MANAGED PAYMENTS / FEES - MISLEADING and DECEPTIVE CONDUCT on a GRAND SCALE

[waddingtonfirstaid]

Just discovered when you click on so-called "Payment Details" after a sale, the fee total does not include fees associated with Promotional Listings.

I find this to be not only absolutely appalling, it robs every seller of a single basic place in which to actually get a straight-forward handle of total cost for an individual sale. I'm not talking about a monthly shop rent charge, I'm talking about the actual cost associated with a single item sale (where the price for that item and it's promotion are adjusted and set within the item's listing page) and the actual total amount received for that sale which is meant to go to our banking account.

I am completely shocked to find out today that items I have been selling, displayed in the "Payment Details" along with the fee total, is not a true and valid reflection of my profit margin, thus robbing me of any opportunity to quickly adjust my prices.

I am waiting for a call-back from management REF: 1-290083148196.

I have requested a full refund of all fees hidden in this way, as well as a full disclosure of what is actually going on, including the implementation of a simple basic single webpage or table portal that shows unequivocally the total fee with the total amount payable to the seller for every single sale item in a single line for each item sold when one clicks "Payment Details" at the point when sale data is collected prior to final dispatch.

This shadowy conduct is not only horrifying, I believe it could be described as nothing else but fraud, if not Misleading and Deceptive Conduct under the Consumer Act - Australia - The Act.

[tdumonde2014]

Post your issue on ebay.au where the Australian Consumer Act would cover your issue.

[powell-memorabilia]

Well, I'll leave the legal posturing and pretending to you, but eBay isn't secretive about the promotion fees.  Absolutely, I do wish that the promo fees were taken out of payments, but eBay isn't there, yet.  I, too, wish that I'd get an accurate per-item read on profitability, but that doesn't (to me) rise to the level of outright fraud by eBay.  Heck, I'd love it if eBay would let me add in a cost-of-acquisition for every item that I sell, and tell me each lot's actual profit level.  

[nuclearomen]

your shock is only due to you not paying attention to how Manage Payments operates...this isn't new nor misleading. Promotional Ad Fees ARE NOT billed via Managed Payments Funds, they are billed separate to you invoice. If you keep a balance on your account (as should with MP to pay for promotional fees, insertion fees, store fees) after a sale on a promoted listing you will see the balance on your account subject the promotional fee for the ad rate. Total fees for selling in Managed Payments are spread out between various sections. The total charged to buyer, tax, and sold price of item and the shipping charge for shipping label if purchased through ebay is found under the "Orders" tab for each order. FVF, Trans Fee (0.30), Additional International Trans Fee (if applicable), and total to sell in MP funds are under the "Payments" tab (click on the entry for each sale to see the fees), Fees for Promoted Listings ads are under the "Payments" tab >left hand side navigation > "Expenses" - you will also find insertion fees (if any) here as well. 

[mam98031]

If MP AU is operating like it does here in the US, they have been forthcoming about everything you state they haven't.  The ONLY fees being deducted at the time of the buyer's payment is the FVF for that sale, NOTHING more.

All other fees appear on your Monthly Seller Invoice.  Store fees, listing upgrades, listing fees, promo fees, etc.  So all you need to do is look at your Monthly Seller Invoice for details of your expenses.

[penguins_dont_fly]

@waddingtonfirstaid

You are going to be even more "shocked and appalled" to know that your Store Fee is also still invoiced monthly,  as are insertion fees and any listing upgrades.

https://www.ebay.com.au/help/selling/fees-credits-invoices/ebay-stores-selling-fees-managed-payments...

If you need further advice about how Managed Payments works in Australia, the AU Discussion Boards are here: https://community.ebay.com.au

[debbschmitt]

I love that idea!

[kensgiftshop]

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@waddingtonfirstaid wrote:

I have requested a full refund of all fees hidden in this way

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The fee's are not hidden, promotional listing fee's are on your monthly invoice like always.

