Finally have Sales/but had to take PLs (Promoted Std) to 10-12% for ALL listings to Make it Happen

[katzrul15]

The title really says it all.

Have sales, but my PL percentages are killing me.  Played with it over and over on percentages and when I lower then to even 8%, sales stop.  At the 10-12% range, we have consistent sales.

Really dreading then the FALL update, additional fees and USPS increases.  Not certain how we (us) are going to be able to do this and remain profitable overall??  Anyone else concerned about this?

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@richard1rst wrote:

Understand that it is not my intent to provoke an argument, I am simply continuing on with my underlying theme:

“I’ve just had my brain washed and I can’t do a thing with it:”

I have an independent web site. I have NEVER paid Google any ad words or promotional fees. HOWEVER you can not imagine the sheer ecstasy of one day finding my site as line one, page one of Google search. And my picture as the first picture on line one of Google images. The explanation is rather simple. I had something no one else had. They sold out rather quickly proving that some people wanted them.

The classic success adage: Find a need and fill it.

That one, admittedly, fluke aside my independent site and my eBay listings frequently show up on page one of Google search and both my independent pictures and my eBay pictures show up in the first few rows of Google images. And by the way, NONE of my pictures have a pure white background which Google supposedly demands. Another brainwash debunked.

It does require some effort. There are sites that offer, for free, listings suggestions and other sites that offer, also for free, to review your listings and point out shortcomings. Of course for that to work people are going to have to put heir Cognitive Dissonance on hold. And for some, it seems, that is impossible.

Pay for Play may be here but I do not accept that you must join.

It’s that Groucho Marx thing again.

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It's become a high stakes poker game with only the Mega Players being able to ante in. Now a matter for everyone else to know when to walk away or know when to run. (Apologies KR moment.) Similar to how eBay explained collecting taxes from all as "levelling the playing field".

-Lotz

[monica-sells]

"...well, that s fine if what the customer types in the search (what they actually want), SHOWS UP IN THE SEARCH RESULTS. In fact, what they are seeing IS NOT what they search for. As a result, THEY SHOP ELSEWHERE...."

This statement is so very true. For the PL to work, the underlying SEARCH FUNCTION must be accurate.

[m60driver]

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@dnasilver wrote:

Why use PL when you can just start with a lower price? 

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I am currently testing the waters with PL, not at the 10% range, on the hypothesis that the younger folks buying on their cellphones do not search by price and, being somewhat impulsive shoppers, only look at so many listings before they click to make a purchase.  And I suspect that the listings Ebay shows first using their flawed search engine are promoted listings.  Anyhow, I am testing whether PLs will grab some sales more than simply lowering the price.

[dbfolks166mt]

     I am not concerned about it since I don't use PL and still make a sale now and then but I am not a huge seller. However, this is the game that is being played and I recognized it long ago and chose not to participate. As more and more people use PL those using it have to constantly increase their percentages to get an edge on the other sellers using PL. It either cuts into profit margins or sellers have to increase prices to cover the PL costs. Neither is desirable. 

     This is the prisoner's dilemma in economics. For those that are not familiar with the analogy a prisoner's dilemma is a situation where individual decision-makers (those using PL) always have an incentive (potental for increased sales) to choose in a way that creates a less than optimal outcome for the individuals as a group (all sellers).  While I don't use PL I have to hand it to eBay it was and is a BRILLIANT tactic to increase revenues and I am grateful to those who do use it since it probably keeps eBay from raising fees in other areas. I hate to think what other selling fees would be at the moment if nobody was using PL. 

     There is, in theory, a way out of the prisoner's dilemma but it requires collaboration and cooperation of all the group members and somebody will always cheat. 

[gamersbaystore]

If you don't use promoted listings, then your products wont show up on other active listing pages, only the search results. Your listings will show up on your own product pages, but not others.

You may not use promoted listings, but you also have over 11,000 listings. That being said, all of your traffic is coming from search and your listings, nowhere else.

[dbfolks166mt]

A year from now, are we going to see posts stating "I listed my items with promoted listings at 25%, and got nothing. But when I upped PL to 35%, my sales picked up big time". How far does one think eBay is going to take this? Until PL becomes a required program, starting at a certain % ?

This is the down side to PL and the prisoner's dilemma. It in essence becomes a race to the bottom at the sellers expense and eBay's gain. 

[monica-sells]

"...HOWEVER you can not imagine the sheer ecstasy of one day finding my site as line one, page one of Google search. And my picture as the first picture on line one of Google images..."

I can! It is exhilarating....it is a feeling unequalled...

beating the big guys at their own game....

It makes all the late hours worth it.......

[silverstatetreasureboxes]

@collectfest 

When I took your example of the 1960 Ford lighter, I tweaked the search a bit. A lot of sellers put the word vintage 1st, I was guilty of this also. So my search keywords were: Vintage 1960s Ford lighter zippo. When I'm using dates I add a "s" to the end. Zippo was used because that's who handled the factorys awards.

     @katzrul15 

If that promotional PLs is working right now I would stick with it for about a month, Holiday season is coming and that's when you shine!

[donsdetour]

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@katzrul15 wrote:

The title really says it all.

Have sales, but my PL percentages are killing me.  Played with it over and over on percentages and when I lower then to even 8%, sales stop.  At the 10-12% range, we have consistent sales.

Really dreading then the FALL update, additional fees and USPS increases.  Not certain how we (us) are going to be able to do this and remain profitable overall??  Anyone else concerned about this?

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pay to play seems to work for you:  If you are still making a profit of course.

