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Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

this was a while back, ebay was found guilty of sending cockroaches and spiders to people( who I assume had held there feet to the fire). anyway fyi, this is the kinda people yer dealing with..

Message 1 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

No longer. Those people are gone years ago and most have either done time, are doing time, or are about to do time (I think there was one not sentenced yet), and retribution will be paid.

 

If you aren't happy, and looking for another marketplace, there are a number of them out there for you. Just be aware that Amazon has a reputation for stealing seller's products that have made lots of money and selling them for themselves, crushing the original seller. Etsy? They don't even question if a claim about a store is legit or not. They just shut you down. So yeah, I'll stick with ebay who has helped me grow over the last 7 years. Good luck to you tho. Maybe the Temu marketplace is a good fit for you? 

 

 

Message 61 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

"What is more significant, in my opinion, is the stomping on of this couple's, and the People's, Constitutional First Amendment Rights to Freedom of Speech by high ranking officials and representatives(possibly to the highest) of a corporation through coercion and intimidation."

 

                                                                                ** ! !  W R O N G ! ! **


Welcome to the eBay Community Forum for Selling, where you can learn a lot.  The lessons include:
I.  Numbers.  Specifically:
     a.  Adding numbers together to reach a Total, and 
     b.  Calculating percentages based upon a Total, and 
     c.  Other mathematical functions as needed.

 

II.  Reading for Comprehension.
     a.  Special attention paid to the words "optional" and "opt out."  


III.  American History, Civics, and Constitutional Review.  Specifically:
    a.  Impact of the US Supreme Court decision in South Dakota v Wayfair, Inc., on June 21, 2018, and 
    b.  Frequent review of which places are within the United States and which are not, for purposes of international trade, and 

    c.  The meaning of the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States.  

Here's what the First Amendment says:  

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." 

The word "corporation" does not appear in the First Amendment.  
The First Amendment means that the Government cannot imprison anybody for saying what he or she thinks. 

Nobody ever said the Steiners had their First Amendment rights violated or stomped on by coercion or intimidation.  

Message 62 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..


@isaiah53-57 wrote:

 This site had the potential to be THE VENUE that currently has 40% of the online sales market share, but they sacrificed long term growth for short term gain at EVERY turn, in my opinion.

 

control. In my opinion, left as they are, these things WILL destroy this site. I'm hoping to help people see the maliciousness of these programs, what they are doing to the site and what they will eventually do...


Your opinion is not shared. It never had that potential because it is 100% dependent on its sellers. Every Ebay CEO since Meg Whitman has known that in order to be an ecommerce force it needed to been more buyer friendly and its sellers have fought that with great success.

 

You are still fighting the battle, but it is too late for you to win, the MBG is here and here for good because instead of when it could have fueled Ebay growth, it is now a necessity to survive.

 

As for promoted listings. they exist because the alternative is prequalifying and limiting Ebay sellers and no one knows how to limit them. Ebay has too many sellers to allow organic search results to govern what gets seen.

 

I do not promote my listings, but my listings are of items which are desired by a few specialized buyers and often the only offer on Ebay. I am not going to contribute to Ebay growth, other then supporting the belief that if you want some really weird **bleep**e, Ebay is the place to go.

 

Message 63 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..


@monroe67 wrote:

"What is more significant, in my opinion, is the stomping on of this couple's, and the People's, Constitutional First Amendment Rights to Freedom of Speech by high ranking officials and representatives(possibly to the highest) of a corporation through coercion and intimidation."


Here's what the First Amendment says:  

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." 

The word "corporation" does not appear in the First Amendment.  
The First Amendment means that the Government cannot imprison anybody for saying what he or she thinks. 

Nobody ever said the Steiners had their First Amendment rights violated or stomped on by coercion or intimidation.  


I'm sorry, are you saying since "corporations" are not noted in the amendment, that they are immune to rights violations?

