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Returning a faulty item

Hi,

First time using the forum, but I have no idea where else to go.
I ordered an item, paid for it USD$50, and it was delivered. The item was faulty.

I contacted the seller, who said return it for a refund. I got a quote for shipping it back to them, USD$82. Seller refused to pay return shipping until they got the item back, so I contacted ebay. They said the seller cannot provide a return label for my location, so contact the seller to arrange return shipping. The seller stuck with the we'll pay you back when it gets here line.

Seeing no other choice,  I shipped it back at my cost, untracked.

This was over a month ago now. They keep claiming that the item never arrived. I asked ebay to step in, and they said that since the item wasn't tracked, they won't step in, closing the case/return claim saying that I won't get a refund.

I went to my postal service, and they are investigating. They send a letter to the seller asking them for written confirmation of non-delivery (proves that the address is real, and that the parcel didn't arrive). It is the last week that they will expect a reply from the seller, but the seller has told me that this letter has not arrived to date.

I appealled to ebay's decision to close the case. They dismissed it out of hand.

I tried to place negative feedback, but the option to do so expires after 60 days. ebay says they send you a message regarding this, but they dont.

I emailed ebay again, as the seller has still not paid for return shipping, which ebay's Terms and Conditions says that they should. If nothing else, I expect that much. Especially since, if they had paid for return shipping, they would have their **bleep** tracking number.

ebay then said that yes, I'm right, but because I sent the item back, they cannot hold the seller accountable anymore. They say I should have contacted them first before sending the item back (which I did).

Here's the kicker: They say that's the last response that I will get on the issue.
What the hell? What happened to the ebay money back guarantee? here's what the ebay returns says:

Things to keep in mind:

  • Request a return by the time specified in the Return policy section of the listing.

  • If we ask you to contact the seller, work with the seller directly and follow their return instructions.

 

What can I do?

Message 1 of 17
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1 BEST ANSWER

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Re: Returning a faulty item

It is very hard for people to feel bad for you, when obviously you purchased your item from China. Allowing China to break the rules (in regard to money back guarantee returns, multiple listings for the same item, and the selling of items grossly not as described) is what has contributed to an overall breakdown in buyer confidence, and indeed, has flawed eBay in such a way that it probably won't ever truly recover.  The amount of buyers in your same situation is staggering--eBay has lost tons of buyers because just like you--they say to themselves, "Never again."  

 

Nevermind that the sellers in your very own country are held to such high standards that what happened to you could never happen with a US seller--we have to play by different rules and are not allowed to blatantly rip off customers and give them the run around.  However, we still have to feel the ever increasing bad effects of losing customers because of this type of behavior.  Not only that, but our items are buried beneath 10 pages worth of cheap garbage and people can't find them.  And of course, there is the fact that US sellers get NO break on shipping costs (in fact, we were just given a hearty rate increase [almost an entire dollar more to ship a 16oz first class package in the US] that is killing our sales even more) while Chinese sellers get to ship for pennies to our dollars.  You would be astounded at how many small sellers--truly the lifeblood of this site, and the people who made eBay what it is today--are going out of business.  No longer able to compete with a dwindling customer base and with the incredibly unfair shipping costs, and no longer able make any kind of a decent living, or even a little bit extra for emergencies.  It is sad, truly sad and pitiful.  And when I see a complaint like yours I feel I must educate you a little bit.  

 

When you buy from China, not only do you take precious money out of the economy in the US (which we sorely need circulating HERE right now) but you also are contributing to the downfall of the little sellers here, to the poverty in our own country, and to the degredation of eBay's "good" name.  Also, as the small sellers go away, so do the unique items, the rare and hard to find stuff, and all of the interesting things to buy and look at--the aspect that made eBay unique and somewhere fun to browse and shop. Truly, I don't write these words to hurt you, but to be honest with you.  Please stop buying garbage from China.  It isn't worth it--not on any level.  They purchase nothing, absolutely nothing, from us--and I don't mean just eBay, I mean nothing at all.  They don't help our economy at all, and your money is going into the hands of a couple of greedy business people--there is so much slave and child labor going on over there, it is just heartbreaking.

 

For anyone who thinks I am being xenophobic, or racist--I am not--I don't hate Chinese people at all. Even though one of my dogs died from the laced dog treats, and even though I personally know people who were basically ruined by the asbestos drywall in Florida--they had to walk away from their homes because it was so toxic, and who really knows what the long term effects will be--cancer, anyone?  I also, quite coincidentally, purchased some lead based Barbie toys for my daughter when she was little--thank God she wasn't one to chew on her stuff.  Thank God--because the dog treats not only killed my one dog, but also affected the other one's kidneys and he will probably be gone soon too.  Over six years he has been ill--and I only fed them 3 (!!!) treats each.  I can't imagine what could have happened to my daughter.....

