New policy and adding fees for

[pettagger]

That new policy about authenticity on jewelry sold for $500 and more.  REally??? Better hire some people that can authenticate the jewelry because you sure need them, even for more jewelry, aka costume that is cheaper.  This is just charging more fees on the seller, and not resolving a big issue of fakes being sold as real, such as Schrieiner that does sell for that much but some is not authentic, and it is starting to be faked abroad, as is well known in jewelry community for Chanel, and many many other big names in jewelry.  Remember not all jewelry has real stones that will sell for $500.   

[pettagger]

OH and rude sellers that try to sell what they have such expertise as, ID on jewelry, when those that really do the real research know better. And you are not watching that at all.  I could be hired for that!!!!!

[idealgems1]

Although I am not at all happy about increased fees, I am over the top elated about this authentication service.  I am a Graduate Gemologist trained by GIA.  Now GIA will be inspecting sales over $500 to authenticate it is what the seller purports it to be...Hallelujah!  No more will I be competing against misleading or fraudulent listings by dishonest or ignorant sellers.  

This is not without problems.  How fast can GIA do the authenticating? What about mounted gemstones where the setting precludes proper examination of the stone?  What about diamond grades that are just a LITTLE off?  Will buyers accept the tradeoff of slower delivery versus peace of mind?  What packaging do we use to get it to GIA before they then use "eBay luxury packaging"?  What is the process for protesting GIA's findings if we disagree?  What about cases where a seller relies on a certificate that is less stringent than GIA 's standards?

Still, this has the potential to grow the category.  It won't be horse trading in the wild west anymore.  You're selling it as a natural alexandrite?  It should be a natural alexandrite.  You're saying the diamond is D/VVS-1?  It had better be at least darn close.

It will be interesting to see what happens to the hundreds and hundreds of listings that I see that almost certainly misrepresent the gems.  Do they just go away?  That would be nice.  That will allow potential buyers to concentrate on listings where the seller is confident about what they are selling.

And I owe eBay an apology for publicly saying on this forum that eBay doesn't care if buyers get burned.  Looks like I had it wrong!

[flipping_treasures]

Increase in final valuation fees goes from 12.55% to 15.00% on sales upto $5,000 without a store.  With a store they go from 11.70% to 13.0%.

Bend over.

"To help fulfill our commitment to the jewelry category, final value fees* will increase for most sellers effective September 12, 2022. Learn how the final value fee changes in the Jewelry category may impact your business."

Nothing distinguishes the difference between fine and costume.  So, costume which will not have any "Authenticity Guarantee "  will be paying for the fine jewelry "Authenticity Guarantee" personnel. 

What a crock!

[jklfindings]

One section says they will be validating all details in the listing, but later it says they wont be grading anything.  I think this program is going to be aimed more at confirming natural vs synthetic stones than anything.  If I sell a diamond and state it's a Si1, and they come back with it being an Si2... what would happen?  Let 5 people from GIA grade the same diamond, and you will different results.  Then send it to EGL and get a much wider range of results... I hope eBay hasnt bitten off more than they chew with this one.

[idealgems1]

Thinking this over, I think you're right.  I think they're going to confirm  natural vs. synthetic, solid gold vs. plated, etc.  I hope if a diamond is egregiously misgraded they will  flag it as well.  One thing everyone should also know is that GIA does not place values on anything.  They don't appraise.  No one should worry about a value being placed on it that is less than a selling price.

I am hopeful this is what we need to clean up this category and allow honest sellers to compete amongst ourselves, while weeding out fraudsters and others who are too loose with their claims.

[autocro]

It will just make any jewelry of quality still sold on ebay about 5% more expensive. So right after adjusting your inventory 10-15% due to "transitory inflation" then add another 5% on top of the 15% ebay fee.

Maybe that's why nothing sells on ebay anymore since 2022.

[flipping_treasures]

You are absolutely right autocro.  The changes eBay has made over the last several months to the jewelry category beginning with the "new listing tool" and the item specifics changes, fine specifics and costume specifics meshed together, to requiring that sellers to know whether a stone on a previously owned piece of jewelry is "natural" or has had some sort of treatment, to this new "Authenticity Guarantee"  to raising the fees on costume sellers to finance the hiring of GIAs, which we will never use, for the fine jewelry sellers is just beyond the pale.  I repeat ... what a crock!  

I have this feeling that the fine sellers are not going to like this in the long run either.  I see a very bumpy road ahead for all types of jewelry sells.

[idealgems1]

I agree on the item listing specific changes, but respectfully disagree about using GIA.  For the record, though, NO ONE follows the listing rules about putting "treated" in the title.  I did, but after searching hundreds and hundreds of listings and seeing only mine showing gems as treated, I realized that I could no longer do that.  Since removing the "treated" in the title of the listings, views have gone up like crazy.  I still have full disclosure of all treatments clearly stated (twice) in the listings themselves.

As for fees increased to have GIA authenticate?  Money well spent IMHO.  Once buyers realize that they won't be out and out cheated without having to spend their own money on an appraisal or lab certificate, I think this grows the customer base.  Hopefully eBay can start advertising JEWELRY like they do AUTOMOTIVE and brag up the authentication service.  There is absolutely no reason to keep it quiet...it needs to be trumpeted from every mountain!

