Package Redirection Scams - How does the shipper liability factor in?

[chris13]

If a package redirection scam leverages a shipping label where the tracking is legit, but the address has been altered...doesn't it expose all transactions to irrecoverable losses when the MBG uses the tracking status 'Delivered' as a validation?

1) Rock in a box trick sent to a random address in same ZIP, tracking says 'Delivered'

2) Goods in a box sent to a seller's accomplice address, tracking says 'Delivered'

3) Returns in a box sent to a buyer's accomplice address, tracking says 'Delivered'

There seems like no way to combat these scams unless the shipping provider honors the commitment that the destination address for the tracking info matches what was electronically entered into the system.

Shipping Contract Address + Tracking Status 'Delivered' = Contract fullfilled.

Am I missing something?

At what point does it become the USPS's (or other providers) liability to ensure the electronic address for tracking is the address where delivery occurs?

Is there a way to get out of this scam if it happens? Is there a way to avoid it?

[pemand-73]

If you saw my thread i think you know what is happening with me, but id like to add that the usps workers said that last week someone came for the same reason i did.

And the name on that fake label and  package was the same as the one in mine

[chris13]

@pemand-73  Yeah I started this thread based on at least 5 different threads I've read. Some I only suspect were scenario #1 but yours is scenario #3. Its also possible to not have an accomplice involved at all, but use scenario #3 with a 'rock in a box' like yours. Many permutations are possible. I'm hoping some really smart knowledgeable people here will know if there are either ways to prevent this or recover from it. I didnt want to derail your thread and hoped for more broad input. I too want to avoid this both as buyer and seller.

So sorry it happened to you.

[ittybitnot]

At what point does it become the USPS's (or other providers) liability to ensure the electronic address for tracking is the address where delivery occurs?

@chris13 

The carriers are doing their job.  If a parcel is sent to the local Walgreens in your zipcode instead of to you, the carrier is still fulfilling their duty.  

If a criminal buys a FedEx number off the net from one of those websites who sell them to use as delivery c confirmation for a fraudulent transaction, it has nothing to do with FedEx. 

The problem is, that everybody knows this is going on (eBay, PayPal, USPS, UPS, FedEX, and credit card companies, etc.) yet nobody wants to provide the necessary information/assistance to help the victims.  This is especially true on eBay be the victim a buyer who purchased something or a seller who has to accept a return.  "Tracking shows delivery, so sorry to be you"

[pereirahawk]

I mentioned this in the other thread for @pemand-73 .  I'm really curious on how this case turns out, because the tracking the seller posted show USPS to be beyond ambiguous in regards to the outcome of the package. 

Subsequently, the seller went to USPS to examine the package but was not allowed to receive it.  The question is does Ebay see this as an attempted delivery, and thus refunding the buyer.

I ask this because I'm wondering how a TRS with 30 day returms could combat this with the 50% deduction of funds returned to the buyer.  

I just don't understand how the scammers are altering the return label.  The only way is if the system is allowing these scammers to input their own return address on the label issued.

I'll be reading this thread and hoping some has an answer.

[pereirahawk]

Very good points...I've never once put any thought into this topic until reading the other thread today.  

One way to combat this is to require the buyer to accept the sellers return label, and not have the ability to alter it.  This has to be possible.  I'm sure there are holes in what I'm thinking.

[chris13]

@ittybitnot 

@pereirahawk I think this may be how it's done.

If the scammer prints out the MBG return label, or any purchased label, scans it, uses any free paint program to paint a new address on the image, reprints it, they have a redirected label with valid postage and tracking. Hopefully its not just as easy as putting tape over the label address with a new destination.

No need to 'purchase' or use a fake tracking number. This scam doesnt use fake info, it uses a real shipping contract purchased by either buyer or seller (return label), then altered by the scammer. 

The shipping carrier doesnt need to provide info to anyone. They have the correct info already in the system from the purchase of a shipping label. They just need to use that info, not the text on the label that has been falsified. 

It could be I misunderstand how this scam is being done. My questions are specific to a scenario where the electronic postage is legit, but the address is afterwards altered/forged. Tracking does NOT in this case mean delivered to address but instead redirected by scammer. 

My hope was to neither attack the shipper or those scammed but understand how to avoid the scam and understand how the shipper is or is not responsible for using the electronic data that should be driving the delivery.

Thanks!

[pemand-73]

is as easy as putting tape over the label, i'll show you some pics i took. And you can clearly see, i'll censor the details and post some when i get home

[chris13]

@pemand-73  How disappointing that that works. The pic will help make the point, thanks.

USPS: You arent on the address, cant give it to you or deliver it.

Customer: But cant you look under the tape or type the tracking # into the system and see the REAL info?

[pemand-73]

Neither me nor the clerk noticed when i was there but on a closer look you can see there's a line above the tracking number.

So is clearly just taped over. (the link is the pic, was too heavy for the forum)

lhttps://transfer.sh/1vfDE7/Picsart_23-04-11_22-32-58-411.jpg

 

[chris13]

Adding resized photo.

I suppose at least it wasnt just duct tape with a sharpie that fooled them.

[pemand-73]

yeah, looks legit at first glance. I reported the buyer already, and the support guy was pretty helpful.

They told me to wait 2 days more and they'll have full access, hopefully goes well for me. 

[an-36344]

---

@pemand-73 wrote:

yeah, looks legit at first glance. I reported the buyer already, and the support guy was pretty helpful.

They told me to wait 2 days more and they'll have full access, hopefully goes well for me. 

---

Unfortunately, just after midnight Pacific Time in 2 days

-- the eBay bot @pemand-73 will automatically force a full refund

-- if you don't voluntarily refund within 2 business days, despite the feel-good support.

[pemand-73]

 They sided with the buyer and now I owe Ebay 400 dollars, i provided all my proof and i dont really know what i did wrong.

[pereirahawk]

I'm in disbelief.

All these years, I mistakenly assumed the USPS tracking number was tied in with the address, or vice versa.

Otherwise, it's obvious the scammer altered the original tracking label.  Is it really that easy?

Maybe there are some alternatives: one that comes to mind is the 50% deduction for TRS with 30 day returns.  But, this would involve the seller also lying, or going along with the scam in order to deduct 50% of the potential full refund.