I didnt say they were charged with a rights violation of "abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press" - The Steiners were people who ran an online blog - The employees/contractor who were charged with cyber-stalking, witness tampering and obstruction of justice were unhappy with the bad press the Steiners were publishing -  intimidating them for that in my opinion is stomping on the rights we all have to speak our mind.

Message 64 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

Egregious criminal activity? I say school boys tee-heeing about a prank. School boys that were running a multi billion dollar website.

Message 65 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..


@monroe67 wrote:

Nobody ever said the Steiners had their First Amendment rights violated or stomped on by coercion or intimidation.  


@monroe67 a federal prosecutor and one of the judges involved have stated they believe what eBay did to the Steiners did at least violate the spirit and values of the First Amendment, constitutional interpretation arguments not withstanding.

 

US Attorney Seth Kosto explicitly called out the White Knight Strategy to out Fidomaster/unsuckEBAY (a frequent commenter and source) as particularly egregious, abhorrent to First Amendment values and cause for significant sanction in his sentencing memorandum in the criminal case against Cooke.

 

"First, Cooke and his co-conspirators targeted the Victims based on what they had written and published, and because they had made space for others to publish in comments beneath the Newsletter’s articles. Journalism about public companies, especially the world’s largest ecommerce brands, is important to investors, merchants, and customers alike.

 

That some at eBay disagreed with the Newsletter’s coverage, and that Baugh shared that sentiment as justification to target the Victims, is abhorrent to First Amendment values.

 

While there is no good reason to harass and intimidate anyone, the logic that led to the Victims’ suffering is absurd. Accepting for purposes of argument that Cooke and others were focused on Fidomaster and his online critiques, they harassed the Victims as a means of identifying and discrediting Fidomaster. That Cooke and others targeted innocent third parties is worthy of significant sanction...

 

...Cooke asserts that, in the August 6 meeting, he tried to talk his colleagues out of at least some parts of the harassment campaign. But what remained, even in his telling, was a series of increasingly harassing messages directed to a journalist, to set up a sting, to enable Gilbert to make a false offer of assistance, to predispose Victim 1 to help eBay with its Fidomaster problem."

 

 

Judge William G. Young also admonished Veronica Zea at sentencing, saying her failure to recognize and defend the principles of free speech have broad implications beyond just this case.

 

"When did you learn about the First Amendment, isn't that something they taught before you got out of school? We're talking about speech.


It is properly said that the First Amendment doesn't protect the speech that we like, that's easy, it protects the speech that we hate. You should have understood that.


It is no excuse that this was your first job. And the implications of this case, this particular case, your case, resonate throughout society...


...you are saddled with the knowledge that when it came to you, you did not fight for or defend the First Amendment of our Constitution, it seems that you did not even recognize it. That's extraordinarily sad."

 

And very ironically, Devin Wenig even took a stand on the side of press freedom against rich corporate interests in 2016 when asked his opinion on the controversy then brewing between Gawker Media and PayPal co-founder Peter Thiel  when it was discovered Thiel had been stealth funding various lawsuits against Gawker, with the explicit purpose of bringing it down. https://www.vox.com/2016/5/26/11792922/gawker-nick-denton-peter-thiel-open-letter

 

At Recode Conference 2016, Wenig was asked:

 

Is it right for a billionaire to put large amounts of money secretly behind lawsuits seemingly to settle a political a personal score and to try to put a publication out of business?

 

He said :

"I'm gonna answer the broader question which is, I side with a free media and a free press.


I think we've got to be very careful. It is a nuanced argument there's always a pull and tug but something feels like it's different. All First Amendment rights aren't created equal.


There's a strong public interest in a free press and rich and powerful people have First Amendment rights too but if you allow that to be unfettered and what that causes is a real stifling of voices and a real concentration of media.


...We're not going to like the result of that and that really goes back all the way to the Constitution. So I don't want to get into all of that but we've got to be really careful that powerful voices don't knock down what I call divergent points of view.


You know this immediate kerfuffle, I don't like the media actor [Gawker]. I don't read what they do. I don't find it particularly valuable but that's irrelevant.


