What happens when USPS loses a RETURN package?

[gurlcat]

A buyer's return package is still showing as 'Out For Delivery' (on the USPS website, not just eBay) even though my mailman already came today around 3 PM, delivered paper mail and even another package -something I purchased, and yes its' tracking showed as Delivered within a few minutes after he left.  I know things get crazy this time of year and it's very likely that another carrier will bring it tonight -it's 6:30 now but I've had deliveries at this house as late as 9 during Christmas season.  And if not tonight, then tomorrow, or some day.  

That said, if it never does get delivered, it wouldn't be the first time I've seen OFD as the last scan, both as a buyer and a seller. I remember very well because at least one time when I was the buyer it created a somewhat awkward situation with the seller, from whom I had bought many times and intended to continue to.   

So anyway now I'm curious, what happens if a return gets sent by the buyer, gets acceptance and transit scans, but is never delivered?    I would HOPE that eBay would consider the buyer the responsible party and not just give them the money back, because when a package is in transit from seller-to-buyer, the seller is the one responsible if it gets lost, including contacting the USPS, starting a missing package case, etc.  

[ittybitnot]

@gurlcat 

If this does get a scan saying "delivered" and you did not get it....get ready for a big ride.  

Just like buyers that are victims of the "fake tracking scam" for their purchases, sellers can get the same treatment for phony return scams where a cheap trinket with d/confirmation is sent to a local gas station or other business in your zipcode.  That delivery will suffice to prove a buyer return even if it is fake, and the burden will be on YOU to prove otherwise.  

Time for a visit to your Post Office with copies of the documents/tracking  for the label to initially discern if the parcel was mis-delivered or not intended for you in the first place.  

Scammers are getting better at this, with easily being able to tweak the label you provided by changing the addresses and retaining the original tracking number.   Maybe you will get the parcel tomorrow, however, so this information is provided "just in case." 

If there is NEVER is a delivery scan, you can complain to eBay after the allowed time for the return.  Likely they will let you keep your money (courtesy refund) and refund the buyer anyway since "they tried to send it back".  Time will tell. 

[gurlcat]

Yeah hopefully that other scenario is not unfolding in this situation.  I was already bracing myself for a different bumpy ride.  -The reason the buyer gave for the return is 1 broken item and 4 "missing" items (from a mixed jewelry lot), despite there being no damage to the package and I know for certain there is no way I didn't pack the pieces she claimed were missing -4 of the most valuable ones coincidentally.  This is something I have known all along could happen and honestly I'm surprised it hasn't before, but fortunately the vast majority of jewelry people are not like electronics, gaming, coins, etc. people.  

So anyway, I was bracing to do my first ever less-than-100% refund, and surely get a flood of angry messages from her, maybe negative feedback, maybe an appeal, etc.  I wasn't too worried though, because at the very worst eBay would just find in her favor (IF she even appealed) and make me pay those few bucks.  In a way I was kind of looking forward to it, just for the learning experience.   Now it looks like I might be in for a horse of a different color, lol.  

Ah, and just now the 7:55 predicted-by delivery time just passed, literally a minute ago.  Now it has just gone back to 'OFD' with no expected time, but still showing Dec. 11th as the date. 

[silverstatetreasureboxes]

@gurlcat 

Call your local post office in the morning at their phone number not the usps #. It could be that you have a sub carrier, forgotten package in truck. This happened to me twice, I have my local PO on speed dial ( lol). 

    PO has hired a bunch of temporary workers, they may have just missed your delivery.

[an-36344]

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@gurlcat wrote:

So anyway now I'm curious, what happens if a return

1. gets sent by the buyer,

2. gets acceptance and transit scans,

3. but is never delivered?   

I would HOPE that eBay would consider the buyer the responsible party and not just give them the money back, because when a package is in transit from seller-to-buyer, the seller is the one responsible if it gets lost, including contacting the USPS, starting a missing package case, etc. 

---

If the buyer used an eBay or seller return label, eBay will issue the refund if you don't voluntarily, even if the return label never shows delivered anywhere. 

But if the buyer paid for the return shipping themselves, you win if tracking never shows delivered.

[gurlcat]

LOL I have tried many times to find out the local post office phone number but could not.  Anyway if I did I'm pretty sure I would just reach 'Brenda' -the rudest, honestly MEANEST, employee of any institution I have ever tried to deal with.  She threw my box of live aquarium fish across the room.   You should see the local Yelp/Google reviews about her.  LOL, I'm pretty sure she must be privy to some horrific dirt on her boss or something, because she should have been fired many years ago, but every time I have the misfortune of having to go in that place, there she sits, all 400+ pounds of her on her chair.  

Anyway, I don't WANT this box; I would rather keep my money.  

[gurlcat]

Well she used whatever label was automated for returns, so an eBay one I guess.  But if that is true, that is totally UNFAIR.  The seller is responsible for delivery of purchases even when we use eBay labels, so why is the seller also responsible when the buyer uses one?   What if it printed poorly or they stuck it on poorly, got it wet, or any other kind of thing that could make it so that the full address isn't legible and the barcode doesn't work?  I mean 'accidentally' of course, but then again ....... 

Thanks for sharing that but may I ask where you found it?  It appears to be a Blue response to a forum question.  I'd like to read it for the rest of the context if possible.  What was the title of the thread? 

[gurlcat]

I did some searching and found a very recent case like mine.  The thread title is 'Buyer return lost in shipping.'  Here's the outcome of that one:



Then I found one from 2019, titled 'What is your best policy guess on a return package lost in transit?'  It also resulted in a courtesy refund for the buyer.



But what's especially interesting about that thread @an-36344 is that one of the replies said this (remember, the thread was back in 2019):


Note how it says Brian wrote that "Long ago".  I don't know how long ago, but 2019 was long-ish ago already.  We were still getting paid via Paypal and all kinds of other differences.  Strangely enough, the OP chose that reply as the thread solution, even though the actual outcome contradicted Brian's words (the return label was an eBay-provided, seller-paid one, yet the seller still did not have to pay the refund).  So I don't know if he had already chosen the response as the solution before his case was fully over, or if he misunderstood what it said.  

But anyway, I'm still trying to find a post where the seller DID have to pay the refund, haven't found one yet.  I'm pretty sure if it happened they would be ranting up a storm about it.  

[gurlcat]

Okay, I finally found the thread where you got that screenshot.  Since someone had said they thought eBay would give a courtesy refund rather than a seller's fund yank, Brian received a follow up question and his response was interesting:



My take on that is they do courtesy refunds but don't want to state that as the official policy because having that information 'out there' could spark a bunch of fraud that affects eBay's profits directly, considering they're the ones forking over the money.  And I suppose there may be some kind of weird situations where they would not find for the buyer at all, or find for the buyer AND take the money from the seller.  So it could be technically true that they decide these on a case-by-case basis. 

I read all the threads in all the pages of search results involving returns being lost, and could not find a single one where the seller had the money taken from them.  I saw Brian being quoted many times, but only his basic wording about "find in the _____'s favor" -not who actually pays the refund.