Feedback extortion system

[tonyjones]

I've been a member here since 1998.   Buyer and seller.   100% +ve feedback.

I recently purchased 3 items (one listing) where one was SNAD.     The seller admitted they should not have specified it was "in excellent condition".  Yet they refused to correct the issue.  I was very surprised.  

I told them I'd give them a final chance to make things right before I left feedback,  they told me if I left negative feedback they would report me for "feedback extortion".

I did leave negative feedback.   Within 5 minutes of leaving it I had an email from eBay "eBay policy breach: Feedback Extortion; the feedback you left has been removed".

I contacted eBay customer service and amazingly got someone who seemed competent.  Without me ever asking they told me they had reviewed the messages between the seller and I and informed me that my feedback was legitimate, the sellers report was invalid and they were filing a case to have the feedback reinstated and I'd hear back within 24/48 hours.  

Of course 5 days have passed and I've heard nothing.   I contacted them again today,  this time the agent was not so good.  They muttered something about the case being "pending" but they were so unsure of what they were saying I wasn't going to rely on it.

They did press me to file a case.  They filed it on my behalf requesting a return but in the text they said I wanted a partial refund for the one item that was SNAD.   They assured me the seller would issue the refund. 

I told them this was unlikely based on their intransigence.

Shortly after I get an email "The seller has asked eBay Customer Service to review this case and make a final decision" followed 5 minutes later by an inexplicable message saying:

"You were issued a refund. We understand that you have returned your item because it wasn't as expected. We've issued you a refund for both purchase price and the shipping costs.  There was concern that this item was returned to the seller in a different condition than how it was shipped. As a courtesy for this case, you have been issued a full refund by eBay. For future returns please ensure that the item is returned in same condition as it was received"

So was the seller dinged for this?  I find it hard to believe eBay covered the cost.   

This message is so bizarre as clearly nothing was returned.   I continue to be amazed at eBay as when you think about it most disputes must fall into a couple of dozen groupings.   It's not rocket science yet their agents make it feel like it is.

[tonyjones]

I didn't really ask a question 🙂

I'm curious as to the speed of the original feedback removal.  It happened so soon after I left the feedback that I don't see how it was reviewed by any human.

I get the feeling this wasn't the sellers first rodeo in terms of killing negative feedback in this manner.

[this*old*attic]

“Feedback extortion” for expressing the fact that true ratings will be given for an annoying experience has always been a stretch for me. It’s no different than sellers putting a note in ones purchase “please give positive feedback.” It’s like claiming that “you’ll go to jail if you shoplift” is legal extortion.

On the latter, either your seller double worked the system or the EBay bots sent the wrong email. Your refund might be the best you’re going to get. Move on for the sake of your peace of mind.

[luckythewinner]

a) The message is "bizarre" because it is likely a cut-and-paste from a template. 

b) IMHO your message was feedback extortion. An implied threat is still a threat, and I am glad someone at eBay was (at least briefly) willing to call it what it is. 

c) When he refused to make it right the first time, you either file a case and win it, leave feedback, or both.  There is no need to announce your intentions or give ultimatums. 

[slippinjimmy]

I have to ask.........

Why didn't you open a Not As Described claim? That would be the proper way to handle this type of situation. You would have been fully refunded and perhaps get to keep the item as well.

Instead you made a (mild as these things go) threat of negative feedback.

[downunder-61]

I've been a member here since 1998.   Buyer and seller.   100% +ve feedback.

I've been a member here since 1868 and I know what feedback extortion looks like, and that message was it.

[tonyjones]

@downunder-61 

I think it's probably wise to read the actual policy.   "Buyers aren't allowed to use threats of negative feedback or low detailed seller ratings to try to get something that wasn't part of the original listing" 

Clearly the item, in the condition described, is part of the listing (contract).

@slippinjimmy 

Yes, I should have.   I'm used to just informally reaching out to sellers in situations like this,  without having to resort to opening a case, and them taking care of it.

@this*old*attic "Move on for the sake of your peace of mind".    I'm not going to pursue it.    I was just curious as I like to know how eBay works,  in case I ever run into the situation (as a seller).     I was asking due to the speed of the removal, I get the impression eBay is letting certain sellers just auto-nuke feedback they don't like.

[slippinjimmy]

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@tonyjones wrote:

@slippinjimmy 

Yes, I should have.   I'm used to just informally reaching out to sellers in situations like this,  without having to resort to opening a case, and them taking care of it.

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There was a time (and you were around here then) where that was either the only way or the best way to handle these situations. Things of changed (a lot), today going around the eBay system for returns/disputes is suspicious right from the get go. Also unfortunately there are a minority of sellers who don't have the skills to handle disputes on their own and thus the official procedures have evolved over the years to be really the only way to handle things.

[albertabrightalberta]

@tonyjones 

Not only was your message to the seller feedback extortion but there's at least one other instance in which the seller implies that you tried to blackmail him. Unfortunately, that feedback you left wasn't removed and the back and forth is there for all to see. 

I get the impression that you're a difficult customer.

[this*old*attic]

@tonyjones

Look at that. My opinion is fact. LOLOLOLOL 

Getting EXACTLY WHAT IS IN THE LISTING is hardly extra, is it?

Love it.

[this*old*attic]

Perhaps. Or maybe not.

[coolections]

Too long of an intro in to your problem. I did get to where you basically extorted the seller thus the reason for the feedback removal. You say your have been on Ebay for 20 years and did not know that all you needed to do is file a not as described claim ?  It would have guaranteed your refund and you could have left feedback without going into details. Live nd learn.

[soh.maryl]

Wow -- member since  1868. LOL.

[downunder-61]

Yup, I was in a silly mood 😗 and everyone seems to think how long they have been here is so important, like nothing has changed in all those years LOL

[d-k_treasures]

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@downunder-61 wrote:

I've been a member here since 1998.   Buyer and seller.   100% +ve feedback.

I've been a member here since 1868 and I know what feedback extortion looks like, and that message was it.

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With a wi-fi enabled chalkboard in the one room schoolhouse?