What's more relevant is that you shouldn't be allowed to drive media companies from expressing divergent points of view and I think we've got to be really careful about that."

 

"You shouldn't be allowed to drive media companies from expressing divergent points of view"...sort of makes you wonder what changed in 3 years, doesn't it?

 

 

Message 66 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..


@az93 wrote:

Egregious criminal activity? I say school boys tee-heeing about a prank. School boys that were running a multi billion dollar website.


@az93 each of the criminal defendants pleaded guilty to multiple federal felonies - for example:

 

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ma/pr/two-former-ebay-executives-sentenced-prison-cyberstalking 

 

Baugh pleaded guilty to one count of conspiracy to commit stalking through interstate travel and through facilities of interstate commerce, two counts of stalking through interstate travel, two counts of stalking through facilities of interstate commerce, two counts of witness tampering and two counts of destruction, alteration and falsification of records in a federal investigation.

 

Harville pleaded guilty to one count of conspiracy to commit stalking through interstate travel and through facilities of interstate commerce, two counts of stalking through interstate travel and two counts of stalking through facilities of interstate commerce.

 

Other individuals charged pleaded to similar charges.

 

And in the recent settlement with the DOJ, eBay (the corporation) was charged and criminally with 6 federal felonies - two counts of stalking through interstate travel, two counts of stalking through electronic communications services, one count of witness tampering and one count of obstruction of justice.

 

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ma/pr/ebay-inc-pay-3-million-connection-corporate-cyberstalking-campaig...

 

Objectively speaking, I don't think it is unreasonable to call multiple federal felonies "egregious criminal activity" and in fact I believe federal prosecutors, FBI investigators and judges involved in this matter have all said something very similar to that effect at various points in these cases.

Message 67 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

I liked your post - Informative and with credence - But even though its too late now and the point is moot, I still believe many of the decisions and non-decisions made in the early to later 2000's paved the path away from kingship for ebay - The River was losing TONS of money - no one ever thought they would amount to much - but they kept saying trust us we know where we are heading - They had a vision for the future and stuck with it -  All the while, ebay was riding its wave of success and didn't think they needed to do anything different until it was too late.

 

You say I'm still fighting the battle, and its too late to win - I'm of the idea that Promoted listings and the MBG have already decided the war - I'm just hoping to help as many people as I can from becoming casualties - I cant stand reading posts where sellers just had their $200 to $2000 item thieved -  I've been there. And I'm still hoping that the site will change its course - MBG or Promoted listings cant and wont change the site for  the better for buyers - MBG means people are less and less willing to sell their high quality, valuable items  here due to fraud - Bad for Buyers. Promoted Listings and the quest for 25% to 40% of the entire transaction means prices go up and quality comes down as the competition rages - So buyers see questionable items at high prices - I see it now doing a google search - Bad for buyers. And as you mentioned, what is bad for buyers is bad for the site.

 

We have mainly transitioned from ebay now knowing that we may likely never be back for many of the reasons you mentioned.

Message 68 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

OK !!  You obviously have done much more research into this case than I have !!

 

As a retired legal secretary, I am quite familiar with quotes from court transcripts and published decisions, and how to find published cases on the internet.  I don't know the full case number at this point.  All I know is  the title: USA v eBay, Inc., filed in the US District Court for the District of Massachusetts. 

Seems to me the defendants tried to take the law into their own hands.  
But those defendants were and are not The Law.  
The Law -- the government  -- did not punish the Steiners for things they typed and published in their blog.  

 

BUT some immature and overly sensitive eBay employees tried to act like The Law because they didn't like some of the things that the Steiners published in their blog.  Nothing new there.  Everything from fistfights to wars have been started because one person didn't like something another person said.

Message 69 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..


@monroe67 wrote:

OK !!  You obviously have done much more research into this case than I have !!

 

As a retired legal secretary, I am quite familiar with quotes from court transcripts and published decisions, and how to find published cases on the internet.  I don't know the full case number at this point.  All I know is  the title: USA v eBay, Inc., filed in the US District Court for the District of Massachusetts. 

