eBay

wildpitchsports · ‎02-08-2022

Paypal stock tanked last week due to numerous issues including the end of their partnership with eBay, forced managed payments use on eBay, fake users and of course, people realizing information is true about the new $600 reporting 1099K trigger for third party payment and online reseller platforms for the 2022 tax year in the U.S.

The article can be found here:

PayPal Stock Getting Rekt

I believe this is just the tip of the iceberg for these kind of platforms over the next couple of years. What millions of Americans did online for the past two decades will dramatically change in my opinion.

This is a discussion thread on a discussion board. Please be civil and do not threaten other users.

Have a great eBay day!

my-cottage-books-and-antiques · ‎02-08-2022

@wildpitchsports wrote:
@my-cottage-books-and-antiques wrote:

...what "dramatic change" do you foresee?
You're going to see a lot more garage sales & cash only flea markets pop back up, that's what I believe. The days of "oh I don't need this anymore, I'll just throw it on eBay" are long gone.

Actually, I think those days have been fading for some time....a lot of people who just want to get rid of something use other sites now. Sure, ebay would like to have those sellers, but primarily because they might decide to actually go from "I'll throw this on ebay" to "I'll build a business." Those who really just want to get rid of something once in a while, with no desire to grow beyond that, are really no big loss for ebay. What I've been seeing (just my observation) is more and more people selling online (including on ebay) who , right from the get go, are looking to build a business....1099Ks aren't going to scare them away.

There will be a shake out---on ebay and on other platforms---due to the 1099 change, but I don't see it as huge (in dollar terms), and it won't really be long lasting. Any change like this produces some churn, but within a year or two, instead of "Oh my God, they went from $20,000 to $600!" it will be "So, what are all the deductions I can take?" $600 will simply be the norm. (and of course, for new people, it will simply be accepted as if it had always been $600).

A lot of buyers at flea markets and craft shows don't---and won't---carry a lot of cash---and they'll continue to expect sellers to accept credit cards with their smart phone or tablet. Yes, there will still be some sellers and some locales where cash will be king, but in many places, failure to accept a credit card will be a serious competitive disadvantage. As has been proven repeatedly, buyers want convenience, and a credit card or payment app (like PayPal) is a lot more convenient than carrying a lot of cash....

I could be wrong. Maybe this will be devastating for sites like ebay and etsy and so forth. But I seriously doubt it.

silverstatetreasureboxes · ‎02-08-2022

@glasser

Your post was well thought out and I agree. This $600 reporting threshold is extremely too low but the current administration was hoping to get 80k IRS agents in the BBB plan to take care of all this additional paperwork.

Currently, the B&M stores ( consignments) have a $5k reporting system and in 2023 that will also join the 600 club.

You wait, next will be registering for garage sales and flea markets only taking credit cards.

I guess we see so much waste of our government spending from the " wall" that was bought and paid for and left to rust and rot away to the millions of dollars of military equipment that was given to a terrorist group. It just makes Americans angry.

All I can do is the best that I can when taxes are filed, keeping every little piece of paper, receipt, notation and carbons from my checking account to offset my costs.

maxine*j · ‎02-08-2022

@wildpitchsports wrote:
@my-cottage-books-and-antiques wrote:

...what "dramatic change" do you foresee?
You're going to see a lot more garage sales & cash only flea markets pop back up, that's what I believe. The days of "oh I don't need this anymore, I'll just throw it on eBay" are long gone.

If people had just used eBay to get rid of some excess personal property, none of the issues about sales tax or income tax avoidance would have arisen, any more than they ever arose when people used yard sales or the newspaper classifed ads for that.

There would have been no legislation to force marketplace facilitators to collect sales tax or issue 1099s if people were, truly, just throwing some unneeded personal property on eBay once in awhile.

The fact is that most people who did and do sell on eBay are running businesses, even if the inentory they began with may have been personal, household discards.

We get people here all the time saying they were just selling household stuff and it's so unfair to plague them with paperwork and suggest they have tax liabilities. But when you take a look you see they have thousands of sales over many years, and their current listings often include multiples of identical new-in-box items that were manufactured within the past 18 months.

Way too many people, some of whom may originally have thought just to sell off a few personal items, are running businesses and bringing in substantial amounts of money, while pretending otherwise.

You can fool all of the taxmen some of the time, and some of the taxmen all of the time, but you can't fool all of the taxmen all of the time.

=

slippinjimmy · ‎02-08-2022

@silverstatetreasureboxes wrote:
@glasser
This $600 reporting threshold is extremely too low but the current administration was hoping to get 80k IRS agents in the BBB plan to take care of all this additional paperwork.

The 80 thousand new IRS employees are spread over a 10 year period and if you consider standard attrition rates amongst the aging IRS population there will be only a modest increase in overall staffing. For many years the IRS staff levels have been falling, the proposed (now dead) BBB hiring was intended to reverse this trend with enough of an increase that there will be more capacity to chase after non-compliant taxpayers.

glasser · ‎02-08-2022

@silverstatetreasureboxes I have zero issues with paying taxes owed--the efficiency of government spending is another issue 🙂

Everyone touts small business as the backbone of America so incentives for them (or help when things go south like a pandemic or natural disaster are important).

