Complaining

[mpanger]

The Buyer emailed me: 

I just got the 3 burner stove, It has a goofy leg that replaced the correct one and also all 3 knobs are cracked Plus someone cut off the stops on the gas valves so they spin 360* and do not have a stop point. I have not put in any comments on ebay until I hear from you. I know there was a replacement leg on ebay but I am not sure of the cost.
Please advise. On the good side you packed it very well!
Jim

I instructed him:  Sorry Jim that you are not happy with the burner. My ad did point out the three legs and that it was not perfect:

 This is a vintage Griswold #203 three-burner gas stove and has been in storage for years. It has porcelain handles which move freely and are not frozen. In used condition, has rust, dust, scratches, etc from years or use. It has not been tested. Three of the legs are marked 1834. It is also marked PAT 1833. See pictures for details. Please ask questions before bidding. Check my feedback and bid with confidence.

 I do offer returns if you are not happy. Please pack it as well as I did and use the same service.

In addition I wrote: 
I forgot to add in my previous email that I will refund the $110 once I have received it.

Again, I apologize if you are disappointed.

I don't feel I misled at all.  I instructed clearly to ask questions before bidding.  I have not yet heard back from him.  I feel he is looking for a reason to return or a discount.  I left positive feedback but after his nonsense I would probably change it.  This was my father's burner and with regard to the cut valves my dad didn't even know what he was talking about.

He implied that I deceived him and I don't feel I did.  I take that very personally.  He has not responded to me about his intentions.  Is there something I can do to protect myself?

I am more than willing to refund his payment for the stove but he should pay the shipping costs to return it to me. 

Thoughts?

[copper.boom]

@mpanger Sounds like this buyer is fishing for a partial refund to cover the cost of the extra leg. You've handled this well so far. Stick firm to "return for refund" and stay professional.

I will add that your listing should have stated in the item condition field "for parts, not working" since you were unable to test the unit. Putting in the listing that it is untested will not protect you from a SNAD claim if the unit doesn't work unless the item is listed with the proper condition.

You do not have enough photos in your listing to show the legs, but it appears that the leg on right and left are different. And I have no idea about the stops on the gas valves, sorry. Buyer may have valid claims here...

If buyer opens a SNAD claim then you will need to pay the return shipping whether the buyer is right or wrong.

If the buyer escalates this and you need advice on how to handle please come back and we can help with any questions you have.

[thenobletuckylife]

Evening,

It is very difficult these days to sell used untested items here at ebay and this may be just one of those items that should not have been listed.

I also think that you have hurt yourself in resolving this by chiding your buyer, I know it wouldn't sit well with me.

If you truly sold a used item...did not test it...and then the tester , i.e. the buyer did it for you then why are you chiding him? Humble pie tastes a lot better than vinegar.

Mr C

[herway]

I do not see anywhere on your auction listing stating this has a replacement leg, or that the knobs were cracked or that the original pieces had been cut.

Buyer does have a case for item not as described. You must list ALL flaws of items you list. Obviously this has a couple of major flaws. You did not disclose the extent of the flaws, so this item is not as described. This is a rather pricey item, shipping fee was also not cheap. If I were the buyer, having paid this much for this item, I would open a case for item not as described--and ask for seller to pay return shipping. AND, I would win the case.

In the future, you should consider revealing all flaws and even show photos of the flaws. If you do not, you will have an unhappy buyer.

Just my own humble opinion.

[mpanger]

I appreciate the feedback. I have contacted the buyer. I don't sell often enough and the lesson was learned.

[copper.boom]

Glad to hear, MP. We are all human and make mistakes. Owning up to them is important. A lot of eBay is learn as you go and you can only hope that your hardest learned lessons are on low value items. Hope this won't deter you from selling!

[castlemagicmemories]

Actually it is refreshing that someone has taken responsibility for their mistakes.

It seems  a lot of people prefer to call posters names, deny, argue, then angrily leave the thread after announcing everyone is stupid, or ask the moderator to close the thread.  Or loudly insist on answers, but only want ones that support their thinking.

Bravo, OP!  There is a saying, if we don't learn from our mistakes, we are doomed to repeat them, and I have often seen this play out in real life.

[retrose1]

OP, a couple of other quick lessons about selling on ebay....

Do NOT list or sell anything that is not perfect or nearly so.

