Frauded - redirected package

[lwt89]

Wow what a whirlwind.

• No red alerts raised from the sale of my item. "Buyer" did a quick payment using buy it now. No messages exchanged.
• Received an email stating unauthorized purchase of my $1000+ item by supposed "buyer." Ebay has removed listing which I dont think does much as Ive already shipped and lost the item.
• I quickly checked the tracking, and it was redirected from the destination printed on my packging slip to 2 states away!
• I immediately called ebay to ask if they are taking my $. They said no. Fees were also refunded. I thought I was ok until....
• ....Paypal emails me that the "buyer" has opened a dispute with their financial institution of an unauthorized transaction. $1k+ withheld at paypal. Now pending investigation...

How in the world could a package with a destination printed get redirected to some other place 2 states away? How in the world are we as sellers able to protect ourselves? This is madness! Stay safe out there. And for me? *crossing my fingers. Of all the years of ebay buying and selling, this has got to be my story of the century.

[casey768]

that $1000 is the opportunity $$ which he lost.
he lost his item which is a 5 cents card.
if y ou have a cottage which cost you 50k to build,someone offers 250k but the cottage burnt down.
you lost the opportunity to sell it at 250k ,your loss is 50k.
not 250k.
try to convince IRS when reporting casualty,IRS would not allow 250k.

[casey768]

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@lwt89wrote:

is it the simplest to win? I did provide all proof that was stated.

The reason why im concerned is that ebay (not paypal) in the past has let the buyer win for "item not described" when everything that the buyer wanted but wasnt included was plainly and blatantly stated in the item descrition. Needless to say i was furious.

But this could be a different situation and im hoping thats the case.

And it still boggles my mind how someone could reroute a package midway without it ever reaching my original address.

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did you call their post office and ask how it is rerouted?

someone may have lived in that address as a tenant and then file mail forwarding with the post office.

THERE was a t ime when someone moves into an apt,the prior renter did not disconnect his phone,so when the credit card companies sent a new credit card,all the new tenant has to do is to use his phone t o confirm the card and now he has a card free to spend.

These days,you haev to do more than just using a phone,you have to talk to a rep and give out your SS number etc.  

[lwt89]

higly doubt this is the case given the facts i mentioned.

[mg152]

Any update?

[lewisburggold]

Truly sorry to hear that.  It just blows us away they can redirect the package.  Best regards

[nowthatsjustducky]

So if in my hypothetical example, the defendant had flat out stolen the $5000 card from the plaintiff's shop instead of using his CC company to steal it for him, he would only be facing a misdemeanor charge instead of a felony, because the shop owner was only out the 5 cents he paid for it decades ago and that $5000 was only the opportunity cost?

[nowthatsjustducky]

Or to look at it another way, ask yourself; at what point in the transaction does the item become the property of the buyer and the money becomes the property of the seller?

Is it at the moment the exchange is made?  If not, then after the seller receives the money and the buyer gets his item (continuing to use the $5K card for this exercise), at what point in the upcoming robbery process is the seller out only the original nickel he paid plus the card?  Is it when the buyer reaches across the counter and grabs the money and runs?  Is it perhaps that evening when the seller is heading to the bank to make the deposit and the buyer decides to roll him and get his $5K back?  Or could it be 10 years later when the buyer is finding himself hard up and decides to get his money back the old fashioned way, through breaking into the seller's home and stealing $5K from his desk or safe or wherever he may have it stashed?

If that $5K is only opportunity cost, then according to that claim, in all of those scenarios the buyer effectively only stole 5 cents from the seller.  So that said, it would seem that it is at the moment of the transaction when the card becomes the buyer's property, and the $5000 becomes the property of the owner, $5000 that is valued at $5000.  Just like if some pickpocket manages to pinch $20 out of my pocket from a sale I just made locally for an item that cost me $1, they still stole $20 from me, and not $1.