 

However, I still have no hatred in my heart for them, as a people--in fact, I actually feel very sorry for most of the people in China.  Who do you think is making all that cheap junk?  It isn't people being paid a living wage--no, it is desperate people who can barely afford to eat.  The working conditions are abhorrent, and the quality of life for most people there is pitiful. The facts are the facts.  And in this case, the facts are that until people stop supporting a country that cares nothing for our well being, as a country and as individuals--until people realize that the Chinese sellers on here have absolutely no interest in being honest sellers--until you realize just how much buying from there hurts the US economy and the individual sellers on eBay--and until you realize that everything you buy from them comes from a place where human righs violations are the norm, and people are treated worse than dogs--you are just contributing to the problem. The problem here on eBay, the problem with the US economy, and the problem of human decency and fair treatment.

 

It should be obvious to you by now that they don't care one bit about selling you a qualiy item and standing behind it.  I hope you think about that before you put any more money into the hands of people that have taken so much, yet give so little in return.  Not only to us, but to their very own people.  Please stop supporting Chinese sellers here.  Instead support the sellers who are grateful for your business, who stand behind what they sell, and who will bend over backwards to make sure that you are satisfied and taken care of. 

View Best Answer in original post

Message 15 of 17
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16 REPLIES 16

Re: Returning a faulty item

You have been advised correctly. The MBG applies when you follow the rules. You did not follow the rules.

Prepaid return postage is available ONLY for domestic sales, not for international. Never, ever, believe that a seller will voluntarily reimburse you for return postage. Never, ever, return an order on your own. Never, ever, return an order without tracking.

Within the allowed time (usually 30 days from receipt), you should have escalated the SNAD complaint to eBay, whereupon the seller would have been required to provide a prepaid label (can't, obviously!) or simply refund your original payment without requiring a return at all. Sellers are supposed to provide return postage but eBay cannot force international sellers to do so.

If you paid via Paypal, you can try filing a SNAD complaint there. However, since you no longer have the product, you can't return anything -- nor can you prove the item has already been returned because you failed to obtain tracking.

If you paid with a credit card, you may be able to open a charge back but, again, you cannot prove that you sent anything back to the seller.

Bottom line: Not much you can do now. You voluntarily returned the item without protecting your own interests.

~~C~~
My Glass Duchess
Quoting Mom: In polite society, "hey" is for horses.
Message 2 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item


@flareildor wrote:

Hi,

First time using the forum, but I have no idea where else to go.
I ordered an item, paid for it USD$50, and it was delivered. The item was faulty.

I contacted the seller, who said return it for a refund. I got a quote for shipping it back to them, USD$82. Seller refused to pay return shipping until they got the item back, so I contacted ebay. They said the seller cannot provide a return label for my location, so contact the seller to arrange return shipping. The seller stuck with the we'll pay you back when it gets here line.

Seeing no other choice,  I shipped it back at my cost, untracked.

  •  

 




I stopped reading here.

Message 3 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item


@flareildor wrote:

...Seeing no other choice,  I shipped it back at my cost, untracked....



Wrong answer...

Message 4 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item

What everyone is telling you here, is that ebay will do nothing on your behalf without proof of return delivery (tracking).   That's one of the basic laws of ebay, and the door swings both ways for buyers and sellers.  

Message 5 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item


@milspec1959 wrote:

What everyone is telling you here, is that ebay will do nothing on your behalf without proof of return delivery (tracking).   That's one of the basic laws of ebay, and the door swings both ways for buyers and sellers.  


Well said.    

Message 6 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item

Many thanks.

Message 7 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item

" The MBG applies when you follow the rules. You did not follow the rules.'  Which rule did I break?
"Never, ever, return an order without tracking." Good advice. Something that ebay should have in bold on their return policy.

"Within the allowed time (usually 30 days from receipt), you should have escalated the SNAD complaint to eBay, whereupon the seller would have been required to provide a prepaid label (can't, obviously!) or simply refund your original payment without requiring a return at all. Sellers are supposed to provide return postage but eBay cannot force international sellers to do so."
I tried this. The seller said that due to the price of the item, I had to send it back to get my money back, and refused to pay return shipping until they got the item back.

Which leads to, and so many of you have pointed out that this was my BIG mistake, me sending the item back.

As you pointed out, bottom line - I'm screwed.

Message 8 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item

See below for messages from both ebay and the seller.

What else was I meant to do?

Message 9 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item

You should see "The seller is still responsible for return shipping costs" in your screenshot.

 

So unless the seller sends a prepaid label or money to buy a  return label, you don't ship it back.

Message 10 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item

but ebay said to work with the seller...?

Message 11 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item


@tarpedge wrote:

You should see "The seller is still responsible for return shipping costs" in your screenshot.

