eBay

thingsoldandnew10 · ‎06-13-2019

I ship kites and I offer free shipping via USPS First Class Mail (Parcel) which is allowed by USPS. The regulations for USPS First Class Parcels are it must be rectangle shaped and can not exceed 108 inches in girth. But e-bays new shipping page doesn't allow shipping on these items via USPS First Class mail. In essence USPS, Pay Pal, Stamps allow shipping via USPS First Class mail and e-bay does not. Whenever I have an order, e-bay's shipping page comes up Parcel Select with the only other options being USPS Priority.

I have a shipment to make - the kite package measures 43 inches long X 5 inches wide X 2 inches deep. The total shipping calculation would be 43" + 2 X 5 (10") + 2 X 2 (4") or 57 inches - far under the maximum 108" USPS allows. The weight is 11 oz. - again within the weight allowed for USPS First Class Mail parcel.

I called e-bay and of course was connected with an accent speaking rep who then connected me with another supposedly accented speaking member of the shipping dept. with a first name of Matt. Matt stated there was no problem Since the item I WAS SHIPPING WAS NOT ALLOWED TO BE SHIPPED VIA USPS FIRST CLASS MAIL AND COULD ONLY BE SHIPPED USPS PARCEL SELECT. It took me approximately 3 minutes to Google USPS First Class Mail regulations and double check parcel dimensions allowed but evidently e-bays programmers can't afford the time and have now making USPS regulations allowed on e-bay.

I wish Triton or some other individual would take Matt aside and give him and couple of whacks on the side of his head and instruct him to read the online easy to find regulations, show him the door and then hire someone who can read English and make the e-bay shipping page perform to seller's needs.

Now I will be spending hours trying to get e-bay to recognize they have a problem.

moo*cow*corner · ‎06-13-2019

I figured there was a special link, and I'm glad that you had no problems getting it from Stamps. Good CS folks there. It'll be good for backup and for packages that ebay's page doesn't like.

Many years as a factory rat, mostly in non-union automotive...competition is cutthroat for those folks, standards are insane, and the car companies do not tolerate fools lightly. I bet we'd both have some stories to tell!

Déjà Moo: The strange feeling that I've heard this bull before...

lintbrush* · ‎06-13-2019

I just checked on the eBay platform, and I could put in 20x5x2/14oz and get the FCP option, but at 23", the FCP option disappeared. I went to ClickNShip and used 45x5x2 / 13 oz and FCP showed as a counter option (not online). I did use 13 oz because CnS shows retail FC rates only.

It's definitely a programming error.

@ship_like_a_pro

brian@ebayCould you pass this along to Nate or whomever on the shipping team in the event he doesn't see this? Thanks.

thingsoldandnew10 · ‎06-13-2019

There are two things wrong with this whole thing:

1.) A seller should not have to juggle the dimensions of a package in order to be to generate a shipping label using the new e-bay shipping page. Being a so called tech company, e-bay should have both the experience and means to develop a page that is consistent with USPS regulations. If they can't then their being a tech company is questionable.

2.) E-bay collects fees for shipping. They are collecting a fee for a service they can and do not provide - the service of providing a service the customer paid for and a service which e-bay claims is their shipping service. Every first class label generated through e-bay expounds that fact across the top. No truth in their advertising. If e-bay believes shipping these size packages why then does it allow those items to be shipped via USPS First Class?

I am thinking about contacting my state's Attorney General on this matter. Maybe they will consider taking on e-bay and their unethicial business practices.

thingsoldandnew10 · ‎06-13-2019

@moo*cow*corner wrote:
I figured there was a special link, and I'm glad that you had no problems getting it from Stamps. Good CS folks there. It'll be good for backup and for packages that ebay's page doesn't like.

Many years as a factory rat, mostly in non-union automotive...competition is cutthroat for those folks, standards are insane, and the car companies do not tolerate fools lightly. I bet we'd both have some stories to tell!

I'm retired and the automotive company I worked for was "Fix Or Repair Daily". Stories? Working in a union assembly line environment, the stories equate to a 2000 page novel entitled "As the Belt Turns." What I do miss is the $ - those were the good old days.

carolinasecurityrep · ‎06-13-2019

I believe that loss of revenue is pretty much the only way Ebay pays attention to it's flawed systems so it sounds as if you should ship directly through the USPS. Is it worth your time and happiness to save a little bit of money by using Ebay? I'm not sure about the accent bit, however... I live in S. Carolina and have neighbors with accents and whose children have traditional American names. Everyone deserves the opportunity to work. Best of luck moving forward!

thingsoldandnew10 · ‎06-13-2019

@thingsoldandnew10 wrote:
There are two things wrong with this whole thing:
1.) A seller should not have to juggle the dimensions of a package in order to be to generate a shipping label using the new e-bay shipping page. Being a so called tech company, e-bay should have both the experience and means to develop a page that is consistent with USPS regulations. If they can't then their being a tech company is questionable.
2.) E-bay collects fees for shipping. They are collecting a fee for a service they can and do not provide - the service of providing a service the customer paid for and a service which e-bay claims is their shipping service. Every first class label generated through e-bay expounds that fact across the top. No truth in their advertising. If e-bay believes shipping these size packages why then does it allow those items to be shipped via USPS First Class?