We all have the ability to raise our prices (or reserve, or opening bid)  2 1/2 percent.  If it means less competition from sellers who outright lie about their gems (or lie that they even know what their gems are), the better it will be for the honest sellers.

I have worked with GIA for over 40 years.  They are the industry standard; and knowledgeable jewelry buyers know that.  To have that authenticity stamp of approval on your listing will be invaluable.  That's why even as a GIA trained Graduate Gemologist, I paid to have GIA do a grading report on major diamonds I stocked.  You don't have to say, "trust me"...you say "the most respected educational institution in the gem and jewelry trade has verified this."

[flipping_treasures]

I have no problem with GIA verification of fine jewelry that is sold on eBay.  I do think there will be more opportunities of sales going down the dark rabbit holes that eBay seems to install with any "new and improved" program they implement.  As shown over the last twenty plus years that I have been around.  I don't see this being any different.  I just don't think that those people that won't be using the program should have to pay for it, and that is exactly what the new fees are about in costume jewelry.

I also think it is ridiculous to think that a person selling a ring that has been bought second hand should know whether the stone in that ring is natural or treated in some way.  They should know whether it is a stone or rhinestone and whether it is made from gold or silver vs a metal ally, I'll give you that. 

Do I think that any of the new programs that eBay is installing will prevent the scammers from scamming or the liars from lying no.  Do I think this will help the honest sellers, no.  Will it provide a more secure feeling for the buyer, maybe, but then again anyone dumb enough to buy a $5,000.00 + jewelry item on eBay without inspecting it in hand, is not too bright, in my opinion.  Will it provide eBay with a bit more protection from lawsuits, yes.  Will it give eBay more of a cut of your money after you have done all the work , OH YEAH.  And that, is really what it is all about.  Has nothing to do with honest sellers or protecting buyers, it's all about the $$$$$$.  

[flipping_treasures]

This was posted by another eBay seller on another thread.  This is a prime example of how this program worked for them and what to look forward to.

"I don't think all this jewelry is actually going direct to GIA, either. 

Most likely Gia trained jewelers at numerous jewelry stores. 

I sold an expensive watch recently, and it went to a regular watch store.  I googled the store, and found some pretty bad reviews about them, but I was stuck sending it there thanks to Ebay.  It was supposed to be sent overnight to the customer.  but it wasn't  - took them 4 days to get it after 'authenticator' checked it out.  after I had told them overnight, luckily they were pretty nice about it."

So, looks to me, based on the above, that eBay has contracted with individual GIA members from different areas to inspect your items.  In this instance, the item didn't go to eBay, but a store owner somewhere, who didn't follow through with mailing it to the customer as required.  Just one more person in the mix between the seller and the buyer, to get things wrong and the seller once again to take the blame. 

[idealgems1]

I agree that fees shouldn't go up for costume jewelry to pay for the authentication service.  And it also won't stop a liar from lying.  But if a buyer pays $1,000 for an item from a liar, but GIA saves the buyer from getting burned and the lair get reported to eBay as a liar, then the service has worked.  Maybe the liar has to find a new scam, but chances are he doesn't keep doing it in eBay fine jewelry when he knows he can't get away with it.

As for whether GIA is doing the authentication.  Logistically, a central facility, like at their Carlsbad, California campus, is the only thing that makes sense.  I can't see where sellers would be sending things to dozens of different "facilities" that are really just local shops, or that GIA would somehow send them to a jobber after they receive them.  GIA's labs in Carlsbad, New York, and other places throughout the world know how to process hundreds of items a day.  I'm pretty sure that they will use their logistical expertise along with their gemological and jewelry expertise for this service too.  At least I hope so!

[silverstatetreasureboxes]

@pettagger 

@idealgems1 

I'm sure this topic will be discussed more in e-commerce bytes as well as the forum.

     Here's what bytes has stated so far..

https://www.ecommercebytes.com/2022/07/20/ebay-expands-luxury-goods-authentication-to-new-category/

[pettagger]

Yes, I can see Ebay sending out someone to everyones home/ etc. to do the confirmation, testing, etc.  This is a ridiculous new bean counter thing Ebay has come up with, because they cannot be idle, nor can they fix what is wrong. 

[idealgems1]

Sorry for the double post; tried to edit but was too slow.  As for whether sellers should know about gem treatments, I understand that this is often advanced gemological knowledge that many jewelers don't even have.  I'm saying you shouldn't declare a gem is untreated unless you know it's untreated.  Also, just a little knowledge is easy to know.  It takes almost no time at all to research and find out that the vast majority or rubies, sapphires, and tanzanites are heat treated, that emeralds are oiled, that blue topaz is irradiated, etc.

The bottom line is disclosure.  Ebay is a forum where anyone should be able to sell anything allowable by law.  But if you don't know what a gem is, say you don't know what a gem is.  If you don't know if a gem has been treated, say you don't know if it has been treated.  My beef is with the hundreds of listings that say or imply that a gem is natural, when any knowledgeable observer can see that it most certainly is not.  And no one should have to declare a gem as "treated" in the title if unknowledgeable sellers get a free pass on having to do so.