[voschette]

you sellers arent the only victims.  as a buyer i recenty was on the recieving end of what looks like the same scam.  the difference is as a buyer i dont get my package.  it see it scanned into a mail hub in a different state and zip code..and its moved to a second location in the same state.. so i have to watch the scans and wait until i can go for my refund after having nothing to do with the redirect.  paypal account looks clean in that my mail and shipping address is correct.  there are no additional shipping addresses in my profile.  i took my case to the USPS where they opened a case and closed it the same day on the premise they see it scanned in the system ..never mind  that its not in my state or city mail packaging process or delivery hubs.  to their lazy assed eyes and senses the issue is closed. that piece of mail isnt moving and still shows to be in thoset out - of - state locations for the last 4 days.  so tell me what us buyers can do other than request refunds when we dont get our packages for the same **bleep** reason?  i know this much..once i either get the recent purchases i'm expecting or am forced to ask for refunds when my packages go to bum **bleep**ed egypt, i wont be buying anything from anywhere from any company using USPS as the end package handler and delivery process.  i'll be asking any company i intend to make purchases from involving delivery which carrier they use to make sure i avoid anything to do with the USPS!!!!

[mysalonsavings]

Insurance.

[a_c_green]

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@voschette wrote:

you sellers arent the only victims.  as a buyer i recenty was on the recieving end of what looks like the same scam.  the difference is as a buyer i dont get my package.  it see it scanned into a mail hub in a different state and zip code..and its moved to a second location in the same state.. so i have to watch the scans and wait until i can go for my refund after having nothing to do with the redirect.  paypal account looks clean in that my mail and shipping address is correct. 

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At this point it's hard to tell if you're looking at a misdirected package or just some strange routing along the way, but if you're already past the last Estimated Date of Delivery, or if it now shows Delivered someplace outside of your ZIP code, just file an Item Not Received dispute. If the seller can't show a Delivered status for your package in your City and ZIP code, you will be refunded. There is no advantage for a seller to send your package to a different state and ZIP code.

[dehartauto]

Happened to me and i lost. Paypal terms state package must be delivered to shipping address. If scammer redirects and ita delivered elsewhere you are screwed and lose the money and the  items. Insurance or sig does nothing. Its the perfect scam.

[angelfishqueen]

NOT true. eBay Fraud Team shut down sellers who defrauded 3 buyers, purchased surveillance electronics, by editing shipping address, using original tracking #, and shipping/re-directing to another complicit SCAMMER. USPS sees pkg delivered, but to different State. THIS IS A FELONY., & eBay now mandates payments from buyers HELD until BUYER is satisfied with delivery.

[wesk_36]

"..Paypal emails me that the "buyer" has opened a dispute with their financial institution of an unauthorized transaction"

If this is the case, as in a credit card dispute, paypal will support the financial institution's ruling as the last word.

[glgenterprise]

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@angelfishqueen wrote:
NOT true. eBay Fraud Team shut down sellers who defrauded 3 buyers, purchased surveillance electronics, by editing shipping address, using original tracking #, and shipping/re-directing to another complicit SCAMMER. USPS sees pkg delivered, but to different State. THIS IS A FELONY., & eBay now mandates payments from buyers HELD until BUYER is satisfied with delivery.

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I don't see how this is possibly true. There are big warnings about losing seller protection if you edit the ship to address as a seller.  Unless you are the buyer and are out the money you paid for the electronics, or can point to an actual, legitimate news source reporting this, I'd be hard pressed to believe this to be anything more than someone's less than factual story.

If you really wanted to try to make this scam stick, you'd have to have it delivered to the same city and zip code to a complicit party.

Every user agreement I've ever seen says the seller has protection if they ship to the address on the sales record (and that is why it behooves a seller to check on PayPal what the shipping address is for a sale, especially a high dollar one)

In OP's case - I'd hope that a live person at PayPal would be able to see the customer requested forwarding request via USPS that OP said they have would trump the "must be delivered to the address on file" requirement. Good news is, PayPal reps in my experience tend to be capable of rational thought, rather than just reading (wrongly most of the time) from a script the way an eBay rep does.

Lastly - I also don't understand the held funds thing. Is that what you're experiencing under eBay managed payments? I'm still under PayPal, and never have funds held until delivery.  Good luck getting most buyers to confirm they are happy with delivery. Once they have their items it is usually radio silence unless they are unhappy.

If this is the case under managed payments I will resist until the last possible second being forced into managed payments. eBay can't manage basic customer service, the last thing I want is for them to have their fingers in both sides of my income.