I am thinking about contacting my state's Attorney General on this matter. Maybe they will consider taking on e-bay and their unethicial business practices.

Sorry there was a incorrect worded part-

If e-bay believes shipping these size packages why then does it allow those items to be shipped via USPS First Class?

I meant

If e-bay believes shipping these size packages is not allowed via USPS First Class Shipping then why does it allow those items to be LISTED using USPS First Class Shipping. It appears the programmers for the listing part of the business knows USPS regulations and how to develop a working page within the e-bay website while the programmers responsible for the new shipping page don't even know there is a USPS Website where there a regulations are stated the shipping aspect needs to be developed to.

thingsoldandnew10 · ‎06-13-2019

@lintbrush* wrote:
I just checked on the eBay platform, and I could put in 20x5x2/14oz and get the FCP option, but at 23", the FCP option disappeared. I went to ClickNShip and used 45x5x2 / 13 oz and FCP showed as a counter option (not online). I did use 13 oz because CnS shows retail FC rates only.

It's definitely a programming error.

@ship_like_a_pro

brian@ebayCould you pass this along to Nate or whomever on the shipping team in the event he doesn't see this? Thanks.

Thank You for forwarding my problem to e-bay

lisa5768 · ‎06-13-2019

Hi, the new e-bay label page does not require package dimensions for first class labels, just leave them blank. I ship mostly first class and never put them in.

lisa5768
Volunteer Community Mentor

lintbrush* · ‎06-13-2019

The more I thought about it, something still wasn't sitting right.... and here it is:

https://pe.usps.com/text/qsg300/Q201e.htm#1009536

First-Class Package Service — Commercial (201.8.3)
Maximum weight: less than 16 ounces.
Maximum dimensions: 22 inches in length, 18 inches in width, and 15 inches in thickness.
A surcharge applies for parcels with the following characteristics:
Parcels that are irregularly shaped, such as rolls, tubes, and triangles.
Parcels must include a unique Intelligent Mail package barcode with a postal routing code to avoid a surcharge.
See Quick Service Guide 280, First-Class Package Service — Commercial parcels

So now I'm not really sure if it does qualify or not now.

Then there's machinable and non-machinable stuff and I'm not lively enough to do that type of in-depth reading

Maybe @nobody*s_perfect could chime in as the resident board USPS expert

(might have to take back my brian@ebay shoutout )

tyler@ebay · ‎06-13-2019

@lintbrush* wrote:

The more I thought about it, something still wasn't sitting right.... and here it is:

https://pe.usps.com/text/qsg300/Q201e.htm#1009536

First-Class Package Service — Commercial (201.8.3)
Maximum weight: less than 16 ounces.
Maximum dimensions: 22 inches in length, 18 inches in width, and 15 inches in thickness.
A surcharge applies for parcels with the following characteristics:
Parcels that are irregularly shaped, such as rolls, tubes, and triangles.
Parcels must include a unique Intelligent Mail package barcode with a postal routing code to avoid a surcharge.
See Quick Service Guide 280, First-Class Package Service — Commercial parcels

So now I'm not really sure if it does qualify or not now.

Then there's machinable and non-machinable stuff and I'm not lively enough to do that type of in-depth reading

Maybe @nobody*s_perfect could chime in as the resident board USPS expert

(might have to take back my brian@ebay shoutout )

Hi @lintbrush* - The USPS section you mentioned was the same one I found, great minds! I'm working on getting official confirmation, but my initial assessment is exactly that.

USPS First Class Package Service has two forms: Retail and Commercial. We offer you commercial rates through eBay Labels because they have a discount associated with them.

I double checked PayPal labels and saw that they allow you to choose a service, but it does not run you through any dimensional checking that I could see at first blush (though I'm not a PayPal expert, so may have been overlooking something).

The item could still be sent as a First Class Package service using retail rates, which is why the shipping and Payments tab will generate a price for a potential buyer.

Like I said, just a working theory at the moment, still waiting on input from the Shipping folks. I'll update the thread as I get more details. 🙂

Thanks for the tag @thingsoldandnew10!

Tyler,

nobody*s_perfect · ‎06-13-2019

@thingsoldandnew10 wrote: .... The regulations for USPS First Class Parcels are it must be rectangle shaped and can not exceed 108 inches in girth. ... the kite package measures 43 inches long X .... Matt stated there was no problem Since the item I WAS SHIPPING WAS NOT ALLOWED TO BE SHIPPED VIA USPS FIRST CLASS MAIL AND COULD ONLY BE SHIPPED USPS PARCEL SELECT. It took me approximately 3 minutes to Google USPS First Class Mail regulations and double check parcel dimensions allowed ...