[richard1rst]

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@gamersbaystore wrote:

If you don't use promoted listings, then your products wont show up on other active listing pages, only the search results. Your listings will show up on your own product pages, but not others.

You may not use promoted listings, but you also have over 11,000 listings. That being said, all of your traffic is coming from search and your listings, nowhere else.

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And the problem with that is what?

The principle of unintended consequences kicks in.

If I use PL to garner additional sales then, to remain at the same profit margin I currently enjoy, I have to raise my prices to offset the PL fees. BUT if I raise my prices then it would seem that would tend to depress the sales I am getting from search results as they would no longer be competitively priced and those sales would go to my competition. So what have I really gained?

[lloydsteventaylor]

When I didn't do pls I had no sales. Now I do pls with no limit on percent. Sometimes I get hit with 12 percent sometimes 10 now I add 10 percent to my sale price in addition to regular fees on all my listings to cover for pls . I get sales with pls buy I am paying big time. Total fees including pls are very high. 

.

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@monica-sells wrote:

"...HOWEVER you can not imagine the sheer ecstasy of one day finding my site as line one, page one of Google search. And my picture as the first picture on line one of Google images..."

I can! It is exhilarating....it is a feeling unequalled...

beating the big guys at their own game....

It makes all the late hours worth it.......

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eBay used with Google Search = Power scrolling on steroids!!

Sample recent search attempt:

"About" 331,000,000 results (0.60 seconds) 

<~~~Getting old. Need a nap after page 3. 🤣

-Lotz

[valueaddedresource]

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@richard1rst wrote:

I raise this more as a question than a solution.

I have seen many posts concerning promoted listings and the costs and percentages, etc.

I have NEVER used PL and I make sales every day.

I recently did a search for some ink cartridges I use and out of the first 100 listings only 8 were PL and they were scattered throughout not at the top where you expect them. One of them was 38th in line.

One respondent to that comment pointed out that a variety of other criteria may determine placement. The information in the title (I have seen some that were woefully missing information), the sellers reputation, the seller's proximity, the degree and completeness of the information in the listing itself (I have seen some that leave the description area virtually blank along with an absence of information in the "items specifics" field), and other info.

So I have to wonder if the idea of using PL is an idea that has been burrowed into your mind and never questioned.

Understand, I am not trying to talk you out of using PL. I am simply questioning if there are other ways to improve your exposure with paying a fee.

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@richard1rst  just doing a regular eBay search doesn't give a full picture of where Promoted Listings ads may appear and what may or may not drive click through rates on those ads.

Promoted Listings Standard ads appear in multiple places across the eBay network - search being just one. Where most of the *on* eBay impressions come from is actually when the ads are displayed on listing pages, not the search results page.

For a fun experiment, take a look at a listing page while not logged in to eBay and in an incognito browser window with ad blockers disabled - my recent research has shown an average of 94 ad slots on the listing page (most of the ad modules scroll, so there may be 12-24 ads spots for each module).

On top of that, most sellers are also opted in to external promoted listings, where your listings enrolled in a PL Standard campaign may be shown on Google, Bing, and other external search engines or sites.

Your suggestions for doing a basic listing quality audit are good too, but for many sellers it really has just become a fact that they have to use Promoted Listings to get any kind of visibility which hopefully leads to sales.

[simply-the-best-for-you]

No time to read all the responses now, but I experimented quite a bit when PL's first came out.  Initially without much success.  I learned pretty quickly that for me, I had to have ALL or nearly all of my listings Promoted to see great results.  Just having a few or 1 category, never did it for me.  Once I did all of them, that's when my sales became great.  

As for the percentages, that really is so dependent on category.  I sell in a super saturated category, so I have to use pretty high rates.   I justify it pretty easily b/c it almost tripled my sales, so it's responsible for so many more sales that I would not get if I didn't use PL's.   

That said, we're still in the late Summer doldrums, some kids are just starting school now & this is SUCH a slow time of year between, BTS, everyone & their brother cramming in last minute vacations & waiting for the season change.  At least in clothing, this is always the slowest time of year.  The calendar says September, which we associate with Fall, but much of the US is still getting record breaking heat, so people aren't ready to buy Fall, but they don't need more Summer clothing.  Usually things pick up again in a few weeks.   That said, I am concerned about the lack of sales this Summer, it was slower than usual & it's hard to remain optimistic 🤔

[collectfest]

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@femmefan1946 wrote:

I consistently have used one percent (and now two percent) for PL.

I found that my Views jumped.

Now that eBay has dropped counting bot views and only counts monthly, my Views have dropped but not to where I recall them being.

Anecdote is NOT data.

What does seem to happen is that when I have a Promoted Listings, I get more sales, but not necessarily on the PL listings.

It's like the milkshakes are bringing to boys to the yard, and then they are ordering a banana split.

I did see a seller a month or so ago say that she had dropped her previous system of heavily discounting  slow moving items in favour of PL at half the percentage she would have discounted.

So if she normally would have discounted by 20%, instead she would use PL at 10%.  (She may have been factoring in that the PL fee applies to the entire payment.)

The idea being that her items would be more prominent in Search.

No idea how it turned out. I'd love to see her results.

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What I have been doing is about 3% on a few items. My question, with your experience with PL's, do you think it MAY be better to do it on ALL my listings with PL even if 1% instead of just a few ?  Not setting you up LOL, I just have little positive experience with PL's but admit I've never committed to trying it full throttle.  

I should add I am referring to vintage items if that makes any difference. Thanks in advance