Seems to me the defendants tried to take the law into their own hands.  
But those defendants were and are not The Law.  
The Law -- the government  -- did not punish the Steiners for things they typed and published in their blog.  

 

BUT some immature and overly sensitive eBay employees tried to act like The Law because they didn't like some of the things that the Steiners published in their blog.  Nothing new there.  Everything from fistfights to wars have been started because one person didn't like something another person said.


@monroe67 I've probably read over a thousand pages of court documents on this subject at this point  😂

 

It's actually fascinating in my opinion because there are a lot of details in the documents that haven't made it in to most of the media coverage.

 

I understand why media has gone mostly with the shocking and bizarre parts about what was done to the Steiners (gotta drive those clicks!) but there's a much deeper and, again in my opinion, much more intriguing story about why those things were done, the attempts to not only influence the Steiners' coverage but also to try to get them to out an anonymous source, the Head of Security's alleged CIA and FBI ties/experience and more.

 

Maybe if some in the media explored those parts, some people would be less bored with rehashing the whole thing or less inclined to just shrug it off as juvenile shenanigans?

 

If your retired legal secretary brain is interested in going down that rabbit hole - here are some case numbers to point you in the right direction. 😉

 

USA v. eBay Inc. Massachusetts District Court Case #: 1:24-cr-10003 - DOJ criminal case against eBay that resulted in deferred prosecution agreement.

 

USA v. Gilbert et al Massachusetts District Court Case #: 1:20-cr-10098 - criminal case against Senior Manager of Special Operations Brian Gilbert,  Senior Manager of Global Intelligence Stephanie Popp, Global Intelligence Manager Stephanie Stockwell and a contracted security analyst Veronica Zea.

 

USA v. Cooke Massachusetts District Court Case #: 1:20-cr-10126 - criminal case against Security Manager Philip Cooke.

 

USA v. Baugh et al Massachusetts District Court Case #: 1:20-cr-10263 - criminal case against Senior Director Security Jim Baugh and Director of Global Resiliency David Harville.

 

Ace Property & Casualty Insurance Company v. eBay, Inc. et al California Northern District Court Case #: 5:22-cv-07088 - civil case where corporate insurance company sued eBay to get out of liability for covering any judgements or settlements related to this matter.

 

Steiner et al v. eBay Inc. et al Massachusetts District Court Case #: 1:21-cv-11181 - civil lawsuit filed by the Steiners against the seven security employees named in the criminal cases, plus then CEO Devin Wenig, Communications Chief Steve Wymer, VP Global Operations Wendy Jones and security company Progressive F.O.R.C.E Concepts.

Message 70 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

Yes exactly my point, there is defiantly  things that smell of organized crime. I think its good to keep this out there so people stop and think about who there dealing with. Except for tracfone, ebay is the worst company i have ever dealt with as far as the company. Certainly there is tons of great buyers and sellers on here. Thats wye I keep using it. but the company itself is horrendous, it seams every other week now its some more problems they will not fix, or make worse, or something they will not do, or should do, I know they do things that are illegal. It used to be a lot better, I cant understand wye they screwed it up so bad...

Message 71 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

yes I get that, but they did it with criminal malicious intent. And were found guilty in court of it. They probably did way worse stuff to.

Message 72 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

Exactly, i personally know people and in a wider, business since that will not use ebay. some of who are non informed enough that they dont really get that eBay isn't a "store" or "company" that you buy stuff from directly like amazon of summit racing, or whatever..

Message 73 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

ebay pays bots, (not sure if that's the right word) to be on these forums, and take there side and spin things, no matter how radically wrong they are. to make e bay look good and shift the blame. watch its pretty obvious 

Message 74 of 101
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Re: Ebay sent cockroaches and Spiders to people..

LOL..here we go again.



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“Never pick a fight with an ugly person. They don’t have anything to lose.” ~Robin Williams
Message 75 of 101
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