The 108-inch limit on combined length-plus-girth can be found in the DMM section that applies to RETAIL First Class packages:

https://pe.usps.com/text/dmm300/101.htm#ep1002718

As noted above, the COMMERCIAL rates have specific limits for length, height, and depth.

I would hold off on Matts' whuppin' since he was correct regarding commercial rates (and since he referred to Parcel Select and not to Retail Ground, he apparently WAs talking about Commercial rates, not retail).

thingsoldandnew10 · ‎06-13-2019

@nobody*s_perfect Two USPS Post Masters were consulted about this problem. Neither one could find a problem and my shipment of kites with labels generated off Pay Pal have been accepted by both post offices without any problem. The USPS site I visited showed the max at 108 inches with 16 oz weight limitation.

By your explanation something is wrong with USPS since their Commercial Regulations appear to not make these shipments allowable. Where with retail the package size is aallowed but the weight limitation of 13 ounces would result in 50 % of my kites not being allowed since many are over 13 oz.

Why is there no problem on Pay Pal or Stamps? Do we not have one set of standards all shipping services need to follow?

I am now in the process of opening an account with Stamps. E-Bay doesn't need the revenue anyway. Along with the Stamps move will be to move my listings off e-. If e-bay's competition in shipping finds these items allowable and is successful in enabling shipment, e-bay should be able to do the same. If there were a problem one would think USPS would pick up the problem along the way on one of my shipments. One would think USPS would have contacted Pay Pal or stamps to alert them of a problem. 2+2 are not adding up to 4 when it equates to shipping my sized parcel.

@tyler@ebay

@nobody*s_perfect wrote:
@thingsoldandnew10 wrote: .... The regulations for USPS First Class Parcels are it must be rectangle shaped and can not exceed 108 inches in girth. ... the kite package measures 43 inches long X .... Matt stated there was no problem Since the item I WAS SHIPPING WAS NOT ALLOWED TO BE SHIPPED VIA USPS FIRST CLASS MAIL AND COULD ONLY BE SHIPPED USPS PARCEL SELECT. It took me approximately 3 minutes to Google USPS First Class Mail regulations and double check parcel dimensions allowed ...

The 108-inch limit on combined length-plus-girth can be found in the DMM section that applies to RETAIL First Class packages:

https://pe.usps.com/text/dmm300/101.htm#ep1002718

As noted above, the COMMERCIAL rates have specific limits for length, height, and depth.

I would hold off on Matts' whuppin' since he was correct regarding commercial rates (and since he referred to Parcel Select and not to Retail Ground, he apparently WAs talking about Commercial rates, not retail).

nobody*s_perfect · ‎06-13-2019

The specific dimensions for commercial FC packages appeared in the DMM just about 2 years ago. I suspect that other postage providers haven't updated to include them, just as eBay hadn't updated their "classic" label page.

Local Postmasters are usually only familiar with retail regulations.

thingsoldandnew10 · ‎06-13-2019

Pay Pal does not require the input of package dimensions for USPS First Class mail. Only item that has to be checked is if the package is irregular shaped. By another poster, Stamps allows shipments of this size by USPS First Class. Two Post Masters couldn't find any problem.

Does e-bay recognize that by both Stamps and Pay Pal enabling shipment of these items where e-bay doesn't, e-bay's revenue is being affected?

E-bay clams to be a tech company. I am finding that statement harder and harder to believe every passing day.

tyler@ebay wrote:
@lintbrush* wrote:
The more I thought about it, something still wasn't sitting right.... and here it is:

https://pe.usps.com/text/qsg300/Q201e.htm#1009536

First-Class Package Service — Commercial (201.8.3)
Maximum weight: less than 16 ounces.
Maximum dimensions: 22 inches in length, 18 inches in width, and 15 inches in thickness.
A surcharge applies for parcels with the following characteristics:
Parcels that are irregularly shaped, such as rolls, tubes, and triangles.
Parcels must include a unique Intelligent Mail package barcode with a postal routing code to avoid a surcharge.
See Quick Service Guide 280, First-Class Package Service — Commercial parcels

So now I'm not really sure if it does qualify or not now.

Then there's machinable and non-machinable stuff and I'm not lively enough to do that type of in-depth reading

Maybe @nobody*s_perfect could chime in as the resident board USPS expert

(might have to take back my brian@ebay shoutout )

Hi @lintbrush* - The USPS section you mentioned was the same one I found, great minds! I'm working on getting official confirmation, but my initial assessment is exactly that.

USPS First Class Package Service has two forms: Retail and Commercial. We offer you commercial rates through eBay Labels because they have a discount associated with them.

I double checked PayPal labels and saw that they allow you to choose a service, but it does not run you through any dimensional checking that I could see at first blush (though I'm not a PayPal expert, so may have been overlooking something).

The item could still be sent as a First Class Package service using retail rates, which is why the shipping and Payments tab will generate a price for a potential buyer.

Like I said, just a working theory at the moment, still waiting on input from the Shipping folks. I'll update the thread as I get more details. 🙂

Thanks for the tag @thingsoldandnew10!