Buyer is making a false return request that product was damaged in shipping

[flarngusa]

Hi everybody,

I've been selling on eBay for some years now and never ran into a situation like this one before.

To begin with, my listing was for a Dell laptop with the Buy It Now/Best Offer option.  After negotiating an acceptable price back and forth, the buyer gave me an amount in which I gladly accepted.

A certain number of days went by and...no payment.  I opened an unpaid item case.  Again, several days later, and still not a peep.  Shortly before I was about to close the case, I finally received the total amount via PayPal.  I promptly shipped the product to them after the holiday weekend.

Upon receipt, barely two hours after it was delivered by USPS, I get a notification for a return request from eBay.

After reviewing the options on how to settle the problem, I noticed the person uploaded a photo of a completely different laptop model other than what was sold to them (some standard Google image of a broken Dell laptop screen).  It was so blatantly obvious because the laptop itself looked as though it had shrunk during shipment.

Of course, instead of disputing it which would have inevitably led to me giving them a full reimbursement anyhow, I offered to accept a refund provided they send it back to me first (I'm guessing eBay will issue them a shipping label and bill me for it).  From what I understand, getting into a heated argument would have gotten me nowhere.  It seems as though eBay tends to side with the buyer, even if the seller is clearly in the right.

My main concerns are the following:

1.  What if the buyer intentionally breaks the monitor and/or removes parts before returning it?  That may very well happen just to make sure I cannot resell it under any circumstances.

2.  What if they actually return something different other than what was purchased?

3.  What do I do about possible negative feedback?

I'm assuming the buyer is just a con artist.  They probably expected me to believe the picture and just give them a full refund, writing it off as a loss.  If it was inexpensive, then I wouldn't have cared, but the total including shipping came out to $82.70.

Other than blocking the person from purchasing any future items, I may have to bite the bullet on this one.  I neglected to insure the package.  My only proof is some random image the buyer uploaded to eBay as part of the return request.

I will keep everybody posted on what occurs during the process.  As of now, they have until January 29, 2018 to make a decision.

[emerald40]

My main concerns are the following:

1. What if the buyer intentionally breaks the monitor and/or removes parts before returning it? That may very well happen just to make sure I cannot resell it under any circumstances.

2. What if they actually return something different other than what was purchased?

3. What do I do about possible negative feedback?

I'm assuming the buyer is just a con artist. They probably expected me to believe the picture and just give them a full refund, writing it off as a loss. If it was inexpensive, then I wouldn't have cared, but the total including shipping came out to $82.70.

Other than blocking the person from purchasing any future items, I may have to bite the bullet on this one. I neglected to insure the package. My only proof is some random image the buyer uploaded to eBay as part of the return request.

________________________________________________________

In answer to 1, 2, 3

If the buyer breaks it and then sends it back or just sends you back a rock - you have to refund,

And they can give you negative feedback to boot - and ebay will say it is their opinion.

Unfortunately, you have to send return shipping label, and upon receipt of any item - refund him.

Computers and smart phones just seem to attrack the worst of the worst on ebay.

[campesinoplastic2014]

If you are in the business of stealing electronic items, you couldn't ask for a better place to set up shop than Ebay.

[flarngusa]

Unfortunately, you have to send return shipping label, and upon receipt of any item - refund him.

________________________________________________________

Seeing as how I've never done this before, how would I go about sending the buyer a return shipping label? Doesn't seem to be an option anywhere on eBay or PayPal.

I did forget to mention that my listing had 14-day returns and buyer must pay shipping. Though, I do remember reading something prior to accepting a refund and being billed for a label.

Seems like the details of a return request are kinda vague.

[ed8108]

Perhaps you can request that the return be held at your local post office, & open the return package in the presence of a USPS employee.

[tellmemama · Accepted solution]

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@flarngusa wrote:
Unfortunately, you have to send return shipping label, and upon receipt of any item - refund him.

________________________________________________________

Seeing as how I've never done this before, how would I go about sending the buyer a return shipping label? Doesn't seem to be an option anywhere on eBay or PayPal.

I did forget to mention that my listing had 14-day returns and buyer must pay shipping. Though, I do remember reading something prior to accepting a refund and being billed for a label.

Seems like the details of a return request are kinda vague.

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From what I gather the buyer opened a return request already?  If so, what kind was it?  I'm guessing it was a SNAD (significantly not as described) return since they sent a picture of a broken screen (not of your computer though). 

I would check the resolution center and find the case.  If there is in fact an open request for SNAD, it is in your best interest to approve the return.  After you do that, you have the option to issue the buyer a return label through eBay which will be charged to you when the buyer uses it.  When the tracking shows it has been returned to you, you refund.  Whether it's the same condition you sent it to the buyer or not.

You don't want to ignore these cases because if you let eBay step in to settle it, you will get the worst defect on your account for being an unresponsive seller.  Just a couple of those can get you suspended.

As far as your own return policy goes, once the buyer claims SNAD, it's all out the window.  Now you have to play by eBay's rules.  The buyer has 30 days to open a SNAD claim and you are required to pay the return shipping and refund in full.   And on PAYPAL the buyer has 180 days to open a case. 

But at least on PAYPAL the buyers are required to pay return shipping.

[flarngusa]

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@tellmemama wrote:

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From what I gather the buyer opened a return request already?  If so, what kind was it?  I'm guessing it was a SNAD (significantly not as described) return since they sent a picture of a broken screen (not of your computer though). 