Do not take offers.  Once the buyer knows that you are willing to negotiate, they will continue to do so after they get the item.

Always say return for refund.  And stick to it.   No partial refunds.  In your case, they already got a deal by making an offer that you accepted.  You might as well just refund them the rest of the money.

If the buyer files a case, say return for refund and send an ebay return ship label.   If you don't, ebay will always find for the buyer and the seller will be out the item and the original ship cost.

Your listing mentions 3 legs but does not say one was replaced.  I do not know cast iron, but if your buyer does, then they might know that an unmarked leg is a replaced one.  

[tunicaslot]

As others have said - we appreciate you owning to the fact that the item may have been presented a bit better.

When I first started selling here - few had cameras to take pictures - buyers bought based on the description we wrote only - so you had to describe it as best you could - noting size, shape, condition, flaws ect.

To this day - if an item has a flaw, defect ect... - not only do I take close up pictures but describe it in the description body as well as the condition description box as well to cover my butt.

Best to you with continued sellng ventures - feel free to come here to ask advice, partake in the companionship or have us view any further listings. Sometimes you think you've covered it all but another set of eyes - may see something that needs to be added to your description - to make the description more complete or even to enhance it so that you may sell it for more than you're asking.

[siayan]

This is one of those areas where you are selling a rusty old thing and the buyer is buying a rare collectible. People who want perfection should buy from reputable Griswold dealers (and pay more). 

If it were me I would fish for how much to make it right, it may be less then you think or negotiable. Maybe less then the $30 return shipping rate.  

[retrose1]

If the buyer emailed instead of filing a case or return request, they are usually fishing for a partial.  Just about every single time I have sent back - I am sorry you are unhappy, please return for a full refund - I never hear from them again.

[pinkrose442savings2018]

---

@mpanger wrote:

The Buyer emailed me: 

I just got the 3 burner stove, It has a goofy leg that replaced the correct one and also all 3 knobs are cracked Plus someone cut off the stops on the gas valves so they spin 360* and do not have a stop point. I have not put in any comments on ebay until I hear from you. I know there was a replacement leg on ebay but I am not sure of the cost.
Please advise. On the good side you packed it very well!
Jim

I instructed him:  Sorry Jim that you are not happy with the burner. My ad did point out the three legs and that it was not perfect:

 This is a vintage Griswold #203 three-burner gas stove and has been in storage for years. It has porcelain handles which move freely and are not frozen. In used condition, has rust, dust, scratches, etc from years or use. It has not been tested. Three of the legs are marked 1834. It is also marked PAT 1833. See pictures for details. Please ask questions before bidding. Check my feedback and bid with confidence.

 I do offer returns if you are not happy. Please pack it as well as I did and use the same service.

In addition I wrote: 
I forgot to add in my previous email that I will refund the $110 once I have received it.

Again, I apologize if you are disappointed.

I don't feel I misled at all.  I instructed clearly to ask questions before bidding.  I have not yet heard back from him.  I feel he is looking for a reason to return or a discount.  I left positive feedback but after his nonsense I would probably change it.  This was my father's burner and with regard to the cut valves my dad didn't even know what he was talking about.

He implied that I deceived him and I don't feel I did.  I take that very personally.  He has not responded to me about his intentions.  Is there something I can do to protect myself?

I am more than willing to refund his payment for the stove but he should pay the shipping costs to return it to me. 

Thoughts?

---

Many apps buyer's don't read the description's...this would be a area where eBay could have a yellow bell on the apps...to alert buyer's to read full descriptions...in this fast drone...moving shipping it's the lest of to do things to help the seller's out...

[herway]

This was a seller error. There is no gray area in who is at fault, it is not the buyer.

ALL damage should be listed in the CONDITION box when listing. Doing so, is the seller's only protection against SNAD cases.

Seller's that practice concealing damage, (NOT saying the original OP does this, they have admitted this was a lesson learned), will eventually have many negative feedbacks.

Seller's that do conceal damage, should be prepared to accept returns and pay return shipping. OR, be prepared to do partial refunds. THIS SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED, "buyer fishing for a refund".

Seller's should not be able to sell damaged merchandise willy nilly around the internet. Honesty is the best policy for long term business. Just think if you spent $140.00 on a very damage item, you would be upset.

Just my own humble opinion.