I have said this before but...eBay has not done a good job on this 1099K issue. As with the conversion to MPs, the forget that many of their sellers have been eBay only sellers for years and the transition to new systems can be confusing. eBay needs better quality seller education and much, much better communications. Sellers doing well is in eBay's best interests.

silverstatetreasureboxes · ‎02-08-2022

@glasser

Agree, whole bunch of interesting news bits on this issue came across. Here's one on the 600 club.

Open SmartNews and read "Senate GOP pushes repeal of Biden’s $600 IRS reporting rule for online payment platforms - Washington Times" here: https://share.smartnews.com/oMo8t

To read it on the web, tap here: https://share.smartnews.com/RLBVQ

glasser · ‎02-08-2022

@silverstatetreasureboxes

Hope springs eternal

yuzuha · ‎02-08-2022

@wildpitchsports wrote:
It is VERY hard to get started now as opposed to how it used to be, it was a way easier entry point no doubt.

Frankly, I think that's a GOOD thing. I've been regaled with plenty of horror stories from my coworkers about their eBay experiences back in the day when there were no real rules and sellers could get away with murder and buyers had very little recourse. There absolutely needs to be much stricter vetting of sellers because otherwise you get unhappy buyers who might never come back to shop on eBay again.

yuzuha · ‎02-08-2022

@my-cottage-books-and-antiques wrote:
A lot of buyers at flea markets and craft shows don't---and won't---carry a lot of cash---and they'll continue to expect sellers to accept credit cards with their smart phone or tablet. Yes, there will still be some sellers and some locales where cash will be king, but in many places, failure to accept a credit card will be a serious competitive disadvantage. As has been proven repeatedly, buyers want convenience, and a credit card or payment app (like PayPal) is a lot more convenient than carrying a lot of cash....

Not only that, sellers much prefer CC transactions too-- it means they don't have to carry around a box of cash with them. All of my friends who sell at craft shows and artist's alleys much prefer when people pay with a card rather than cash.

onlinecentral · ‎02-08-2022

The government can incubate businesses by:
a) Giving a tax credit.
b) Giving a grant.
c) Turning a blind eye and not collecting taxes. That has the same effect as a credit or grant with no administrative cost.

Lowering the threshold from $20,000 to $600, a 97% decrease, was too harsh. Hopefully the limit will be raised, somewhat.

I won't comment on Paypal's stock price, since I have not studied it. The stock market is worth more than two times the GDP of the country. A dizzy high inflated level, with a future correction on the horizon.

my-cottage-books-and-antiques · ‎02-08-2022

@yuzuha Agreed. I would also suspect that a fair number of the ebay sellers who will leave because of the 1099K are older and many will not really want to go back to the days of getting up early, hauling a load of stuff to the flea market, etc. They might set up a yard sale or sell stuff locally through online classifieds, but I'm not sure they will fuel a huge resurgence in flea markets.

wildpitchsports · ‎02-08-2022

@onlinecentral wrote:
Lowering the threshold from $20,000 to $600, a 97% decrease, was too harsh. Hopefully the limit will be raised, somewhat.

I won't comment on Paypal's stock price, since I have not studied it. The stock market is worth more than two times the GDP of the country. A dizzy high inflated level, with a future correction on the horizon.

This is truth and that correction will liquidate more than a few, the party is really going to be over soon.

wildpitchsports · ‎02-08-2022

@yuzuha wrote:
@wildpitchsports wrote:
It is VERY hard to get started now as opposed to how it used to be, it was a way easier entry point no doubt.
Frankly, I think that's a GOOD thing. I've been regaled with plenty of horror stories from my coworkers about their eBay experiences back in the day when there were no real rules and sellers could get away with murder and buyers had very little recourse. There absolutely needs to be much stricter vetting of sellers because otherwise you get unhappy buyers who might never come back to shop on eBay again.

That's valid. There were a ton of scammers back in the day. Like...remember the western union payments 😮 lol

wildpitchsports · ‎02-08-2022

@silverstatetreasureboxes wrote:
@glasser
Agree, whole bunch of interesting news bits on this issue came across. Here's one on the 600 club.
Open SmartNews and read "Senate GOP pushes repeal of Biden’s $600 IRS reporting rule for online payment platforms - Washington Times" here: https://share.smartnews.com/oMo8t
To read it on the web, tap here: https://share.smartnews.com/RLBVQ

Someone did a focus group and identified that the furor over this all over the internet was just getting started and are trying to score political points.

If they magically manage to repeal it - it should be a hard wake up call for everyone that sells online to get your you know what together because you won't be that lucky next time.

wildpitchsports · ‎02-08-2022

@yuzuha wrote:
@my-cottage-books-and-antiques wrote:
A lot of buyers at flea markets and craft shows don't---and won't---carry a lot of cash---and they'll continue to expect sellers to accept credit cards with their smart phone or tablet. Yes, there will still be some sellers and some locales where cash will be king, but in many places, failure to accept a credit card will be a serious competitive disadvantage. As has been proven repeatedly, buyers want convenience, and a credit card or payment app (like PayPal) is a lot more convenient than carrying a lot of cash....
Not only that, sellers much prefer CC transactions too-- it means they don't have to carry around a box of cash with them. All of my friends who sell at craft shows and artist's alleys much prefer when people pay with a card rather than cash.

The ATM is over *there* sir.