I would check the resolution center and find the case.  If there is in fact an open request for SNAD, it is in your best interest to approve the return.  After you do that, you have the option to issue the buyer a return label through eBay which will be charged to you when the buyer uses it.  When the tracking shows it has been returned to you, you refund.  Whether it's the same condition you sent it to the buyer or not.

You don't want to ignore these cases because if you let eBay step in to settle it, you will get the worst defect on your account for being an unresponsive seller.  Just a couple of those can get you suspended.

As far as your own return policy goes, once the buyer claims SNAD, it's all out the window.  Now you have to play by eBay's rules.  The buyer has 30 days to open a SNAD claim and you are required to pay the return shipping and refund in full.   And on PAYPAL the buyer has 180 days to open a case. 

But at least on PAYPAL the buyers are required to pay return shipping.

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Right, the buyer opened a return request a little over two hours after it had been delivered via USPS earlier today, Monday, January 22nd.  They claimed it "arrived damaged".

I selected the option of accepting a return, and having eBay give them a shipping label instead of providing my own, even though the e-mail states:

"If you can't send a label by Jan 25, 2018, we may send the buyer a return shipping label and charge it to your monthly invoice."

The most I see is that I provided return information as far as the case is concerned.  I suppose a return label will be given to them on the date above.

[campesinoplastic2014]

Ebay won't care what is in that box, even if the USPS opens it in the presence of the Attorney General

[flarngusa]

Just wanted to let you know the buyer wound up shipping back a different model laptop than what was sold to them. It looked like some broken-down hunk of junk they purchased at a flea market. They also had a false name and return address on the Priority Mail box it was shipped in.

I went ahead and refunded their money. I can't prove they returned something different. I'm afraid eBay will side with the buyer in this instance.

Thank you for your help.

[richards*rock*collection]

If they returned other than what you sent, why in the world did you refund them? Now ebay cant help you, you should not have refunded, and reported to ebay that you did not get the same item back, ebay would have stood behind you.

[richards*rock*collection]

If you took good pictures of the item when you listed it, it would have been easy to prove you got a different item returned to you, why do you think ebay would not honor your claim, now that you refunded this thief buyer, ebay can't help you, so sad, regards, learn from this.

[ittybitnot]

If they returned other than what you sent, why in the world did you refund them? Now ebay cant help you, you should not have refunded, and reported to ebay that you did not get the same item back, ebay would have stood behind you.

As stated previously.  eBay does not care at all what is in the box.  The buyer can send back ANYTHING, even an empty box and the seller has to refund.  If the seller does not do it in time, ebay will take the seller's money anyway and give it back to the buyer.  The seller then gets a "case without seller resolution" defect against their account as well.   Though I am not certain, I  seem to recall you are allowed two of these per year. 

This is what ebay calls a "faulty return" and considers it "part of doing business on the net".  It seems, however, this is most prevalent on ebay since their business model allows them to confiscate the seller's money. 

[tellmemama]

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wrote:
Just wanted to let you know the buyer wound up shipping back a different model laptop than what was sold to them. It looked like some broken-down hunk of junk they purchased at a flea market. They also had a false name and return address on the Priority Mail box it was shipped in.

I went ahead and refunded their money. I can't prove they returned something different. I'm afraid eBay will side with the buyer in this instance.

Thank you for your help.

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I'm really sorry but not at all surprised to hear this.  Unlike what another poster said, there was no way to avoid issuing the refund without either doing it yourself or having eBay step in and doing it for you while giving you an unresponsive seller defect for good measure.  And those defects are account killers.

Now.  Here's what I would do next:

• Report the buyer to eBay for everything you can (especially for misuse of MBG and abusing returns).  The report buyer  button can be found in the listing, on the feedback page, or in the resolution center.  Each violation should be filed separately.
• file a mail fraud claim with USPS because the buyer definitely commited fraud by switching out your item for his broken one and using the mail system to do it.  Get a report number.
• file a claim with IC3 (internet fraud).  Get a claim number.
• File a police report with your local jurisdiction.  They won't do anything and may be reluctant to take it but you want to get it on file.  Get a report number.
• File a police report with the buyer's jurisdiction.  You can do this over the phone.  Again, they may not want to do it but tell them you need it for filing an appeal with eBay.  And depending on the value of the item, the buyer could actually be guilty of a felony.  Which is particularly important if he already has a less than spotless history.  Get the report number.

After you have done everything above, contact eBay by phone and ask to appeal the decision.  Keep it simple:  "I sold and shipped laptop A to the buyer, he sent photos of damage to laptop B and proceeded to return laptop B."

They may not be receptive until you provide all of the report numbers you have obtained.  This extra effort tends to prove you have been defrauded and will not roll over and take it.  There is zero chance the buyer will have the refund taken away but it's possible they will refund you out of their own pocket and it puts the buyer on eBay's radar.  If they don't, you can also file a report against eBay with the Better Business Bureau.

Oh, and block the buyer so hard his mommy cries.

[hafoster]

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@flarngusa@  wrote:
They also had a false name and return address on the Priority Mail box it was shipped in.

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Does this mean that your buyer paid for their own return label --

instead of using the label you had eBay issue to them?

[flarngusa]

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wrote:

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@flarngusa@  wrote:
They also had a false name and return address on the Priority Mail box it was shipped in.

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Does this mean that your buyer paid for their own return label --

instead of using the label you had eBay issue to them?

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I'm assuming so since the actual shipping label does not have eBay on it.  The From/To was also handwritten on the Medium Flat Rate box.