Looking for info on this old toy model train

[holifeld]

Wanted to try and sell this but first would like to know what it is exactly. At first I thought a steam powered toy train, but that doesnt make sense as there's no steam chamber. It's pretty heavy and the wheels are pretty detailed but there's no drive years or anything to make me think it was self powered. Anyway, any ideas on what it is and what it's worth trying to sell for? Thanks

 

[mesodude]

More photos might help. If there's some writing or graphic or other distinguishing feature on the train, it could help others identify it better.

[argon38]

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@mesodude wrote:

More photos might help.

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More and brighter,  if possible.

[maxine*j]

Unfotunately, your photo is badly out of focus.  Also, shooting against the light is never a good idea for this purpose.   I hope you can provide useful photos, so people can help.

[c*me*4*lefton*info]

Only taking a quick glance, but it looks to me like it is perhaps a model of a very early (possibly British) steam engine (an 0-4-0 type engine). No enclosed cab or seat for the engineer to ride in/on is funny looking also, one reason I think it may be early. Looks to me like the front of the engine is to the left in your photo and maybe the platform on the right end is where the engineer would have stood?

Dimensions are also always helpful with unknown objects.

[lacemaker3]

Maybe it's a steam tractor, rather than a train engine?

I can't see it anywhere near clear enough to be able to tell for sure. We could really use some clear, well-lit and well-focused pictured of this. It's very interesting.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steam_tractor

[mesodude]

Case in point. I'd never heard of a steam tractor and were it not for lacemaker3's post, I would have continued looking at pages and pages of steam locomotives.

[lacemaker3]

Well, it was c*me*4*lefton*info's post pointing out what may be a small platform for the driver that made me think of a steam tractor instead of a train engine.

Also, the wheels look like the kind of steel wheels (non-pneumatic) that were used on some of these early vehicles. They look pretty large for train wheels.

[vlakap-87]

my dad was a big collector of trains. that one is not like any I have ever seen. Even the oldest pre lionel trains dont look quite like it. You could try to find a group on facebook about trains one of those guys probably knows what it is. Another suggestion is take a pic or two of it and send it to one of those train shops that is in the bigger cities like New York. Some of those guys are really experts on the stuff. It could be hand made but you need one of those train experts, maybe you have found and antiques road show or pawn stars episode huge $$$ item

[holifeld]

Sorry for the bad pictures. I should have been a little more thoughtful on that. I took some better ones, I hope. The train weighs almost 11 pounds and I didnt see any stamps or lettering to indicate a brand or name. I also wonder if it was hand painted after the fact? Thanks all for all the insight. Very helpful. I dont post hear too often so not sure if I'm replying to all so all can see or just the reply I hit reply on. Please let meknow. Thanks.

[lacemaker3]

Thanks, @holifeld, those are great pictures, and everyone can see them. You posted them correctly. 

Now I can see that the wheels are definitely designed for rails, and there's no way to steer the vehicle, so I would say it must be a train engine after all, not a steam tractor. However, it looks amazingly like some of the pictures in this catalog of steam tractors from the Henry Ford museum.

https://www.thehenryford.org/collections-and-research/digital-collections/artifact/174817/#slide=gs-...

I think this must be a model of a very early train engine, because it doesn't look like one of the more common later designs. The wheels are quite large in proportion to the overall size, which  makes me think that it might have been a very small engine, or maybe the wheels were larger than the standard size.

Hopefully a train expert, or one of the great researchers who posts here, will be able to find more info.

Could you post the measurements, please? And what is it made of -- steel? cast iron? or?

[lacemaker3]

Sorry, I ran out of edit time.  Now that the last picture has finally loaded completely, I can see the tape measure in the last picture, so it's about 12-13 inches long. 

[maxine*j]

It looks like an early steam locomotive based on one of the designs of Richard Trevithick, like this:

I cannot resist posting this, a steam carriage built on plans drawn by Trevithick:

[c*me*4*lefton*info]

The wheels are probably the best clue as to this objects intended use in real life. Flanged wheels indicate railroad . Also smooth wheels would suggest it rode on rails, not on dirt. If it was made for dirt the wheels would have to have some kind of tread or studs to get any traction.

And that thing that is on the top, within hand reach, and close to the engineers platform looks somewhat like the "throttle" for a train engine.

Pictures of the front end, back end, and bottom may help to solve some of the mystery involved here.

For the time being I am going with old, very early, steam train engine. Possibly British because much of the very early development of steam engines was going on in England.

image search from Bing dot com -

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=very+early+steam+train+locomotive&FORM=HDRSC2

[maxine*j]

Yes, I think OP's model is of a train locomotive, like Trevithick's, although I didn't make that clear.