 

So unless the seller sends a prepaid label or money to buy a  return label, you don't ship it back.


So by working with the seller, as ebay asked, I ensured I would never get a refund?

Message 12 of 17
latest reply

Re: Returning a faulty item

Their wording in that message was pretty terrible. It probably should have said, "Work out some way for the seller to pay for your return shipping." I'm really sorry this happened to you. Please don't ever send something as part of a business transaction again without some kind of delivery confirmation service.

Message 13 of 17
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Re: Returning a faulty item

I appreciate your reply.

Even with that reply, ebay should have added "Do not send the item back until you receive payment for return shipping"

Message 14 of 17
latest reply

Re: Returning a faulty item

It is very hard for people to feel bad for you, when obviously you purchased your item from China. Allowing China to break the rules (in regard to money back guarantee returns, multiple listings for the same item, and the selling of items grossly not as described) is what has contributed to an overall breakdown in buyer confidence, and indeed, has flawed eBay in such a way that it probably won't ever truly recover.  The amount of buyers in your same situation is staggering--eBay has lost tons of buyers because just like you--they say to themselves, "Never again."  

 

Nevermind that the sellers in your very own country are held to such high standards that what happened to you could never happen with a US seller--we have to play by different rules and are not allowed to blatantly rip off customers and give them the run around.  However, we still have to feel the ever increasing bad effects of losing customers because of this type of behavior.  Not only that, but our items are buried beneath 10 pages worth of cheap garbage and people can't find them.  And of course, there is the fact that US sellers get NO break on shipping costs (in fact, we were just given a hearty rate increase [almost an entire dollar more to ship a 16oz first class package in the US] that is killing our sales even more) while Chinese sellers get to ship for pennies to our dollars.  You would be astounded at how many small sellers--truly the lifeblood of this site, and the people who made eBay what it is today--are going out of business.  No longer able to compete with a dwindling customer base and with the incredibly unfair shipping costs, and no longer able make any kind of a decent living, or even a little bit extra for emergencies.  It is sad, truly sad and pitiful.  And when I see a complaint like yours I feel I must educate you a little bit.  

 

When you buy from China, not only do you take precious money out of the economy in the US (which we sorely need circulating HERE right now) but you also are contributing to the downfall of the little sellers here, to the poverty in our own country, and to the degredation of eBay's "good" name.  Also, as the small sellers go away, so do the unique items, the rare and hard to find stuff, and all of the interesting things to buy and look at--the aspect that made eBay unique and somewhere fun to browse and shop. Truly, I don't write these words to hurt you, but to be honest with you.  Please stop buying garbage from China.  It isn't worth it--not on any level.  They purchase nothing, absolutely nothing, from us--and I don't mean just eBay, I mean nothing at all.  They don't help our economy at all, and your money is going into the hands of a couple of greedy business people--there is so much slave and child labor going on over there, it is just heartbreaking.

 

For anyone who thinks I am being xenophobic, or racist--I am not--I don't hate Chinese people at all. Even though one of my dogs died from the laced dog treats, and even though I personally know people who were basically ruined by the asbestos drywall in Florida--they had to walk away from their homes because it was so toxic, and who really knows what the long term effects will be--cancer, anyone?  I also, quite coincidentally, purchased some lead based Barbie toys for my daughter when she was little--thank God she wasn't one to chew on her stuff.  Thank God--because the dog treats not only killed my one dog, but also affected the other one's kidneys and he will probably be gone soon too.  Over six years he has been ill--and I only fed them 3 (!!!) treats each.  I can't imagine what could have happened to my daughter.....

 

However, I still have no hatred in my heart for them, as a people--in fact, I actually feel very sorry for most of the people in China.  Who do you think is making all that cheap junk?  It isn't people being paid a living wage--no, it is desperate people who can barely afford to eat.  The working conditions are abhorrent, and the quality of life for most people there is pitiful. The facts are the facts.  And in this case, the facts are that until people stop supporting a country that cares nothing for our well being, as a country and as individuals--until people realize that the Chinese sellers on here have absolutely no interest in being honest sellers--until you realize just how much buying from there hurts the US economy and the individual sellers on eBay--and until you realize that everything you buy from them comes from a place where human righs violations are the norm, and people are treated worse than dogs--you are just contributing to the problem. The problem here on eBay, the problem with the US economy, and the problem of human decency and fair treatment.

 

It should be obvious to you by now that they don't care one bit about selling you a qualiy item and standing behind it.  I hope you think about that before you put any more money into the hands of people that have taken so much, yet give so little in return.  Not only to us, but to their very own people.  Please stop supporting Chinese sellers here.  Instead support the sellers who are grateful for your business, who stand behind what they sell, and who will bend over backwards to make sure that you are satisfied and taken care of. 

Message 15 of 17
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