[waddingtonfirstaid]

There will be no excuses made for eBay AT ALL for this. This situation is appalling and will be dealt with, I can assure you. If we took the advice from every eBay apologist on these discussion forums we'd never see any justice, ever. eBay listened to me when I stated to eBay management about how there had to be a single line showing fee and sale totals in the one place, as a part of sellers' clearly understanding Managed Payments. This resulted in the Payment Details hot link to a clear single portal table line, a one line snapshot that was supposed to be easy to understand and quick to utilize for keeping a constant tab on profit for every item sale, thus never finding yourself in a debt hole for any item sale. I have a database developer background and there is considerable evidence here in these same discussion forums where I have clearly put eBay on notice and my close attention to these matters.

So far eBay supplied nothing more than a pathetic response which demonstrated clearly they don't understand the gravity of how I was misled and deceived, nor were my communications escalated to management as promised.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear eBay Management, Directors and Owners/Shareholders of eBay,

Your reply leaves me bewildered, frustrated and angry. Your reply is non-sensical. Your reply is obfuscating proper attendance to the central points related to 1-290084000106. Your reply fails to attend to anything I have already stated, in particular the way I have been misled and deceived as an eBay seller and my request for a full and total refund of any and all “Promotional Listings” fees.

Your reply proves that you have either not read anything I have already stated, listened to the recorded phone conversation I specifically instructed to be stored for future reference, or you are simply choosing to ignore all of this.

eBay’s fees structure has misled and deceived me. When I view the total fees for a sale, as I was led to believe is the case when clicking on “Payment Details”, it does not represent the total fee charged for the item’s sale. This has caused me to believe I was making a certain profit when in fact I was not. I had no opportunity to quickly adjust my prices to avoid a loss. Your misleading and deceptive system has caused me to make significant losses when I thought I was making certain profits, albeit very slim and competitive profits.

In addition to this, there is no straight-forward way possible to see, when clicking “Payment Details”, the total fee charged for each sale. I have taken screenshots of this as evidence. The fee total for each fee charge does not include all the fees. This is totally misleading and deceptive. I feel like I have been tricked and defrauded, especially given all the hype foisted upon us that explicitly stressed the benefits of the new eBay Managed Payments strategy and how it was going to be a better, more straight-forward, simpler system all round. I can see now that it is not only complex, it appears to be designed to make sellers believe they are selling items with less fees charged than what is actually the case. This is appalling. This is predatory behaviour. This is criminal behaviour.

I am a significant long-time eBay seller of over 1000 items, always maintaining 100% positive feedback. I believe I am a very careful and honourable seller. I also believe I have a very good sense of injustice and I act accordingly, as evidenced by my posts to eBay discussion forums as well as past communications to eBay management when I see significant problems.

I have stopped all promotional listing features for all my listings.

I ask you one last time, are you going to refund me or not?

You have until 5pm Tuesday 24th November 2020 to ensure all promotional listing charges taken from me since the introduction of eBay Managed Payments are refunded to my bank account. If you fail to do so, I will take it that you refuse this request and I will take further action with authorities, including the ACCC, Federal Government of Australia and legal recourse.

Please ensure all communications regarding this matter are tabled at the next eBay International and eBay Australia management, directors and shareholder meetings.

Thank you for your assistance.

Yours faithfully,

Neil Waddington

Managing Director

Waddington Educational Resources Pty Ltd

[waddingtonfirstaid]

I posted using the buttons available to me as I was logged into my seller account which is in Australia. If it took me to the US (like the eBay call-back I might add) then that is out of my control.

[powell-memorabilia]

So, the basic complaint that you have is that eBay told you that they would charge 12% FVF, 3% for payment processing, and x% for promoted listings, then they charged you 12% FVF, 3% processing one day, then waited until the end of the month for the x% promoted listing fee? 

We've known that promoted listing fees, as well as store fees, would be charged on the monthly invoice, not the MP transaction, so I'm not sure where the fraud comes in.  Absolutely, it is somewhat confusing to have the promoted listing fees on the invoice, but bookkeeping difficulties for you don't equate to Fraud from eBay.  Am I missing something?