

---

Presumably why they're now trying to get one out of PayPal

---

I won a case once, AFTER the money was refunded to the buyer.  eBay told me to escalate it after, so I called eBay and they looked at everything and found for me and refunded.  I really wanted to be a fly on that lady's wall to see what she said.  lol

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@merceemay

ebay has no way to force the money from the buyer, what ebay most likely did was issue a courtesy refund out of ebay's pocket. This means ebay gave back your money, and the buyer kept their refund.

If you were a fly on that lady's wall you would most likely see a happy scammer with your item, AND a refund. Why do you think there are so many scammers here?

The answer is because ebay rewards them by letting them win most cases, usually at the seller's expense, but occaisionally at ebay's.

[badgers_36]

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@usmc*usnmom wrote:

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@badgers_36 wrote:

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@prefontained wrote:

After everything that happened I can't believe the buyer went ahead with a PayPal case. Sorry you're STILL dealing with this, billiards. Hopefully paypal will settle in your favor and soon!

---

At that point, it might be 2 cases down/1 to go (if buyer paid with a CC)

---

I would think that any credit card company would rule against the buyer considering the OP has a boatload of negative evidence against him.

Then again  credit card companies IMO are quite sleazy, so nothing would surprise me.

I really, really hope the Postal Inspectors come banging on this guy's door.

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I agree. PP "should" also find in OP's favor.

Just pointing out that even when/if PP denies the claim (round #2) - the OP may still have a round #3 "fight" should (it'd surprise me if they didn't) the scammer THEN try for a chargeback.

[billiards74]

As I said before, the buyer did not receive a refund from eBay.

Also, he didn't pay with a credit card. No need to worry about a chargeback.